Why a propane regulator here?

[Old Bear]

I have a Cougar 5th wheel, and had issues with the automatic switchover for propane. Assuming that it was the switching unit, I replaced it. Still doesn't work! After some more checking, it appears that I get no propane from the driver side line. I'm guessing that the regulator that is mounted onto the iron pipe going across the camper is broke.

But why is there a regulator there to begin with? The propane switching unit has an integrated regulator, and the tank on the passenger side doesn't have a separate regulator. If the connection from one side to the other was a hose, maybe to reduce flow in case of a cut. But this is an iron pipe! I'm thinking of connecting the propane hose directly to the iron pipe and just do away with the regulator, but thought to seek some opinions on here first. So what do you think?

[SteveC7010]

I have a Cougar 5th wheel, and had issues with the automatic switchover for propane. Assuming that it was the switching unit, I replaced it. Still doesn't work! After some more checking, it appears that I get no propane from the driver side line. I'm guessing that the regulator that is mounted onto the iron pipe going across the camper is broke.

But why is there a regulator there to begin with? The propane switching unit has an integrated regulator, and the tank on the passenger side doesn't have a separate regulator. If the connection from one side to the other was a hose, maybe to reduce flow in case of a cut. But this is an iron pipe! I'm thinking of connecting the propane hose directly to the iron pipe and just do away with the regulator, but thought to seek some opinions on here first. So what do you think?
The regulator significantly lowers the pressure of the propane in your system. Removing it is highly dangerous.

In my rig, the tank change valve and the regulator are a one-piece unit. Perhaps you could post pics of what you are describing.

I am not sure what the real problem might be, but some things to verify:

Before anything, make sure there's propane in both tanks.

First, for the switchover to take place, the tanks have to be fully turned on. Opening the valve just partway may cause the propane to leak out at the valve, so all the way open or all the way shut.

Second, the connection to the tank on the end of the pigtail needs to be fully seated and the knob fully rotated. It's a bit awkward getting your hand up in there to connect the tank so if the pigtail is not fully tight, it will either leak dry or the check valve will shut off.

Third, while you're in there, make sure that both pigtails are not kinked. That'll shut off a tank quite efficiently.

[Old Bear]

The regulator significantly lowers the pressure of the propane in your system. Removing it is highly dangerous.

In my rig, the tank change valve and the regulator are a one-piece unit. Perhaps you could post pics of what you are describing.

I am not sure what the real problem might be, but some things to verify:

Before anything, make sure there's propane in both tanks.

First, for the switchover to take place, the tanks have to be fully turned on. Opening the valve just partway may cause the propane to leak out at the valve, so all the way open or all the way shut.

Second, the connection to the tank on the end of the pigtail needs to be fully seated and the knob fully rotated. It's a bit awkward getting your hand up in there to connect the tank so if the pigtail is not fully tight, it will either leak dry or the check valve will shut off.

Third, while you're in there, make sure that both pigtails are not kinked. That'll shut off a tank quite efficiently.
I had just refilled both tanks, and was intentionally testing the new changeover (http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/propane-auto-changeover-two-stage-regulator/24030). Yes, it has an integrated two-stage regulator. What I find odd is that the tank that is in the compartment with the changeover connects directly to the changeover (side A), but the tank on the other side of the camper connects to a regulator on that side, which is connected to an iron pipe coming into the compartment with the changeover, which in turn is connected to a hose that is connected to the other side of the changeover (side B). Both A and B connections are going through the integrated two-stage regulator, so I'm not seeing where reducing the pressure to go 7 feet through an iron pipe is accomplishing anything. An abundance of caution? Oversupply of regulators? I'll look more closely this afternoon, finally cooled off a bit here.

[Ken / Claudia]

Sounds strange to me, until someone corrects me, I do not think any trailer should have 2 regulators. But, just reading thru this, You filled both tanks and tested the auto switch over. It switches over when the tank you picked to run first is near empty. How are you attempting it to switch from a full tank to a full tank by itself. If you can list the trailer new/used and post photos of what your describing.

[chuckster57]

On fivers with two tanks, one on each side, the one without the switchover valve will have a regulator. This is pretty much standard and not a Keystone only thing. What the reason is I don't know but seeing as it's on all newer brands it must be a safety thing.

[SteveC7010]

On fivers with two tanks, one on each side, the one without the switchover valve will have a regulator. This is pretty much standard and not a Keystone only thing. What the reason is I don't know but seeing as it's on all newer brands it must be a safety thing.
I just went out and pulled the curbside tank, and sure enough, there is a little tiny regulator in the line. It's almost buried by the wall and if you did not know it was there, you might never notice it. I keep learning....

I am thinking that maybe the changeover/regulator actually regulates only one side of the valve. Would be interesting to know for sure.

OK, for the OP, the regulator on the curbside is there and clearly necessary. I'd suggest you run through some of the other things that I mentioned in my first post.

[Ken / Claudia]

Thanks guys for finding that there really are 2 regulators. Question remains why? And with 2 full tanks can you check the auto switch over? I have turned mine many times to use the 2nd tank before 1st is empty but, that's not auto.

[jsmith948]

On our Cougar, we had issues with the auto change-over. Could not get gas from the driver's side tank. Turned out to be a faulty 'pig-tail'. The safety valve that limits gas flow if there is a ruptured line would not reset. Ended up replacing both of the 'pigtails'. No problems since. Also, if you turn the tank valves on too fast, you will trigger the safety valve. If that happens, you simply have to disconnect the hose from the tank, wait a bit, then reconnect.
If you do a forum search, there is a thread that explains, in detail, how to properly open the valves of the gas system.

[hankaye]

Howdy All;

The Driver's side regulator is for reducing the pressure to an acceptable
level for the Black iron pipe. It gets reduced to IIRC 30 psi. They are just
like the regulators on a household tank and function for the same reason,
Should the transport line (black iron pipe), rupture the full pressure won't
cause a massive leak but allow the rapid flow mechanism in the pigtail to
shut off the flow.

OP, ... When you opened the valve to the driver's side did you open it
s...l...o...w...l...y? If not then you triggered the shut off function in the pig
tail. turn it off, remove the pig tail from the tank, then re attach it, the
removing allows the pressure to dissipate. Hook it back up and try it
again.

hankaye

[shiggs68]

On a two tank system where the tanks are on each side of a fifth wheel, the far side tank requires a small regulator if the run to the main regulator is more than 2 ft. This is standard propane regulations.

That regulator reduces the pressure to something like 30 inches water column and the main regulator reduces the distribution pressure to 11 inches water column.


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[bobbecky]

This is an answer to the same question on a different brand RV forum.

The main reason for the regulator is to make sure that once the propane leaves the tank as a vapor that it stays a vapor. Propane regulators in trailers do not regulate liquid only vapor. If the regulator was not there the pressure in the hose would be the same as the tank. This could lead to the vapor condensening back into a liquid. With a reduction in the pressure from the regulator to the other side of the coach this will greatly reduce the possibility of the vapor in the crossover hose turning back into a liquid. This is all based on propanes vapor/pressure saturation points. the lower the pressure the lower the temperature to turn it back into a liquid.

Hope that answers the question.

[Old Bear]

This is an answer to the same question on a different brand RV forum.

The main reason for the regulator is to make sure that once the propane leaves the tank as a vapor that it stays a vapor. Propane regulators in trailers do not regulate liquid only vapor. If the regulator was not there the pressure in the hose would be the same as the tank. This could lead to the vapor condensening back into a liquid. With a reduction in the pressure from the regulator to the other side of the coach this will greatly reduce the possibility of the vapor in the crossover hose turning back into a liquid. This is all based on propanes vapor/pressure saturation points. the lower the pressure the lower the temperature to turn it back into a liquid.

Hope that answers the question.
Why yes ... yes, it does!

[shiggs68]

Propane vaporizes at any temperature above -44 degrees. The regulator has nothing to do with that process other then because of the high tank pressure resulting from the vaporization, it is a safety factor to distribute a lower pressure than the high tank pressure.

Likewise, as I stated above, it is propane code the an intermediate regulator be used on the far tank because of the distance. High pressure tank hoses are not allowed longer then 2 feet.


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[Bob Landry]

I've read several threads pertaining to the propane line "locking u" because of opening the valve too fast. I've been cranking mine open since I've had a trailer and have not once had the high pressure valve kick in. It's very possible that is something that someone posted on the Internet and it just got parroted. The pressure in the propane line is the same when you slightly crack the valve as it is when it's wide open.
The High pressure valve in the pigtail is designed to kick in in the event of a rupture or break in the gas line which would cause an immediate and rapid loss of pressure. If just opening the tank too fast caused that, there would be thousands of unhappy people out there babying their propane tank valves and I don't hear of that happening. If this phenomenon in fact does happen, disconnecting the hose from the tank would be unnecessary as the pressure could be released simply by turning on a stove burner or your grill.

I'm not saying that it is an impossibility for it to happen, but I would like to see some substantiating evidence that it happens other than something that someone's brother's uncle wrote it on the Internet.

[Pull Toy]

To check the auto change over function just turn off the tank that you want to change from and use up the propane in the system. A safe way to do this is to light your stove. The auto change over should happen when the pressure drops enough to call for it.

I usually prefer not to keep both tank valves open at the same time. From past experience I have learned that by manually starting the second tank when the first one is empty, I have time to refill the first tank without being totally out of gas in the middle of the night.

[chuckster57]

I have had a couple of customers come in with no L/P flow, and found the high pressure valve kicked in. Albeit rare, it can and does happen.

[shiggs68]

I've read several threads pertaining to the propane line "locking u" because of opening the valve too fast. I've been cranking mine open since I've had a trailer and have not once had the high pressure valve kick in. It's very possible that is something that someone posted on the Internet and it just got parroted. The pressure in the propane line is the same when you slightly crack the valve as it is when it's wide open.

The High pressure valve in the pigtail is designed to kick in in the event of a rupture or break in the gas line which would cause an immediate and rapid loss of pressure. If just opening the tank too fast caused that, there would be thousands of unhappy people out there babying their propane tank valves and I don't hear of that happening. If this phenomenon in fact does happen, disconnecting the hose from the tank would be unnecessary as the pressure could be released simply by turning on a stove burner or your grill.



I'm not saying that it is an impossibility for it to happen, but I would like to see some substantiating evidence that it happens other than something that someone's brother's uncle wrote it on the Internet.



The evidence is Federal Law. Just google search OPD propane valves. The are require on all 20, 30, and 40 pound DOT Propane tanks. Not hear say, it does happen and is designed to shut down if high flow is detected to protect against hot pressure tank hose failure.

[Bob Landry]

No argument about it being Federal law. No one has said anything about any law. The intent of the shut off is to stop the flow of propane in the event of a break in any part of the propane system that suddenly releases the pressure in the line.