How to select the right tow vehicle?

[G-town]

We are going to buy a 2014 montana, 39 foot. We like the Chevy. Just trying to figure out if we need a 2500 HD SWD or a 3500 HD SWD.. Any advice?


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[chuckster57]

Best way is to know weights, and weight ratings of the tow vehicle. Once you know the pin weight, you can start looking for a truck that will carry it PLUS the weight of everything your going to have in the truck when you hook on including the weight of the hitch and full fuel tank(s).

FWIW I think your into 1 ton dually territory.

[GmaPaTime]

Don't really think a HD2500 is going to cut it and only the weights will tell.

Word of advise IMO, better to have a little more truck then you need then to max out a smaller one. :)

[GaryWT]

As others have said, what is the loaded weight of the trailer and loaded pin weight. Also, what are the tow capacities and payloads of the trucks. Once all that is known, it will be easier for you to pick a TV. Good luck.

[cblong]

weights are of course important. but the 3500 SRW has I think a 38 or 36 gallon tank and some 2500's only have a 22 gallon tank. just another thing to look at. if I had to buy my truck again I would have gotten a 3500 SRW. my 2c

[therink]

What is the gvwr of the trailer? Multiply that figure by .20 to estimate what the loaded pin will weigh. I'm guessing a Montana that long will weigh about 14,000 loaded witha 2800 lb pin weight.
Looks like minimum 1 ton SRW truck or dually if you plan on towing a lot.

[Woodsrider]

I agree with what's been said above. You're on the edge of DWR territory. Err on the side of caution and spring for a dually. You cant have too much truck for the trailer, but you can have too much trailer for the truck. FWIW, pulling that much around, I personally would buy the Duramax/Allison, and add an exhaust brake if you plan on dragging it around the mountains.

[dsttexas]

After looking into this myself for the 2015 Chevy, I offer the following from their specifications regarding payload capacity (includes hitch weight and everything else in the truck - more important than towing weight). 2500's about 2700 lbs, 3500 single wheel about 4200 lbs, and 3500 dually about 5200 lbs.

As I also looked at a lot of 2015 RV models, many 'shorter' ones (usually less than 35') would be within the 2500 model class. Those much more than that length would be really pushing the 2500's limits.

Look at the numbers.

The 2015 RV I just bought (32') will easily fit on a 3/4 ton truck when I get ready to trade down in a year or so.

[gearhead]

If I only knew then what I know now, I'd a got a Freightliner.
My F350 single rear wheel payload capacity is 3265#.
And I'm "THERE"
edit: my 305rl advertised hitch weight is only 100 pounds more than the 293rk.

[JRTJH]

After looking into this myself for the 2015 Chevy, I offer the following from their specifications regarding payload capacity (includes hitch weight and everything else in the truck - more important than towing weight). 2500's about 2700 lbs, 3500 single wheel about 4200 lbs, and 3500 dually about 5200 lbs.
As I also looked at a lot of 2015 RV models, many 'shorter' ones (usually less than 35') would be within the 2500 model class. Those much more than that length would be really pushing the 2500's limits.

Look at the numbers.

The 2015 RV I just bought (32') will easily fit on a 3/4 ton truck when I get ready to trade down in a year or so.

The payload specs you've listed are for the "entire series" of 2500, 3500 and 3500DRW trucks. The only way you'll get 4200 pound payload in a 3500 SRW is the single cab long bed WT 2 wheel drive model. Chevrolet, like Ford and Ram, list the "best possible payload" in the specs sheet. As the truck gains in options, it loses in payload. Most 4x4 3500 SRW crewcab duramax LTZ models are much closer to 3000 lbs payload than to 4200 pounds. The doorjam stickers I've seen are in the 3000-3300 pound payload.

There is a current thread warning specifically about taking the "literature" values and making significant mistakes in calculating payload. All of the literature is "sales focused" and lists the "best possible" not the "reality based" data. http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20643

[gtsum2]

The payload specs you've listed are for the "entire series" of 2500, 3500 and 3500DRW trucks. The only way you'll get 4200 pound payload in a 3500 SRW is the single cab long bed WT 2 wheel drive model. Chevrolet, like Ford and Ram, list the "best possible payload" in the specs sheet. As the truck gains in options, it loses in payload. Most 4x4 3500 SRW crewcab duramax LTZ models are much closer to 3000 lbs payload than to 4200 pounds. The doorjam stickers I've seen are in the 3000-3300 pound payload.



There is a current thread warning specifically about taking the "literature" values and making significant mistakes in calculating payload. All of the literature is "sales focused" and lists the "best possible" not the "reality based" data. http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20643


Not entirely correct. I have a 2014 ram 3500 Laramie megacab srw with all available options and I have 4075lbs payload per the door sticker. And megacab a generally tend to have a bit less payload than cc models

[gearhead]

One of the problems is you don't know until it's too late. Suppose: You have a truck, you're looking at 5th wheels. You have to make an educated guess. I don't think the dealer will let you put your stuff in the trailer: your clothes, the wife's 28 pair of shoes, 12 cans of soup, a case of bottled water, tools, fill all the water tanks, add 2 batteries, 2 tanks of propane; and then let you drive off the lot to weigh it and come back to tell them it's too heavy for your truck, you want something else. Remember to add 250 pounds for the 5th hitch.
So....listen to folks on here or another forum about their actual weights. I never thought my pin weight would soar like it did, but it did.

[JRTJH]

Not entirely correct. I have a 2014 ram 3500 Laramie megacab srw with all available options and I have 4075lbs payload per the door sticker. And megacab a generally tend to have a bit less payload than cc models

Last I heard, Ram doesn't build Chevrolet trucks. You can't take an apple and compare it to oranges. You won't find a 4200 pound payload in a Chevrolet LT or LTZ crewcab 4x4 3500 SRW.

[gtsum2]

Last I heard, Ram doesn't build Chevrolet trucks. You can't take an apple and compare it to oranges. You won't find a 4200 pound payload in a Chevrolet LT or LTZ crewcab 4x4 3500 SRW.

Lol, my bad. I didn't realize you were referring to only Chevy. I should have read all the threads. Sorry about that

[JRTJH]

Lol, my bad. I didn't realize you were referring to only Chevy. I should have read all the threads. Sorry about that

No problem, just trying to keep the facts (as best they are) about the truck in question.

How does that megacab ride when empty with that big a payload?

[gtsum2]

No problem, just trying to keep the facts (as best they are) about the truck in question.

How does that megacab ride when empty with that big a payload?

It is not too bad..on normal roads it is fine, but get on a rutted out stretch and she can be rough (not as bad as I originally thought though). The older Rams had payload numbers quite a bit lower...not sure if it was the changes introduced in 2013 that raised them up (new 50k cold steel frame etc).

Being the same wheelbase as a CC with long box helps a bit I imagine. However there was a stretch of Interstate I hit in Ohio this past summer (cant recall which one) and I thought it was going to rattle my kidneys out:)

[BOWWOW]

I agree with what's been said above. You're on the edge of DWR territory. Err on the side of caution and spring for a dually. You cant have too much truck for the trailer, but you can have too much trailer for the truck. FWIW, pulling that much around, I personally would buy the Duramax/Allison, and add an exhaust brake if you plan on dragging it around the mountains.

I agree, nothing is worse than being under trucked, DWR all the way can't beat the stability.

[danisr1]

2015 HD2500 LTZ 4X4 Crew Cab with the Duramax has a max payload of 2793.

The SWR 3500 is 4264.

You get quite a bit more going to the 3500 and the cost isn't much different.

I have the 2500 with the above package and its a great truck, you will love it.

[Javi]

I guess I'm different or something "how" the truck rides has never been a problem with me.. How it drives, how it pulls, and how it hauls.... Yep you bet... but how it rides... if I want a Cadillac ride I'll buy a Cadillac


As to how to find the right truck to pull a trailer... Well that's another kettle of fish 'cause all the truck and the trailer manufacturers and almost all the sales persons are pretty darn good at stretching the truth till it's tighter than a fiddle string.

[gearhead]

2015 HD2500 LTZ 4X4 Crew Cab with the Duramax has a max payload of 2793.

The SWR 3500 is 4264.

You get quite a bit more going to the 3500 and the cost isn't much different.

I have the 2500 with the above package and its a great truck, you will love it.
Are you getting those numbers off the internet, or off the yellow sticker inside the truck door?

[therink]

I guess I'm different or something "how" the truck rides has never been a problem with me.. How it drives, how it pulls, and how it hauls.... Yep you bet... but how it rides... if I want a Cadillac ride I'll buy a Cadillac


As to how to find the right truck to pull a trailer... Well that's another kettle of fish 'cause all the truck and the trailer manufacturers and almost all the sales persons are pretty darn good at stretching the truth till it's tighter than a fiddle string.

The payload on my 3500 (per sticker) is 3750 for comparison.

My bad, I meant to quote gearhead

[gearhead]

The payload on my 3500 (per sticker) is 3750 for comparison.

My bad, I meant to quote gearhead

Yeah, I'll give you a couple hundred pounds for the shortbed. But that is a great payload.
Believe me, if I could have found a Chevy at the time, I would have bought it.

[gearhead]

From Chevrolet.com. First link is the 2500. Next is 3500. I couldn't find anything for an optioned out LTZ. This is MAX payload for I assume a base model or LT. CC long bed.
http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado-2500hd-heavy-duty-trucks/specs/capabilities.config%3Dcrew_cab_long_box.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado-3500hd-diesel-trucks/specs/capabilities.config%3Dcrew_cab_long_box.html

[JRTJH]

From Chevrolet.com. First link is the 2500. Next is 3500. I couldn't find anything for an optioned out LTZ. This is MAX payload for I assume a base model or LT. CC long bed.
http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado-2500hd-heavy-duty-trucks/specs/capabilities.config%3Dcrew_cab_long_box.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado-3500hd-diesel-trucks/specs/capabilities.config%3Dcrew_cab_long_box.html

It's my understanding that the ratings listed on those websites is for the WT truck (base model) and that the LT, LTZ, Denali will all weigh more, reducing the payload. But I don't think the ratings as listed can be correct.

Apparently, using Chevy's ratings on that site, if you add the truck weight and the payload, it doesn't equal what they list as the GVW. Also, if you look at the GCWR, if you're towing a max weight fifth wheel, you can put no cargo or passengers in the truck: GCWR 24500, Fifth wheel 16900. That only leaves 7600 pounds. The truck EMPTY weight is listed at 7652, so the numbers just don't add up. (these numbers are with the 3.73 axle ratio). These are only a small sampling of the "inconsistencies" in the numbers that "just don't add up" in those charts.

I'd say that the information on those websites is an example of the discussions occurring in the thread, "Warning: Don't believe the salesman or the literature" located: http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20643&highlight=salesman

The only "really accurate" way to determine the payload is to open the door and look at the numbers on the doorjamb.

Additionally, (Someone who has a current model Chevrolet truck might be able to verify this), I read on another camping forum today that there is a decal in the glove compartment that further restricts the cargo weight if a camper is a part of the payload. I don't know whether anyone has researched those limitations. Do they apply only to "slide in campers" or is any "camper" that puts weight on the bed included? It appears that the "glove compartment sticker" for the 3500 series that was used in that discussion, reduces the payload for campers to a maximum of 2900 pounds. I have not verified this (just read the discussion this afternoon), so if a member with a 2015 Chevy could check the glove compartment and let us know what it says? The discussion on that forum was that Chevrolet reduced the cargo allowance and included the passenger weight calculations as a part of payload ??? That sounds "different" to say the least and "questionable" given the common understanding of GVW minus vehicle weight equals allowable payload (no matter how it's used: passengers or cargo).

[Keywestparrothead]

It's my understanding that the ratings listed on those websites is for the WT truck (base model) and that the LT, LTZ, Denali will all weigh more, reducing the payload. But I don't think the ratings as listed can be correct.

Apparently, using Chevy's ratings on that site, if you add the truck weight and the payload, it doesn't equal what they list as the GVW. Also, if you look at the GCWR, if you're towing a max weight fifth wheel, you can put no cargo or passengers in the truck: GCWR 24500, Fifth wheel 16900. That only leaves 7600 pounds. The truck EMPTY weight is listed at 7652, so the numbers just don't add up. (these numbers are with the 3.73 axle ratio). These are only a small sampling of the "inconsistencies" in the numbers that "just don't add up" in those charts.

I'd say that the information on those websites is an example of the discussions occurring in the thread, "Warning: Don't believe the salesman or the literature" located: http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20643&highlight=salesman

The only "really accurate" way to determine the payload is to open the door and look at the numbers on the doorjamb.

Additionally, (Someone who has a current model Chevrolet truck might be able to verify this), I read on another camping forum today that there is a decal in the glove compartment that further restricts the cargo weight if a camper is a part of the payload. I don't know whether anyone has researched those limitations. Do they apply only to "slide in campers" or is any "camper" that puts weight on the bed included? It appears that the "glove compartment sticker" for the 3500 series that was used in that discussion, reduces the payload for campers to a maximum of 2900 pounds. I have not verified this (just read the discussion this afternoon), so if a member with a 2015 Chevy could check the glove compartment and let us know what it says? The discussion on that forum was that Chevrolet reduced the cargo allowance and included the passenger weight calculations as a part of payload ??? That sounds "different" to say the least and "questionable" given the common understanding of GVW minus vehicle weight equals allowable payload (no matter how it's used: passengers or cargo).

JRTJH - As always, thank you for your help and support in this an many other issues that we post. However, I am confused when looking at my door jamb sticker, I show a front and rear GAWR but nowhere does it show my actual total weight (I CAT scaled it and with me, the hitch and 1/2 tank it was 9,780 lbs.) I see the 9,100 lb in the tag, but that is in the rear GAWR section. What am I missing? :banghead:

[JRTJH]

JRTJH - As always, thank you for your help and support in this an many other issues that we post. However, I am confused when looking at my door jamb sticker, I show a front and rear GAWR but nowhere does it show my actual total weight (I CAT scaled it and with me, the hitch and 1/2 tank it was 9,780 lbs.) I see the 9,100 lb in the tag, but that is in the rear GAWR section. What am I missing? :banghead:

Don't get a headache "banging your head". There should be two stickers on your doorjamb. One is the one you posted. The GVW is listed on the second line, just under "FORD MOTOR CO." It is listed as 6340KG (14000 lbs).

You say your truck with fuel/driver scales at 9780. Calculating your payload, it would be 14000 - 9780 = 4220 pounds. That would be "close" to the payload that should be listed on the YELLOW sticker on the doorjamb. That sticker has the front/rear tire inflation information. The top line of that sticker should read: "The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed xxxx" and give a value in kilograms and pounds.

This value is listed with the vehicle EMPTY of cargo and FULL with fuel. There is a 150 pound allowance for the driver. So, your weight with 1/2 full fuel tank and you (depending on weight difference from 150 lbs) will be "close to that sticker weight". To my knowledge, the total vehicle weight is not listed on any Ford product. It's a matter of actually weighing it, or calculating it by subtracting the "payload" (yellow sticker weight) from the GVW (detailed vehicle sticker)...

[Keywestparrothead]

Don't get a headache "banging your head". There should be two stickers on your doorjamb. One is the one you posted. The GVW is listed on the second line, just under "FORD MOTOR CO." It is listed as 6340KG (14000 lbs).

You say your truck with fuel/driver scales at 9780. Calculating your payload, it would be 14000 - 9780 = 4220 pounds. That would be "close" to the payload that should be listed on the YELLOW sticker on the doorjamb. That sticker has the front/rear tire inflation information. The top line of that sticker should read: "The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed xxxx" and give a value in kilograms and pounds.

This value is listed with the vehicle EMPTY of cargo and FULL with fuel. There is a 150 pound allowance for the driver. So, your weight with 1/2 full fuel tank and you (depending on weight difference from 150 lbs) will be "close to that sticker weight". To my knowledge, the total vehicle weight is not listed on any Ford product. It's a matter of actually weighing it, or calculating it by subtracting the "payload" (yellow sticker weight) from the GVW (detailed vehicle sticker)...

Ahh. Ok, that makes sense now. Thank you for clarifying. My yellow stick shows 4,760 so i have a curb weigh of 9204, according to the Mfgr and DOT. Guess I need to go up my plates to 10k from 9k then :-)

[JRTJH]

Ahh. Ok, that makes sense now. Thank you for clarifying. My yellow stick shows 4,760 so i have a curb weigh of 9204, according to the Mfgr and DOT. Guess I need to go up my plates to 10k from 9k then :-)

Yes, if your yellow sticker shows 4760, then equipped as the truck "LEFT THE FACTORY" you had 4760 pounds of payload allowance. Keep in mind that anything the dealer added and things that you've added, paint protective finish, stain guard, etc from the dealer, and/or heavier floor mats, bed mat, tool box, map set in the glove compartment, GPS stuck on the windshield, tire gage in the door compartment, etc, all have to be deducted from the "original factory sticker" so when you got a weight at the CAT scale of 9780 with the hitch and you in the truck, you're probably very close to your actual weight "without you" in the truck. If you really want to get "accurate" then fill the fuel tank, load it as you would for a trip, then weigh it with NO passengers or driver. That will be your "starting point". Subtract weight for all the people, cargo, purses, coolers, anything you add to the bed, and subtract the "actual weight on the pin box and you'll have your truck weight as you're ready to travel.

Honestly, If I were you, I'd take everything out of the truck, get a weight with the fuel tank "close to empty" and see if you're under the 9000 lbs. If so, then keep that CAT slip for registration purposes. If I remember, Florida charges registration on vehicle weight, not on GVW, so if you can prove you weigh "under 9000", then there shouldn't be any problem.