Roof cleaning / treating is a waste of time and money

[Jabber2Jake]

Nobody read my previous post on washing and coating the roof with expensive products like Aerospace 303, etc.
It's a waste of money. The EPDM roof will last for decades, 40+ years. It never needs washing or coating.
Only maintenance required is to check seams and caulking to prevent leaks.

Read this:
http://www.epdmroofs.org/what-is-epdm/faqs/general-questions

Who do you believe?
This is from the EPDM Roofing Association!

[larry337]

I won't agree or disagree without reading the link, but my first thought is the dirt on the roof eventually makes it's way to the sides so I'll continue cleaning it regardless. Though I've always questioned whether it actually extends the life of the roof. I'll keep cleaning it just cuz its dirty, that's reason enough for me.

[Seabee]

I believe the answer to question #8 is pretty much saying to wash it.

[440justin]

+1 on washing it when I wash the rest of the trailer. Why wash the sides and leave all the dirt on the roof? All that will end up on the side of the trailer in the next rain event. Now for coating with something lime 303.... That is just crazy in my book. I work in the building industry and I can tell you for a fact that no building owner with a EDPM roof is using a product on the roof. Just think what that would cost you if you had 50,000+ sq.ft. of roof area!

[BirchyBoy]

I didn't realize it's the same stuff used on commercial roofs. That definitely gives me a better feel for how durable it is. I'll still give a rinse and wash with Dawn periodically, though.

[Jabber2Jake]

Justin can wash if he desires, won't hurt, but in my case, I don't have a problem with chalk lines on sides.
Glad Justin knows his stuff. No coating or treatment is necessary. And clearly, answer to question 8 on the
above link does NOT say to wash. It says to remove debris and leaves.
A broom will accomplish this, if you are parked under a tree for weeks...

question 8. Does EPDM require systematic maintenance or additional coatings or treatment to achieve its life expectancy?

Answer: (from EPDM Roofing Assoc. see link above)
No. No special coating or other surface treatment is required.
General maintenance in the form of good housekeeping should periodically be performed to remove debris and leaves,
and to investigate the performance of other components.

So, from the answer, remove debris, leaves and check seams and caulking. But, most 5ers have sloped roofs and
shed leaves and debris while driving. So, actually, you don't have to do anything to it except check seams periodically.

It's that simple. You don't have to kill yourself.

[JRTJH]

Nobody read my previous post on washing and coating the roof with expensive products like Aerospace 303, etc.
It's a waste of money. The EPDM roof will last for decades, 40+ years. It never needs washing or coating.
Only maintenance required is to check seams and caulking to prevent leaks.

Read this:
http://www.epdmroofs.org/what-is-epdm/faqs/general-questions

Who do you believe?
This is from the EPDM Roofing Association!

One SIGNIFICANT problem with your "advice" is that EPDM roofing material is no longer being used on THE MAJORITY OF Keystone RV's. The "new and improved" material is TPO. It's a different breed and isn't anything like EPDM with the exception of where it's used. I wouldn't advise using EPDM maintenance requirements to maintain a TPO roof any more than I'd advise cleaning rabbits the same way as cleaning fish.

Your link has some "good information" to supplement (not replace) the DICOR maintenance instructions, but all of that pretty much applies to Keystone RV's that were manufactured before 2010 (or around that time).....

[Seabee]

In regards to EPDM roofs on RV's the "investigate the performance of other components" would in my mind refer to all those seems up there. Well, to maintain those seems properly, they need to be clean. Shouldn't those seems be clean for a proper inspection? Additionally, those seems need to be clean to properly reseal correct? That cleaning will require some kind of washing which is nothing more than "good housekeeping".

Out of sheer curiosity, is the EPDM Roofing Association involved in the RV industry? I didn't notice that any of the EPDM Roofing Association members as being part of the RV industry.

[PerryB]

I won't agree or disagree without reading the link, but my first thought is the dirt on the roof eventually makes it's way to the sides so I'll continue cleaning it regardless. Though I've always questioned whether it actually extends the life of the roof. I'll keep cleaning it just cuz its dirty, that's reason enough for me.

Same here. I don't like all that black crud running down the sides of the trailer.

[Steve S]

Do you not wash your car and not expect it to not rust or have paint damage?
Cleaning your roof and all the spots that'll collect crap is preventive maintenance in my mind.
I think that any preventive maintenance on the inside and outside will save a person some cash and headaches in the long run.

[bobbecky]

Not wanting to create an argument, but the statement that the industry does not use EPDM rubber roofs anymore may not be quite accurate. I have a 2012 Montana, and from the characteristics of the roof membrane, it is a EPDM roof. I did a little research and came across this article, and it describes a TPO roof as being glossy and does not chalk, which does not describe what I have. This is the article that tells how to determine the roof material: http://rvingwithmarkpolk.com/2012/02/14/rv-rubber-roof-but-what-type/

[Dave W]

One SIGNIFICANT problem with your "advice" is that EPDM roofing material is no longer being used on Keystone RV's. The "new and improved" material is TPO......

I have to say that after spending some time recently on the roof of our 2014 Montana High Country, I'm not convinced that the roof covering isn't EPDM or a least a close relative. I came away with a white chalky substance on my black sneakers, jeans and some on my hands. I did a full roof wash down last fall but didn't see the white stuff deposited on the driveway as I had on the last two trailers though. I had out of curiosity spent some time in the past looking at the Keystone web site and again today .... and that 'factoid' of roof covering information is conspicuously missing (leaving it open to whatever was the least expensive at the time of manufacture:eek:).

I would be happy if RV builders would return to an aluminum roof. Easy to keep sealed, maintained and even repaired. But of course, it wouldn't be the newest, greatest(?) and 'best' for us in the masses.

[jsmith948]

To me, washing your RV without washing the roof is like washing your car and not cleaning the wheels and tires. Takes about 1 to 1 1/2 hrs to wash and treat the roof on our little 32ft 5er. Besides, as an additional benefit, having the roof clean makes me feel good.:p

[JRTJH]

One SIGNIFICANT problem with your "advice" is that EPDM roofing material is no longer being used on THE MAJORITY OF Keystone RV's. ...
Your link has some "good information" to supplement (not replace) the DICOR maintenance instructions, but all of that pretty much applies to Keystone RV's that were manufactured before 2010 (or around that time).....

...I have a 2012 Montana, and from the characteristics of the roof membrane, it is a EPDM roof...

I have to say that after spending some time recently on the roof of our 2014 Montana High Country, I'm not convinced that the roof covering isn't EPDM or a least a close relative....
I.

I don't think your comments are argumentative at all. I did some checking this morning and it does appear that Keystone's Montana brochure for 2015 still lists the EPDM roofing membrane as a "feature". With that said, I have edited my previous post (in red).

The point remains that Keystone uses TPO roofing membrane on the majority of its RV's. To rely on the EPDM Roofing Association (who doesn't appear to have any RV representation in their panel of experts) for all maintenance requirements while ignoring the Keystone Owner's Manual and the manufacturer of the specific product (EPDM or TPO) that is installed on our specific RV is not sound advice.

Having both EPDM and TPO roofing material on Keystone products makes it more compelling that the owner inspect his roof, not only for sealant damage, but also to determine the type of material which will require a different sealant system depending on what kind of roofing is installed.

The easiest "test" to determine if your roof is EPDM or TPO is to remove a roof vent shroud on the INSIDE of your RV. You'll find the roofing membrane has been cut and folded back against the vent opening. If the roofing membrane is black with a "colored surface" then it is EPDM. If the roofing membrane is a solid color (same on top and bottom) then it is a TPO roofing product. If there is a felt backing that obscures the base membrane, it's TPO.

I hope this helps more than confuses owners of Keystone RV's. The Owner's Manual is clear in this statement: "Inspect the roof at least every 90 days, paying close attention to all seams and/or joints and attachments where sealant is used. Look for cracks, shrinkage and/or gaps/voids in the sealants. These must be carefully cleaned and resealed. It is necessary to use the same sealant as originally installed if touching up cracks, shrinkage and gaps/voids. There is no way to know if 2 different brands of sealant will seal to each other. DO NOT use any type of silicone product on the rubber roof material."

This statement by Keystone applies to both EPDM and TPO roofing membranes. To rely on the "EPDM industry council" as an excuse not to maintain and clean your roofing membrane is not a good maintenance practice.

[Dave W]

Having both EPDM and TPO roofing material on Keystone products makes it more compelling that the owner inspect his roof, not only for sealant damage, but also to determine the type of material which will require a different sealant system depending on what kind of roofing is installed.


When all said and done - I really don't care which roof material our 5er has as long as it 'survives' the entire period of time we own it with an occasional wash down and seal of the penetrations. This is why I was recently on the roof. Also to measure the shower skylight for replacement as it has a stress crack across a corner from poor manufacturer installation (it's well sealed with Dicor for now).

[JRTJH]

When all said and done - I really don't care which roof material our 5er has as long as it 'survives' the entire period of time we own it with an occasional wash down and seal of the penetrations. This is why I was recently on the roof. Also to measure the shower skylight for replacement as it has a stress crack across a corner from poor manufacturer installation (it's well sealed with Dicor for now).

As long as you're satisfied with your Montana, that's what's important. How you maintain it is entirely up to you. Here's hoping it will "survive" the entire period of time you own it.... Enjoy the summer, it seems to have finally arrived..... :)

[Jabber2Jake]

2010 Keystone Cougar, 292RKS
Roof is EPDM

[jaitken0016]

I wash the top to try and prevent most of the dirt from running down the sides and creating the big black streaks.

[dave-g]

I wash mine when ever washing the trailer. But I do not coat it with 303 or other product. Most say they last 30-90 day.

I believe the only way to inspect your roof is to wash it, and give it a good look over. In the spring I get down and scrub by hand to take a good look. The remainder of the year I use a long soft broom.

[Campy]

The only reason to coat a modern roof with 303 or such is to keep "gunk" from sticking to it. (like tree sap if you camp in Wisconsin, oh my god it was everywhere!)

[filmtex]

I think our entire RV got washed last weekend. Seven inches of rain in one day probably did the job for me. Good thing too- I was in Hawaii!

[Yosemitebob]

Wow, did you take your RV "bouncey: Hope you had a great time.

[tgpilot]

So, I can then assume that my 2007 Keystone Copper Canyon built in 2006 has the EPDM roof and don't have to worry about it as much?

I agree Hawaii is still nice, I spent a month there last Sept. and could have taken my rig with me. I flew over on a military C-5A. Could have driven the whole thing up in the belly of it. Then, flew back in a C-117. Same thing, I could have brought it all back then. Can't figure why the Government won't let us do that....LOL.

[Yosemitebob]

So, I can then assume that my 2007 Keystone Copper Canyon built in 2006 has the EPDM roof and don't have to worry about it as much?.

Military - you know better than to assume. I assumed I wouldn't go to Nam, spent two tours there. I'm sure you also know the meaning of "to assume" lol. Seriously, I as well as others have not figured out how they decide to EPDM or TPO. If you want to, or need to know, you better check. I pulled a vent dressing on the inside to see what color mine was, it was black, EPDM.

[tgpilot]

As mentioned, mine was made in 2006, so it may well be the old EPDM, will have to check that out.

Yeah, I was stationed in Hawaii in 65, then sent to Viet Nam where I lasted about three months before I was blown up, burned 80% of my body second, third and some fourth degree burns. Lost 120 lbs. in a week and spent a year and a half on a death bed, but I made. No matter how bad I was, their were others that were worse off! Now hitting 70 and with a loss of use of a limb, I make do. Memories are fading.......

To all those Viet Nam vets that made it back, "Welcome Home". :wlcm:

[dave-g]

As mentioned, mine was made in 2006, so it may well be the old EPDM, will have to check that out.

Yeah, I was stationed in Hawaii in 65, then sent to Viet Nam where I lasted about three months before I was blown up, burned 80% of my body second, third and some fourth degree burns. Lost 120 lbs. in a week and spent a year and a half on a death bed, but I made. No matter how bad I was, their were others that were worse off! Now hitting 70 and with a loss of use of a limb, I make do. Memories are fading.......

To all those Viet Nam vets that made it back, "Welcome Home". :wlcm:

I have never served- but thank God for all those who have. Thank You.

[Yosemitebob]

Welcome home Tjpilot:USA2: and may I say "thank you"

[tgpilot]

Your very welcome guys, thank you.

Tom

[Montanatom]

How do you tell the difference between a EPDM roof and a TPO roof?

[Yosemitebob]

There are LOTS of posts on this subject. But, if you remove the inside garnish around one of your vents (four screws), you will find that where the factory cut out the hole, they folded the rubber inward. If the rubber is black on the bottom (just lift it up and see) it is EPDM.

[tgpilot]

I think our entire RV got washed last weekend. Seven inches of rain in one day probably did the job for me. Good thing too- I was in Hawaii!

Last Sept. the family and I went back over to Hawai'i and stayed a month. I could have taken my RV and truck there and back if Uncle Sam would have let me. Flew over on a C-5A and flew back on a C-117. Plenty of room on both of them to get my rig on, darn it....oh well. "bouncey: