Warranty/Service Work, Not at Selling Dealership

[Robert Phelps]

Hi,
We are looking to buy a new Premier 30RIPR and are in negotiations with two dealerships. One local, one 300 miles away. The farther dealer is giving us the better deal by far!, but the local dealer has informed me they will not perform warranty work. (which Keystone confirmed, unfortunately :( )
While having a conversation with the salesman of the local dealership, he informed us they will not service the unit at all if we don't by from them. That seems utterly absurd to me and I'm wondering if anyone else has run into this same issue?
I don't like being pushed up against a wall, but can't just drive 300 miles away at the drop of a hat either.

Thanks in advance,

Diane

[Timon]

Is it even legal for Keystone to require that warrantee work ONLY be done at the dealer you purchased from? I DON'T THINK SO.


What if you're a thousand miles away on a trip are you supposed to go back to the original dealer?
What if you move to another state do you have to back to the original dealer?

I believe that federal law does not allow a manufacture to do force you to only use the original dealer and in fact I believe you have the right to go Any repair center even if it's not part of the dealer network.

Now can the dealer refuse? That's another question.

[bsmith0404]

Diane,
Just curious who you are dealing with in St Louis. We looked at a lot of units at several different dealerships. Ended up buying from Apache Village. they gave us the best deal, have a great customer service attitude, and were great when servicing our unit.

We've since moved away from St Louis and I've found that Camping World offers the best attitude for performing service on our 5er. We called other local shops, all asked if we bought from them and gave us attitude when we said no. Camping World didn't even ask, they just scheduled our service for the first available opening the following week. You have a CW about 100 miles from you. Still not great, but better than 300 if you can't work with the local guys on your purchase.

[bsmith0404]

Is it even legal for Keystone to require that warrantee work ONLY be done at the dealer you purchased from? I DON'T THINK SO.


What if you're a thousand miles away on a trip are you supposed to go back to the original dealer?
What if you move to another state do you have to back to the original dealer?

I believe that federal law does not allow a manufacture to do force you to only use the original dealer and in fact I believe you have the right to go Any repair center even if it's not part of the dealer network.

Now can the dealer refuse? That's another question.

I believe what she meant is that Keystone confirmed that the dealership can refuse to service the unit if you didn't purchase from them. This is very common in this industry. The repair shops just aren't set up for high volume and they give priority to the customers who buy from them.

[Festus2]

Diane/Timon:

This topic has come up before and many folks are both surprised and disappointed to find out that if you did not buy the unit from dealer X, they are not under any obligation to perform warranty work on that unit.

There are no laws that force a dealer to do such work if the unit was not purchased from them even if they do in fact sell one or more Keystone products. Unlike the automobile industry, the RV industry does not operate under the same "guidelines" or obligations.

So yes, a dealer can refuse to do warranty work. That is one of the hazards of buying a unit at a cheaper price a long distance from where you live. There may be a dealership right around the corner but if you didn't buy from them they can and will tell you that "we won't do warranty work on your unit". Distance doesn't matter.

It's a tough decision for prospective buyers to make. If there are only a few hundred dollars difference, the decision would be easy. Buy local. But several thousand dollars? That's a tougher call.

If you think about it, the dealership does have a bit of a case in refusing to do warranty work. If he has a large clientele, it would make good business sense to first service those people who bought from them. And anyone else gets put at the bottom of the pile, has to wait for a long time, or doesn't get serviced at all. He does have to maintain some responsibility to his buying customers. There is also an argument to be made about the profitability of doing warranty work. Some would say that the dealership makes little or no profit but that is seen by others as a poor excuse for not doing warranty work. That topic has also been discussed here.

It may be hard to believe but unfortunately, that's the way it is in the RV industry.

[Timon]

If Keystone said that they know dealers that would not service unless it was purchased from them then Keystone should call and tell the owner they either service or loose the right to sell Keystone products.

Why? Because it's in Keystones best interest to make sure a customer can get service when they are not close to the selling dealer.

Nice to know that CW will cover you no matter what.

[Festus2]

If Keystone said that they know dealers that would not service unless it was purchased from them then Keystone should call and tell the owner they either service or loose the right to sell Keystone products.

Why? Because it's in Keystones best interest to make sure a customer can get service when they are not close to the selling dealer.

Nice to know that CW will cover you no matter what.

Timon:

You have to remember that there is a difference between the automobile and the RV industry and their dealerships. Keystone's relationship with their dealers is at "arms length" and it can't simply call up the dealership and tell them to do warranty work "or else". It's common practice amongst Keystone dealerships to make their own policy and decisions about performing warranty work. Keystone doesn't control what goes on to that extent and probably would not stop supplying their products to dealers who choose not to do warranty work. Keystone may, for some other reason(s) not supply RV's to a certain dealership.

I am wondering if all CW outlets will perform warranty work regardless of what CW dealership you purchased the RV from. As you said, it "would be nice to know that CW will cover you no matter what". I'd suggest checking this out before assuming that they will all do this.

[chuckster57]

The dealership I worked at would only schedule non customer units AFTER all other appointments were taken. And limited repairs to 5 items.

[Way Of Life]

My mind would already be made while I drive the distance to get the better deal. The attitude of your "local shop" is absurd. It's because of their attitude that folks are willing to drive several hundred miles to be treated fairly.....We did.

We drove 160 miles and saved over $10,000 on the deal we made. Our purchase was at a Camping World and we have nothing but good things to say about our experience. Along with our purchase came a 3 year membership at the Elite level of Good Sam. This comes with special discounts and and perks; one of them being given priority service.....And yes.....This is nation wide!

Am also very fortunate that we also have a local dealer that has been more than willing to help with service and parts....Even to the point that they are taking care of the warranty paper work on the items that needed attention during our shakedown weekend. They have also offered any further service; warranty of otherwise whenever needed. Guess we have the best of both worlds.

[Timon]

Timon:

You have to remember that there is a difference between the automobile and the RV industry and their dealerships. Keystone's relationship with their dealers is at "arms length" and it can't simply call up the dealership and tell them to do warranty work "or else". It's common practice amongst Keystone dealerships to make their own policy and decisions about performing warranty work. Keystone doesn't control what goes on to that extent and probably would not stop supplying their products to dealers who choose not to do warranty work. Keystone may, for some other reason(s) not supply RV's to a certain dealership.

I am wondering if all CW outlets will perform warranty work regardless of what CW dealership you purchased the RV from. As you said, it "would be nice to know that CW will cover you no matter what". I'd suggest checking this out before assuming that they will all do this.
I understand what your saying but the manufacture has lots of power. Example: I know for a fact that a few Tiffin dealers have told Tiffin owners they wouldn't do service so the owner called Tiffin. A few minutes later the dealers attitude totally changed after Tiffin called and threaten to drop them if they didn't service any Tiffin customer no matter where they purchased the coach from. Keystone could do the same.

[rbev2308]

I also came across this same situation. I called Keystone prior to purchase and was told that the dealers are independently owned and under no obligation to do anything. Yes, Camping World is your best option but I have none within 200 miles of me. I made a tough decision which was to drive nearly 400 miles to purchase that in the end, saved me over $10K. I then went into another local Keystone dealership and explained that I just moved into the area which may be slightly unethical, hell it is definitely that. I even discussed doing an upgrade on my pin box and got my foot in the door. They told me no problem, bring it here but informed me of the local buyer rule for timeline on work getting done. I am in a military town and they know we all move a lot so they do not want that bad rap...In the end, I knew this was a possibility and was willing to take back the 400 miles until the selling dealership pissed me off so bad on my PDI that I vowed never to return. If my deal would have been within a few thousand dollars, I would have spent it to avoid the headache. But the money trumped it all so you have to deal with that when you make that call!!!

[wahoonc]

I understand what your saying but the manufacture has lots of power. Example: I know for a fact that a few Tiffin dealers have told Tiffin owners they wouldn't do service so the owner called Tiffin. A few minutes later the dealers attitude totally changed after Tiffin called and threaten to drop them if they didn't service any Tiffin customer no matter where they purchased the coach from. Keystone could do the same.

World of difference between Keystone and Tiffin...

Aaron:cool:

[jsmith948]

Another factor to consider: The warranty period is a very short 1 year.
We bought our 5er during the Pomona RV show from a dealer 205 miles from us.
We discussed the warranty issue, but, as I told the dealer, "unless something major happens, you won't see this trailer again".
Fortunately, we had to make only one trip back for warranty work.
All the other minor issues we repaired. My work and attention to detail is way better anyway, IMHO:)

[Javi]

My closest Cougar dealer is 100 miles from my home to their door but after having bought a Passport from them a couple of years ago I'd never buy there again. Just flat don't like how they conduct business...

So we drove to a small E. Texas town and got not only a great deal but when we picked up the trailer everything had been checked out and everything worked. After seven months and several camping trips there have been zero warranty issues. Yes; there have been a couple of things that needed repair or "fixing" like the batteries in the door lock which I disabled the first trip out and a loose cable on the TV.

And there have been modifications I've made like disconnecting the washer lines as we will never add a washer to this camper, and I don't want to have to fool with blowing them out every time we winter camp.

Any future repairs that I cannot handle personally will be made by a local independent RV repair guy that does great work, is more reasonably priced than most dealers, and is a warranty repair center for most RV appliances and equipment. He is also much faster and easier to get an appointment with than any dealer.

[Bob Landry]

Even though refusal to do warranty work is widespread in the RV industry, I have to scratch my head every time I read a post about it. Dealer service organizations operate on their own P&L, and I just don't understand any service manager worth his salt walking away and leaving money on the the table, but it does happen. I've heard that the dealers don't get paid as much on warranty as they do on T&M, and I also find that a little ludicrous. I have been a Dometic Marine A/C dealer for 20 years, and when I give an estimate for a T&M repair, I base my flat rate on Dometic's warranty time allowance, as it is more than generous. I also service all brands even if purchased elsewhere because I'm simply not in business to leave money on the table or to send work to my competitors. A customer who I turn away is a customer lost forever.
Keep in mind that the Keystone warranty is only for the trailer and components that they use, not appliances. All of the appliance manufacturers can refer you to service centers that they authorize, and it doesn't have to be a dealer. There are a lot of independent guys who do service on-site and are very good.
Also, a thorough PDI should disclose almost all issues that may require warranty service and it is up to you to do that before you take possession of your trailer. What will be left is most likely minor issues that you can fix in a lot less time than your trailer will sit on the lot waiting for service.

Bottom line... To save a few thousand bucks up front, I'm willing to fix a lot of stuff. And, I do better work than the dealer's mwchanics who are paid by he job and just want to get to the next one.

[KanTC]

You'll find a "BUY LOCAL" disclaimer on many of the RV manufacturer websites. Some are more "straightforward" than others..... here's a few:

Keystone: http://www.keystonerv.com/find-a-dealer

http://www.forestriverinc.com/DealerLocator.aspx

http://www.heartlandrvs.com/services/find-dealer
In Part: ....."dealers are under obligation to provide warranty service for products they sell, but are not legally required to service products purchased from other dealers.".....

Terri, the Chevy co-pilot :)

[chuckster57]

World of difference between Keystone and Tiffin...



Aaron:cool:


The dealership I worked at was a Tiffen dealer. Tiffen lives by their own rules, but they still didn't force us to do warranty work on a non customer unit.

[Timon]

Personally I don't like the Feds adding new laws but I think its time they include RV under the same rules as cars when it comes to service and other such issues. Seems only fair.

I can handle just about anything until it gets to the structure its self. That part is really the only thing I'd really need to worry about dealer service on.

The major concern is being a thousand miles from home and having something in the structure needing repair and dealers saying we didn't sell it so we won't work on it.

If Keystone will authorize an independent repair shop to fix the problems I can somewhat live with that.

[NotyetMHCowner]

Inside my owners manual, it says that any Keystone dealer has to do warranty work even if not the purchasing dealer. Now maybe warranty and service are different, I don't know, but that is what is in my manual. I can take a picture of it if I need to.

We drove 6 hours to RV Wholesalers to buy ours and, out of respect for the local dealer, I wont take it to them for work.

[JRTJH]

When it comes to getting the "Feds" involved. That process starts with contacting your local representative/senator and expressing your concern. Waiting for "somebody else" to do it won't effect any change, so if it's that important to you, get involved !!! This is not intended to be a "political" statement, the same advice would apply to mowing the lawn, getting the local WalMart to carry a certain brand of apple sauce or keeping the street in front of your house litter free.

As for warranty needs while away from home, most dealerships are amenable to helping a traveler in need, but often turn a "blind eye" to the guy who lives in town, was in shopping, then bought from another dealership. Really, it's a "kick in the butt" to develop a relationship with a sales department, then buy somewhere else and then come back asking for "favors" which the dealer is not obligated to provide when something breaks.

If you are on vacation, away from home and have a problem (during the warranty period), then you need to contact Keystone Customer Service, explain your problem and they can help you find a local repair facility that can repair your trailer.

Realize the warranty is for 12 months. That time flies by and you'll probably not have any significant "structural problem" during that time. As for other systems, some owners have a greater need for warranty service than others. Part is their mechanical ability, desire to "do it yourself" and the complexity of the problem.

I've only heard of a very limited handful of "structural problems" with any RV. Usually that part of the coach is not an issue.

There's no need to "get ruffled" because Keystone doesn't "make dealerships" do their bidding..... Until you actually have a problem and are turned away, it's all "just a talking point not a crisis" anyway.

[KanTC]

Timon,

Service/repairs required while traveling isn't the issue [nor was it part of the OP's question] -- dealers know that "stuff happens" occasionally while traveling, and most dealers will try to accomodate a stranded RV'er. Read Ch 1 of your Owners Manual [Dealer Service & Obtaining Warranty Service in Transit]... it's all there. http://www.keystonerv.com/media/2142489/keystone_owners_manual_web_4-1-2015.pdf

Terri, the Chevy co-pilot :)

[ImTravis]

I guess we got lucky. The DW and I bought ours out of state, but one of the local shops will do warranty work as long as we show them proof we are the original owners. I'd have bought from them if they had the floor plan we wanted.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Festus2]

Personally I don't like the Feds adding new laws but I think its time they include RV under the same rules as cars when it comes to service and other such issues. Seems only fair.

I can handle just about anything until it gets to the structure its self. That part is really the only thing I'd really need to worry about dealer service on.

The major concern is being a thousand miles from home and having something in the structure needing repair and dealers saying we didn't sell it so we won't work on it.

If Keystone will authorize an independent repair shop to fix the problems I can somewhat live with that.

It has been pointed out that Keystone's warranty is only for 1 year so if something goes wrong after that time, it really doesn't matter whether you bought it locally or not. Hopefully, any defects or issues will have been caught by you when you did your walk through or they will turn up within the warranty period. After that, you're on your own - except for warranty items like appliances and the like which have their separate and usually longer warranty periods.

If something were to go wrong with the structure or frame of the RV and I was a 1000 miles from "home" then I'd be looking for the nearest repair facility to get it fixed in a hurry. The last thing I'd be concerned about is will Keystone authorize this independent repair shop to fix the problem. If the frame is cracked or some welds have separated leaving the structure seriously compromised, then I'd want that fixed now and worry about who's going to pay for it later.

I really don't think dealerships are about to change their policy and I wouldn't wait around for any changes in legislation that would require them to do so. It is what it is - fair or not. Eventually, you will have to find a reputable and competent repair facility that is "close" to you so that you will be able to take your RV there should any issues come up when your warranty has expired.

I'm not trying to sound dismissive of your frustration, but the good news, if there is any for you, is that your concern about this issue will last for only a year then it won't matter. So let's hope that you will have an enjoyable and trouble-free first year with your RV.

[sourdough]

I guess my take is a little different than the OPs. I understand a dealer not wanting to do warranty work on a unit when they were bypassed for the sale. It would be nice if they would, but I understand it. And now, after getting neck deep in the workings between Keystone and their dealers, I understand Keystone's reluctance and/or inability to force a dealership to do anything.
As was said in one of the posts, you need to keep that consequence in mind when you make the decision about the purchase and then deal with it.

As for warranty work on the road, I've only had one experience. We bought our camper at CW in TX. We had an issue in FL and CW in Tallahassee was very helpful in getting it resolved. I have nothing bad to say about CW and will continue to give them my business.

The references to car dealerships vs RV dealerships were wrong in my experience. I've bought dozens upon dozens of new vehicles over the years and have experienced the same attitude among some auto dealers as those expressed by some of the RV dealerships. On several occasions I've been asked if I purchased there; if not, no warranty work. Several other times I've been told I would be put on a waiting list. All the same as an RV dealer. Just last year I took my '13 pickup in to have the tires rotated and balanced at my local dealership (I had purchased it out of state). The sign said rotate and balance $45. When I picked up the truck my bill was for $75. I was upset and they told me the $45 price was for THEIR customers.....not me. So, the same attitude and circumstances are alive and well in the auto industry as well. I understand their position even if i don't like it. I bought a new '14 3/4 from them so I would now have a preferred status with them.

[zuley]

When we bought our 23RB two years ago I stopped in at Leisure Days in Kitchener, Ontario previous to making our decission. It was actually the sales manager that convinced me to drive 160 miles and purchase our unit elsewhere. During our initial meet and greet I told him I had been looking at our model and wanted to compare what else was out there. He imediately slammed our unit and out right told me if I didn't purchase from them not to bring it into them for service. I don't know if he was trying to intimidate me or what his plan was. Didn't really give him the opportunity to finish his little rehearsed speel. The tone of our converstion changed real quick. I have no issues with looking after your customers first and even refusing warranty work from transient customers but don't use intimidation as a sales technique which he was certainly doing. As it turned out we had no warranty issues that required a trip back to our selling dealer. Funny thing... we have done a few mods and spent a few dollars on upgrades. Never once considered driving to Leisure Days even though they are the closest RV dealer to my home.

[zuley]

Sourdough, I just read your post re the auto dealer who charged you 30 bills more for a rotate because you were not "their customer". Wow. Don't know what area of the globe you reside from but gotta say I have worked for a Chryler store for 30 plus years in Ontario, Canada. At one point warranty was our bread and butter in the service department. Back in the 80's every second Chrysler out there needed a tranmssion and every 2.6 litre needed chains and gears. I still know the part numbers for most of that stuff. Then came the 90's and the LH platform vehicles with most still needing transmssions and air conditioning evaporators. I have to say warranty is no longer the money generator it once was. We are probably down 60 percent or more in warranty numbers the past 10 years. All of the manufactures are seeing the same decline in warranty repairs. We get full door rate and 40 points on the parts when doing warranty and we get paid promptly. I can't imagine any automotive dealer turning down service work let alone warranty.

[sourdough]

zuley - I was shocked by the price difference as well. I knew the GM of the dealership well but did not want to mess with it. I have since visited in depth with him about it and he says there was some miscommunication from the service staff and it wouldn't happen again. It shouldn't, I bought a new truck from them.

Sorry for the side trip from the OPs original post......I'll try to stay on track now :)

[Robert Phelps]

Thank you, ALL, for taking time to respond to our query.

This is our first time buying a new RV, so it has been a bit of a learning experience. We were disappointed to learn that our local dealer wouldn't perform warranty work, but are still just shaking our heads that they will jeopardize a lifelong relationship of non-warranty service work as well.

Oh well, we cannot change their minds....

Diane

[Robert Phelps]

Diane,
Just curious who you are dealing with in St Louis. We looked at a lot of units at several different dealerships. Ended up buying from Apache Village. they gave us the best deal, have a great customer service attitude, and were great when servicing our unit.

We've since moved away from St Louis and I've found that Camping World offers the best attitude for performing service on our 5er. We called other local shops, all asked if we bought from them and gave us attitude when we said no. Camping World didn't even ask, they just scheduled our service for the first available opening the following week. You have a CW about 100 miles from you. Still not great, but better than 300 if you can't work with the local guys on your purchase.

Thank you,bsmith0404. Apache Village is the dealership that informed us they wouldn't work on the unit at all, warranty work or after-warranty work. This surprised us, to say the least. Years ago, my parents used Apache, and they had never purchased a unit from them. When we bought our TT 8 years ago (used from a private individual) we took it to them for service regularly. They never mentioned this policy to us then. Maybe this policy only pertains to makes/models they sell and is something that has grown in the last 15 or so years.

We are checking with other non-Premier dealers and will also check out Camping World.

Diane