Powerstroke 6.7 shuddering/ low power issue

[Cyncwby]

I was reading on Powerstroke.org about some members having a hell of a time with thier new trucks. Most of them '15 models with very low miles. Pretty much after the regen cycle the engine starts "shuddering" and loses lots of power for a few minutes.

There's like 30 pages of this stuff .... and the kicker is Ford knows about it but can't fix it till spring of '16 due to clearing a new emmisions program through the EPA. As one might expect these guys who shelled $60-70 grand are royally pissed and are hiring lawyers, trying to use the lemon law, etc.

So, being that I've been looking into getting a '16 crew cab dually in the spring, have any of you 6.7 guy's experienced this and what happened.....if anything? thanks, Dave

[Larry1013]

You have to remember that forums list problems that might affect a few people/trucks out of the 1000's in service. It gets magnified on the forums by the few. So, don't let the irate few, sway your judgement. I have a 2015 with 19,000 miles and have not had any issues with the engine/drive train.

My only problem has been the dually fenders rubbing the bed when the 5'r is hitched and scuffing the paint on the bed.

My understanding is the order window will open for the 2017 around April or May of next year.

[gearhead]

I have a recurring problem with my 6.7. It will occasionally lose power. Just for a second or two. I took it to my dealer and they said there was recall for it and they would re-flash the computer. I received the Ford recall card in the mail a few weeks later.
It was a while after that it did it again. It's done it again 3 or 4 times since the re-flash. It has always has been at the worst possible time. Pulling out in front of traffic, etc. I can't make any connection except it has seemed to happen after making a corner or after making a sharp turn at low speed. Definitely has a pucker factor at critical moments.

[Cyncwby]

Of course I understand that, it's like I told a friend of mine, how many 6.7 engines are out there and not having any problems. My 7.3 with 139k has been trouble free so far, just want a dually and in reality after 14 years I want a new truck......just don't want a model with problems.

Also what do you mean your fenders are rubbing your bed, they actually move a little due to the weight of the 5th wheel?

[saw dust kid]

Just hope it's not another 6.0 Liter. My buddy put $9,000 into that truck just to keep it running with less then 100,000. Calls it POWERBROKE, FIXLITER. He drives a Chrvy now.

[gearhead]

I have a Ram Cummins on order........mostly because Ford has the lowest payload of the 3 brands, but I really don't like the loss of power issue either.

[JRTJH]

We bought our 2015 Superduty diesel in June, have put about 14,000 miles on it in 5 months and haven't had any issues at all. Towing the trailer through the Rockies this summer was "effortless" (except for paying for the diesel fuel) and to date, it's never even shuddered whether pulling or solo. There may well be some issues with a few trucks, I doubt it's an "industry wide" or "model wide" problem. It would be interesting to know exactly which truck options/model/trim options are on the trucks that are affected... This is purely my speculation, but I wonder if possibly it's occurring in a specific size of truck, optioned with a specific axle ratio, 2WD vs 4WD, 26 vs 36 gallon tank, manual regen capability vs computer driven regen, etc???

[Javi]

OMG... :D.

The fenders are attached to the bed wheelwell with several clips and are fiberglass. I can't see any way that having a 5th wheel would cause the fenders to flex.

The "11's and early '12's had an occasional throttle/turbo lag but the flash usually cured it. My 12 would do it on a rare occasion, but it never showed up after the flash. There were (I think) two other flashes, one for transmission and throttle then another for the exhaust sensors. Drove my '12 right at 50K with no issues, and now my '15 is sitting at about 20K again I've had zero issues with either truck.
I've owned 8 or 9 diesel trucks since 1983 and the 6.7 Ford is the best of the bunch by a large margin.

[JRTJH]

Just hope it's not another 6.0 Liter. My buddy put $9,000 into that truck just to keep it running with less then 100,000. Calls it POWERBROKE, FIXLITER. He drives a Chrvy now.

The 6.0 was used by Ford for only a few short years (for those with problems, it was probably "one year too many") and it was replaced very quickly because of the reputation it created. The 6.7l is in it's 6th model production year with virtually no internal changes and a "upgrade" to increase HP/torque in 2015. If the engine had the problems of the 6.0, it would have already been a "long gone memory".....

Ford is still "living with the reputation of the 6.0 and the 6.4, both of which were good engines, but not as good as the 7.3. So far, the 6.7 has proven to be a very reliable power plant with none of the problems of the 6.0 or the 6.4.

ADDED: I just checked the 6.0L diesel warranty. Ford covered the engine, all internal components, fuel injection system, and a substantial list of components for 5 years/100,000 miles, so if your friend had to spend $9,000 to keep his truck running during the warranty period, there must have been some "extenuating circumstances" that haven't been identified. Just saying......

[gearhead]

My issue doesn't last long at all...by the time I realize what has happened, it's over. Might not bother some folks.

[Javi]

My issue doesn't last long at all...by the time I realize what has happened, it's over. Might not bother some folks.
I'd get with the dealer and make sure all of the flashes have been done. I got a notice from Ford on the last one but my local dealer said mine didn't need it. I called Ford and they told me to take it to another dealer and have the reflash done there. The second dealer just said let me have your keys and have a cup of coffee. Took all of 30 minutes.

[JeffS]

I had my 2013 reflashed at 8,000 miles for a low speed hesitation. Has been find since then.

[chuckster57]

This issue has been discussed extensively in the Ford truck forum I am a member of. Issue doesn't seem to affect every truck, but involves valve stem clearance to guide.

One member has done an in depth study, and has published a report. Ford is supposed to have another software update in mid '16 to address it.

[old timer]

I have 6,000 miles on mine with no issues. Ya i read that stuff over there and I just love my truck more every day. Most of those guys change there tune add all kinds of stuff to there trucks and wonder why it doesn't run right. Trucks are more computerized these days and a simple CAI may sound good but may gum up the works. I plain to keep it stock because I like everything about my truck.
2015 F250 Lariat

[vampress_me]

We have a 2016 F-350 diesel that we got in mid-August. So far it has 6700 miles on it with no problems. It has been used towing the 5'er out west through the mountains (love the power and exhaust brake!), just doing highway driving, and driving around in the Cities. And I don't baby it. It sure hasn't had any hesitation problems, unlike our little 2012 Escape with a V6 that hesitates about 50% of the time when you step on it from a stop.

I also have to say, we also had a 2009 F-350 diesel with the 6.4L before this new one. We traded it in with 98,000 miles on it. There were many, many complaints out there about how bad that engine was, including my father-in-law who's 2008 F-350 diesel "blew up" at 28,000 miles in 2013. He didn't drive it much, I wonder if that had anything to do with it. But, our truck worked great with no issues like others had had, and it was used towing, driving in the city, and just cruising down the highway also. When MN went to 20% biodiesel in 2014, that truck started to have a problem with the exhaust system. It was only rated for 5% biodiesel. Hence the trade to a truck that can take the 20% biodiesel.

[Cyncwby]

Chuckster has the info correct and after doing some more research it seems that Ford uses only the drivers side cylinders to inject more fuel for the regen process. This overheats those cylinders which causes the exhaust valve stems and guides to expand just enough to hang up in the guide.

They don't get totally stuck because if they did a piston on the upstroke would hit the valve and POW!! I spoke with a service writer at my local Ford dealer and he was very upfront about the problem. He said that they have only had 2 trucks that had the issue. They removed the drivers side head, honed the valve giudes just enough to gain a little clearance and remove any galling that might have occured. All new exhaust valves are installed and they were good to go. Still need the new software ..... see below.

He also said that Ford was coming up with new software in 4/'16 or so to reflash those trucks with the problem but he didn't know exactly what that process would entail. Also it was just a 6.7 issue and didn't matter which truck or model the engine was in.

[Larry1013]

Of course I understand that, it's like I told a friend of mine, how many 6.7 engines are out there and not having any problems. My 7.3 with 139k has been trouble free so far, just want a dually and in reality after 14 years I want a new truck......just don't want a model with problems.

Also what do you mean your fenders are rubbing your bed, they actually move a little due to the weight of the 5th wheel?

The rub would not be noticeable on a light color truck. You can see the white line next to the fender in the photos. This is the first time Sept last year. I do not have photos of this past Sept. Ford did warranty the repainting of the complete bed exterior.

Javi, you wouldn't think any way for the frame flex to cause a rub, but it does. There is a thread on the Diesel Stop that use to have photos of a 2012 F450 dually that rubbed through the paint and also caused the steel to stress crack.

I am happy with my truck and hopefully this last time they repaired and repainted the bed, the welting they put between the fenders and the bed will prevent the paint rubs.

http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_190220_0_c3cbf46fd331bc33e4adff53ad6f9df4.jpg (http://s564.photobucket.com/user/larry1013/media/Fender%20Rub/20141211_085000.jpg.html)

http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_190220_1_54566ad18859db1e4bf68e8c8db729cd.jpg (http://s564.photobucket.com/user/larry1013/media/Fender%20Rub/20141211_084953.jpg.html)

http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_190220_2_b5891fe500ae5e8a63863674cfb28636.jpg (http://s564.photobucket.com/user/larry1013/media/Fender%20Rub/20141211_084941.jpg.html)

http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_190220_3_9cbc6816806e89dba638459eeae91e68.jpg (http://s564.photobucket.com/user/larry1013/media/Fender%20Rub/20141211_084935.jpg.html)

[C130]

I had over 73000 on my 2011 F250 and have over 21000 on my 2015 F450. So far no issues.

[Desert185]

Not to be adversarial, but over 300,000 miles on Dodge Cummins with no issues other than an automatic that failed at 98,000 under warranty. I now have a stick on my current truck with updated stock software that made it run better. I have since added a Smarty tuner and it runs better than ever. No DEF. No regeneration. Other than a 12 valve Cummins (it's a 24 valve), it's as simple as it gets with a computer onboard.

This new stuff, regardless of brand, can be a complicated, crap shoot nightmare. I realize simple isn't for everyone, but keeping it simple has rewarded me on multiple occasions throughout the years.

[JRTJH]

Not to be adversarial, but over 300,000 miles on Dodge Cummins with no issues other than an automatic that failed at 98,000 under warranty. I now have a stick on my current truck with updated stock software that made it run better. I have since added a Smarty tuner and it runs better than ever. No DEF. No regeneration. Other than a 12 valve Cummins (it's a 24 valve), it's as simple as it gets with a computer onboard.

This new stuff, regardless of brand, can be a complicated, crap shoot nightmare. I realize simple isn't for everyone, but keeping it simple has rewarded me on multiple occasions throughout the years.

My Dad, until the day he died, insisted that the automotive manufacturers screwed up when they installed starters (a hand crank through the grill was far more reliable) and he never "forgave them" for converting to the 12 volt electrical system. I used to "remind him that all those family vacations were "memorable" as much for the nights/early mornings parked at a truck stop/service station waiting for them to open and replace the water pump, fan belt, thermostat or points/plugs as they were "memorable" for the time sitting on wool seats with the windows rolled down trying to keep cool....

Between bias ply tires that wore out in 20K miles, the "buzz" from that old radio, the "unsynchronized" transmission with the shift on the column (remember double-clutching), lack of power steering and wipers that "stalled" during acceleration, I'm happy with the "advancements made by computers and modern engineering"...

And, if DEF will help keep the SMOG at bay long enough for my great grandchildren to graduate from college, it's a small price to pay.

There's nothing "wrong" with "old technology" just as there's nothing inherently "wrong" with not feeling guilty while driving a "cleaner diesel". I can't remember the last time I "got tired of my truck" long before it reached 100K miles, much less 300K. Hell, at this point, I probably won't live long enough to see my current truck's odometer get anywhere close to that many miles.

And, "real aeroplanes" have "propedders" ;)

[Desert185]

Propellers, steam gauges and tailwheels, although, I do have a soft spot for the DC-8-70 series. :thumbsup:

BTW, that old car you described...my dad and I could fix it...not waiting for the dealer to open on Monday. A computer interface to adjust mirrors or select 4WD? Really?

[Cyncwby]

Yea I can remember towing our old boat out to the Colorado river waaaay back in my Dad's '47 Cadillac. It was about 300 miles and it seemed like it took forever. If he didn't hang the old canvas water bag on the front bumper we would be screwed. That old 346" flathead would always overheat somewhere along the way......great memories though.

[Javi]

The rub would not be noticeable on a light color truck. You can see the white line next to the fender in the photos. This is the first time Sept last year. I do not have photos of this past Sept. Ford did warranty the repainting of the complete bed exterior.

Javi, you wouldn't think any way for the frame flex to cause a rub, but it does. There is a thread on the Diesel Stop that use to have photos of a 2012 F450 dually that rubbed through the paint and also caused the steel to stress crack.

I am happy with my truck and hopefully this last time they repaired and repainted the bed, the welting they put between the

Larry, I see the mark you're talking about in the last photo but I still can't equate that to frame flex. The fender is only attached to the bed at the wheel well and while the bed is attached to the frame there is no anchor on the fender to cause a rub...

If they had said vibration with loose clips then I could wrap my head around that.. If you push on the top of the fender you can see it flex. I can provide you a photo of the clips that attach the fender if you want, a road gator jumped up and bit my driver side fender last week and broke the fender loose... I don't think the fender is hurt but it was knocked off the clips..
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/13/359e8c4999aa430675e788771d68742f.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/12/13/ee3cd32b1a3bf5de6251eb2c101b7d59.jpg

[old timer]

Seems to me that Ford should have put a piece of rubber between the fender and the bed. It would appear that the fender isn't secure and moving around not frame flex. Take it to the dealer and they should fix it.

[Larry1013]

Larry, I see the mark you're talking about in the last photo but I still can't equate that to frame flex. The fender is only attached to the bed at the wheel well and while the bed is attached to the frame there is no anchor on the fender to cause a rub...

If they had said vibration with loose clips then I could wrap my head around that.. If you push on the top of the fender you can see it flex. I can provide you a photo of the clips that attach the fender if you want, a road gator jumped up and bit my driver side fender last week and broke the fender loose... I don't think the fender is hurt but it was knocked off the clips..


Javi, It might not be obvious but will say this, after the first time the local dealer fixed it in Sept 2014. I did not have any fender rubbing from Sept 2014 to Sept 2015. I did not do any towing with the truck of any sorts during this period. The only time the rubbing was noticed was AFTER towing the 5th wheel trailer using the Ford in bed hitch and mounts.

Seems like the problem only revels itself is after towing with the in bed hitch.

Seems to me that Ford should have put a piece of rubber between the fender and the bed. It would appear that the fender isn't secure and moving around not frame flex. Take it to the dealer and they should fix it.


This time they did put some felt welting between the fender and the bed. Hopefully this will resolve the problem.

[jsmith948]

Seems like the problem only revels itself is after towing with the in bed hitch.

If the rubbing only happens when you tow your 5er, I would look at how the hitch is installed. The weight of the trailer should be on the frame not the bed. Maybe someone left out a spacer/shim. Might be worth a look?

[Larry1013]

Seems like the problem only revels itself is after towing with the in bed hitch.

If the rubbing only happens when you tow your 5er, I would look at how the hitch is installed. The weight of the trailer should be on the frame not the bed. Maybe someone left out a spacer/shim. Might be worth a look?

The hitch prep kit was factory installed and the hitch is factory supplied Reese hitch.

[Javi]

The hitch prep kit was factory installed and the hitch is factory supplied Reese hitch.

The fact that the hitch is independent of the bed is what sold me on the Rese/Ford Elite hitch when I had my F250. I installed the one in the F250 myself and it has zero solid contact with the bed and the only part touching the bed is the rubber covers over the pucks.

The one in the dually was installed by the dealer and I kept my hitch... I just can't get my engineering brain to equate the 5th wheel and frame flex to the problem.. Vibration resonance when the additional load is in place I could see.. Anyway the additional felt should help.. How much 5th wheel you got.. Mine's 12K

[Larry1013]

Javi, the sticker shows 10,200 as the GVWR. It is shown as 33' long. My goose neck/5th wheel prep was installed at the factory. I ordered the 26K hitch with the 2011 and it was never used till I got the 2015 and the current trailer.