Converter Confusion

[Anson9110]

Hi, I'm a newbie with Travel Trailers and I'm preparing for my first season. I would like to ask a question about a switch to turn the converter/charger off. If I'm running the trailer from the batteries only, is it ok to turn the converter off to prevent the charging loop WHILE I also have the trailer plugged into an inverter I plan on installing. Basically, I want to be able to use the outlets while stopping the charging loop. The switch was installed by the previous owner. I've looked for this answer and have not been able to find it. Thanks for any help on the subject. Anson.

[PARAPTOR]

Hi, I'm a newbie with Travel Trailers and I'm preparing for my first season. I would like to ask a question about a switch to turn the converter/charger off. If I'm running the trailer from the batteries only, is it ok to turn the converter off to prevent the charging loop WHILE I also have the trailer plugged into an inverter I plan on installing. Basically, I want to be able to use the outlets while stopping the charging loop. The switch was installed by the previous owner. I've looked for this answer and have not been able to find it. Thanks for any help on the subject. Anson.

May want to specify your trailer type. For clarity, the converter is a 120VAC device and if the switch you are referring to shuts off the AC to the converter, they will be no charging current to your batteries or any 12VDC supplied to your trailer. You stated you are running your unit off batteries only (no shore power) therefore there would be no 120VAC and the converter would be off. Sounds like you are wanting to add an inverter (DC to 120VAC) and running it from your trailer batteries and then feeding its 120VAC inverter power output into your normal shore power inlet. I have seen others add inverters to feed specific separate 120VAC outlets but do not recall any posts that feed the entire trailer? Regardless of the source (inverter or shore power)of the 120VAC if you switch off the 120VAC to the converter it will be off with zero 12VDC output including battery charging current.

Have no experience with inverters feeding the entire trailer using the trailer batteries. I am sure there are others that may have more experience in this area.

[Anson9110]

Thanks for getting back to me, I appreciate the help. It's a 2002 efs281 cougar. Keeping in mind an extension cord is running from the shore power cord underneath the trailer to an inverter. I'm basically wondering if the converter and the charger work independently from one another? If turn the switch off would I still be able to outlets inside the trailer (Would the converter still convert the battery power to 120 in order to use the outlets?)
I'm really sorry if this is confusing... if so, please just laugh and disregard. (Wish I could draw a picture to better explain)

[unyalli]

Open your power panel and you will see circuit breakers like in your house. Turn off the one labeled conv or converter. Shoot us a picture of your open power panel. You just push the door and it will click and fall open.

Jeff

[Anson9110]

Thank you very much for your help. It's been bothering me for a little while and unfortunately the trailer is 3 hours away and under 5' of snow. Anxiously watching the weather channel and pacing a bit! What you said makes total sense.... I'm good with many things but electricity and I aren't friends.

[unyalli]

You will also want to turn off the one (if it exists) labeled water heater and ensure you run your fridge on gas. I'm talking circuit breakers here not fuses. Fuses are 12 volt stuff.

[Anson9110]

Thanks, will do for sure. I've spent the past few months reading and watching videos about the electrical so I'm getting there. Funny, I can build a house from scratch but when someone talks about electrical all I hear are similar voices to the teacher on the comic strip Peanuts.. blah, blah, blah.....
Thanks again!

[PARAPTOR]

Thanks for getting back to me, I appreciate the help. It's a 2002 efs281 cougar. Keeping in mind an extension cord is running from the shore power cord underneath the trailer to an inverter. I'm basically wondering if the converter and the charger work independently from one another? If turn the switch off would I still be able to outlets inside the trailer (Would the converter still convert the battery power to 120 in order to use the outlets?)
I'm really sorry if this is confusing... if so, please just laugh and disregard. (Wish I could draw a picture to better explain)

Again for clarity. In my experience the converter supplies both battery charging current as well as 12VDC to the trailer when 120VAC is supplied to the converter.ie not separate. For reference The converter converts 120VAC to 12VDC, whereas an inverter converts 12VDC to 120VAC. Not sure you were confused or it was a typo in the above quote :D I assume when you referenced outlets in your trailer it was the 120VAC ones. Again if this switch turns off the converter it is shutting off the 12VDC converted from the 120VAC source. :yawn:

As stated most of us have a 115VAC breaker for the converter in the power center. I am still curious about the switch you referenced as installed by the previous owner :confused:

Hope we have helped. Do not even want to think of any more snow. finally can see the soil. :D

Happy and Safe Camping

[Anson9110]

http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5221&stc=1&d=1394152633

[Anson9110]

So here's the switch he installed next to the converter and panel. I just can't remember what the previous owner told me (was overwhelmed and excited). All I can remember is he said it stops the "loop" when relaying only battery or vice-vera... Wish I took notes.

[PARAPTOR]

So here's the switch he installed next to the converter and panel. I just can't remember what the previous owner told me (was overwhelmed and excited). All I can remember is he said it stops the "loop" when relaying only battery or vice-vera... Wish I took notes.

I was hoping members with inverter experience would have chimed in. I tried looking at your picture but was very small and could not zoom in. Therefore could not tell it you had circled a wire coming out of the wall or if it was a switch?? You had mentioned that your trailer was a few hours away? was this an old picture you had or were you out there?

Not sure where we left you? There were some questions in my last post that have not been answered so I do not know where you are with this??

[Anson9110]

Thanks for getting back to me.... I've been checking in often. Sorry to not have answered your questions when you're taking the time to help! Yes, its the 120 outlets I'm referring to that I would like to use (after installing the inverter and plugging in the shore cord to it). I have re-read your last few posts and think I understand better now. Converter off= no 12volt at all is basically what it comes down to. So now I'm just left trying to figure out what the toggle switch he installed is for... I just remember him saying it was to stop the "charging loop" which I understood as not trying to charge the batteries FROM the batteries. I will try to contact him instead of driving other crazy:banghead:
If by chance you could guess as to what the toggle switch would be at least it would start my brain thinking.....Thanks again, I really appreciate it!

[Anson9110]

Oh sorry.... Thats the best picture I could do. I had to zoom in from another picture. It's a toggle switch. I haven't been able to get to the trailer for months due to the insane amount of snow.... (getting very anxious!!)

[PARAPTOR]

Thanks for getting back to me.... I've been checking in often. Sorry to not have answered your questions when you're taking the time to help! Yes, its the 120 outlets I'm referring to that I would like to use (after installing the inverter and plugging in the shore cord to it). I have re-read your last few posts and think I understand better now. Converter off= no 12volt at all is basically what it comes down to. So now I'm just left trying to figure out what the toggle switch he installed is for... I just remember him saying it was to stop the "charging loop" which I understood as not trying to charge the batteries FROM the batteries. I will try to contact him instead of driving other crazy:banghead:
If by chance you could guess as to what the toggle switch would be at least it would start my brain thinking.....Thanks again, I really appreciate it!

Do not worry about driving me crazy, been there long ago :( I think you got it, do not want to attempt to charge the batteries using the converter which is powered from 120VAC via the shore power cable while at the same time these same batteries are powering the inverter whose 120VAC output is feeding the shore power cable. :confused: Now that is a mouth full.

So I think the previous owner wanted a way to shut off the converter when using the trailer batteries to power the inverter. So he installed an on/off switch in the 120VAC line to the converter. Shutting it off when he was using the inverter to FEED THE SHORE POWER CABLE, thereby shutting off power to the converter. What I and another member was trying to say is usually there is a 120AC circuit breaker installed in the trailer power panel to do this same thing. So we were asking you if there was such a breaker in your power panel?? If there was then I have no idea why previous owner installed another switch to shut off the converter?? That is assuming that is what this switch he installed is for??

If you where at the trailer could just hook up to shore power and turn the switch on and off to see if converter is turned on and off??
I am sure I have given you a headache by now. With the information at hand and my knowledge this is my 2 cents.

Maybe if we make this thread long enough we will attract some members with inverter experience being powered by trailer batteries and whose output is feeding the shore power cable.

Hope this adds some clarity :eek:

[jsmith948]

I have ONE 120VAC circuit powered by an inverter, so I don't have the problem of the inverter supplying 120 VAC to the converter which would, in turn, supply 12v to the batteries. If that was only true it would be like the mythical perpetual motion machine. I have to agree with a previous post. You need to shut off the breaker for your converter. The switch you reference might have been added to shut off the converter. I do not know for sure, but, have heard that using a circuit breaker as a a switch will shorten its life, even though all of the campgrounds seem to rely on a breaker to kill the power to the pedestal plug prior to our connecting. I don't know how many batteries you have connected to the inverter or the wattage output of your inverter. We have a 1000w inverter powering the t.v. circuit. It powers 3 plugs so we can watch t.v. or use the computer or charge our phones. The test would be to shut off the switch that you referenced and then test the output of your converter?

[PARAPTOR]

Thanks jsmith948, I was hoping some one with inverter experience would chime in. As I mentioned to the OP I have heard of people using there trailer batteries to power an inverter who's output then feeds 120VAC to a few plugs separate from the trailer plugs. But had never heard of anyone trying to feed their entire trailer through the shore power cable.

Thanks Again

[Anson9110]

You guys are amazing..... That's totally it! It was the whole "when the inverter is plugged in, turn the converter off" that was leaving me so puzzled. This leaves me with one more, final question I promise......Wouldn't this leave the 12volt system turned off and therefore nothing other than the 120 working in the trailer? (converter being turned off).
I've been preparing well for power during these incredibly long winter months. I took the entire solar power system from a cottage with 12- 6volt batteries and in addition I've purchased a Honda eu2000. I just haven't come up with a game plan yet on using it all in sync or separately.
I don't want to be someone who just leaches information from you guys and gives nothing back. I'm licensed to repair A/C and refrigerators so if you have any questions feel free to shoot them at me...that's all I can offer(tx)

[PARAPTOR]

You guys are amazing..... That's totally it! It was the whole "when the inverter is plugged in, turn the converter off" that was leaving me so puzzled. This leaves me with one more, final question I promise......Wouldn't this leave the 12volt system turned off and therefore nothing other than the 120 working in the trailer? (converter being turned off).
I've been preparing well for power during these incredibly long winter months. I took the entire solar power system from a cottage with 12- 6volt batteries and in addition I've purchased a Honda eu2000. I just haven't come up with a game plan yet on using it all in sync or separately.
I don't want to be someone who just leaches information from you guys and gives nothing back. I'm licensed to repair A/C and refrigerators so if you have any questions feel free to shoot them at me...that's all I can offer(tx)

With the converter off your are correct it will not provide any charging current to the batteries or 12VDC to the trailer. Your sole source of 12VDC will be your batteries. Basically these batteries will be supplying 12VDC to the entire trailer as well as your inverter. Just like if you were dry camping.

What the different is in your case, you are also supplying 12VDC to an inverter where its 120VDC output is feed in entire trailer through the shore power cable. You never mentioned the size of your inverter?

Remember like I said and jsmitch948 stated that his 1000W inverter feed only a few dedicated plugs. So he can basically control the load on his inverter. The way you are doing it by having the inverter 120VAC output feed the main shore power cable, all 120VAC devices/plugs in your trailer have access to that inverter's output. You are going to have to real careful what is plugged in throughout the trailer as well as people trying to turn various 120VAC devices such as AC, microwave, TV's etc.

Like I said never heard of anyone trying too do what you are wanting to do. Like I said if this thread keeps getting bigger we may attack more member opinions

Just came in snow rain mix and a snow storm forecast for Wednesday. Hope it is a normal forecast WRONG !!!

[PARAPTOR]

You guys are amazing..... That's totally it! It was the whole "when the inverter is plugged in, turn the converter off" that was leaving me so puzzled. This leaves me with one more, final question I promise......Wouldn't this leave the 12volt system turned off and therefore nothing other than the 120 working in the trailer? (converter being turned off).
I've been preparing well for power during these incredibly long winter months. I took the entire solar power system from a cottage with 12- 6volt batteries and in addition I've purchased a Honda eu2000. I just haven't come up with a game plan yet on using it all in sync or separately.
I don't want to be someone who just leaches information from you guys and gives nothing back. I'm licensed to repair A/C and refrigerators so if you have any questions feel free to shoot them at me...that's all I can offer(tx)

Forgot about your offer to help. Her is a link to someone with an AC problem

http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=15963

Again do not hold back on any future questions, This is how we share information and learn from others (tx)

[Anson9110]

I appreciate you saying that... makes me feel better as I was beginning to feel like I was just absorbing information and not adding anything helpful. The answer you just gave me was PERFECT! The batteries will still supply the 12 volt system as well as the inverter outputting 120VAC.
I will definitely follow the link you sent to see if I can help with the A/C problem.
I picked up a 1000w pure sine wave inverter from Canadian Tire which has received good reviews. The idea was presented to me by the previous owner so I assumed it was commonplace. I can see why you'd have to be careful as not to overload the inverter if all of the outlets are live. No kids tho, just a wife and her hairdryer:) (and a TV of course). Sorry to hear about the forecast! Same here... although we're seeing a small light at the end of this tunnel!!

[jsmith948]

Did you say TWELVE 6 volt batteries??
You will have plenty of reserve. What would that weigh?

[Anson9110]

Haha!! A friggin ton! I dis-assembled the solar power system at our cottage as we have run hydro to that side of the lake. I'm putting the trailer on the other side with no hydro yet. Funny thing tho, when we lost hydro (Toronto) over Christmas time I had the 12 batteries all tied in a bank and on a charger so I was happy I lugged them home!

[Festus2]

I am getting the impression that Anson9110 doesn't have the 12 6v batteries in his RV.

[PARAPTOR]

In post #17 of this thread, Anson9110 was discussing a side topic about a solar system with the 12 batteries at his cottage.

[Anson9110]

http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5271&stc=1&d=1394394930

[Anson9110]

I was thinking if I could build a little shed for the electrical, mount the solar panels somewhere and build a battery box for the batteries I could plug the shore power cord into it....similar to how it was running the cottage. Forgot to mention that once the trailer gets to its home it will live there for the rest of its life...

[jsmith948]

Well, that explains that:banghead:
You had me going there:rofl::rofl:

[Anson9110]

funny...so it's true...people can't read my thoughts!:)
Thanks to all for their help and experienced input.... really appreciated.