Dry weight vrs actual weight

[sandy43]

When Keystone list dry weight and pin weight, does that include all accessaries like appliances, table and chairs, couch, etc.. ?
Sandy

[Tbos]

It is my understanding it does. I believe it doesn't include the propane.

[PARAPTOR]

X2 Think it is "as is" off the factory assemble line, Batteries not included

[Ken / Claudia]

It used to be no water, no batteries, no propane. Than add dealer additions like awnings, side toppers, better mattress etc.

[chuckster57]

It used to be no water, no batteries, no propane. Than add dealer additions like awnings, side toppers, better mattress etc.


AFAIK, that's still the case. Cruiser brand used to have a label by the entry door with actual scale weight as it left the assembly line and the signature of the person who weighed it. Haven't seen them lately.

[CWSWine]

The weight on the website is a average weight of 5ers leaving the factory. With most of the storage forward of the axles the dry pin weight goes up fast. My 5er with a factory scale weighing of my 5er when it left the factory and it was 2390 lbs pin weight but after loading the basics for week long trip the pin weight on the Cat sales was just over 3100 lbs with 1350 lbs loaded over the UVW weight.

Since some of these seem like they are way off the only way to know for sure is to pay the 10 bucks and pull onto a CAT scale get weighted. Takes about 10 minutes and gives you a piece of mind knowing for sure where you are at. You have to have correct information to make a intelligent decision if you being safe or not.

[sandy43]

When weighing, do you put the trailer wheels on the back (larger) scale and the truck on the front scale? Seems their might be a middle scale, can't remember. I did this a while back, forgot exactly the best way to weigh. A quick refresher course would be nice. Thanks
Sandy

[CWSWine]

If you pull on to the scales with the drives door even with the intercom you probably be setup right. There are three platforms and you should get three weights - Front Axle - rear Axle - Trailer Axle. If you add the two truck axles together they should e less than your trucks GVWR which is probably 11,500 for most F350's. The trucks rear axle weight should be less than your truck rear axle ratings and rear tire ratings. You will also be able to tell if you are within your GVCWR by adding all three together. IF you want the weight of the 5er and the pin weight you will have to weigh you truck with all passengers, full tank of fuel and all the stuff you carry when traveling without the 5er hooked up. Then little math can yield pin weight and 5er weight.

[gearhead]

The problem, or one of the problems, for prospective buyers is obviously the dealer isn't going to let you hitch it up and take it to the scale. The fact that the pin weight is 800-1,000# over what is advertised catches a lot of folks by surprise. I can't imagine a dealer weighing it themselves. Although someone should, the factory or dealer.

[CWtheMan]

When Keystone list dry weight and pin weight, does that include all accessaries like appliances, table and chairs, couch, etc.. ?
Sandy

Keystone actually refers to their trailers dry weight as shipping weight. By regulation it includes the basic RV and all factory installed options. It also includes the full weight of the propane system including full propane tanks.

Any options added by the dealer with a combined weight over 100# will require the dealer to correct the cargo placard. That's also better explained in the regulation. Type 571.120 into your search engine. It's all explained in that numbered document for RVs 10K and above. For less than 10K look at 571.110.

The Keystone published hitch/pin weights are a product of the building standards they must follow. When that weight is added to the total weight of the trailer's GAWRs the sum must equal or exceed the trailer's GVWR. When you purchase the trailer you become totally responsible for all subsequent hitch/pin weights. All of Keystone's fivers have published pin weights of about 15% of GVWR.

On edit: All of that is true for trailers 2007 and newer. That's when the current rules were approved.

[JRTJH]

The above is true for the US market, but Canadian trailers are certified and labeled differently. In the Keystone Owner's Manual you'll find this:

"UVW (Unloaded Vehicle Weight) The weight of this trailer as manufactured at the factory. It includes all weight at the trailer’s axle(s) and hitch. If applicable, it also includes full generator fluids, fuel, engine oil and coolants.

CCC (Cargo Carrying Capacity) U.S.-Equal to GVWR minus the UVW and LP gas weight. (Water is considered a component of cargo)
Canada-Equal to GVWR minus the UVW, full fresh (potable) water weight (including the water heater) and full LP gas weight."

Essentially, in the US, fresh water is considered cargo and is not included in the trailer "unladen weight". In Canada, it is considered "part of the trailer" and is calculated as a component of the trailer, just like the propane, air conditioner, furniture, etc.

In the example shown in the Owner's Manual, the "US trailer" has a cargo capacity of 1721 kg (with a note that a full load of water weighs 249 kg). The same trailer in Canada has a cargo capacity of 1545 kg (with a note that the water weighs 204 kg (cold) and 45 kg (hot) for a total water weight of 249 kg. In Canada, the total "waste water weight" is also on the certification label, in this example, it's listed as "MASS OF WASTE WATER TANKS FULL: 545 KG"

The waste water weight is not included on the US version.

It may seem like trivia, but depending on where you live, there could be a significant "misunderstanding" on how much cargo you can carry if you're reading the label certification from another country.

[66joej]

Very interesting stuff as usual John. Thanks

[CWtheMan]

The above is true for the US market, but Canadian trailers are certified and labeled differently. In the Keystone Owner's Manual you'll find this:

"UVW (Unloaded Vehicle Weight) The weight of this trailer as manufactured at the factory. It includes all weight at the trailer’s axle(s) and hitch. If applicable, it also includes full generator fluids, fuel, engine oil and coolants.

CCC (Cargo Carrying Capacity) U.S.-Equal to GVWR minus the UVW and LP gas weight. (Water is considered a component of cargo)
Canada-Equal to GVWR minus the UVW, full fresh (potable) water weight (including the water heater) and full LP gas weight."

Essentially, in the US, fresh water is considered cargo and is not included in the trailer "unladen weight". In Canada, it is considered "part of the trailer" and is calculated as a component of the trailer, just like the propane, air conditioner, furniture, etc.

In the example shown in the Owner's Manual, the "US trailer" has a cargo capacity of 1721 kg (with a note that a full load of water weighs 249 kg). The same trailer in Canada has a cargo capacity of 1545 kg (with a note that the water weighs 204 kg (cold) and 45 kg (hot) for a total water weight of 249 kg. In Canada, the total "waste water weight" is also on the certification label, in this example, it's listed as "MASS OF WASTE WATER TANKS FULL: 545 KG"

The waste water weight is not included on the US version.

It may seem like trivia, but depending on where you live, there could be a significant "misunderstanding" on how much cargo you can carry if you're reading the label certification from another country.

I don’t see the relevance here. There are no CDNs posting in this thread. To my knowledge, Keystone does not build trailers in accordance with CDN CSA Z240 RV series regulations. All imports into the USA must comply with USA certification regulations.

CDNs bringing RV trailers into this country would still have to maintain their home country certifications. Some of the CDN provinces have strict vehicle inspections.

[66joej]

Actually a lot of RV manufacturers build units for the Canadian market to our standards. Not sure if the standards are much different than those in the US. As a note there are more than 400 RV dealers across the country that sell 1000s of new units annually.