Auto Level Question

[hoffbrew]

With my old Raptor I put the lego blocks under tires to level up side to side, on new Fuzion it has Auto Level, do I need to still put lego blocks under tires to get close then hit auto level or just back her in and let it do its auto level thing? AND.....I am guessing I can keep my tripod at home now, not needed?

[canesfan]

My new Raptor has the auto level too. Only used it once on a small side to side incline with nothing under the wheels and it worked fine, lifted the door side wheels off the ground maybe an inch and put the 4th bottom step at the right height. :)

My thought is this, if you put stuff under your wheels your rig will be higher on that side and you will have less travel for the pistons to do their thing (or should I say the pistons will have to travel farther and may run out of travel).

My second thought is if you need more travel to put the legos under the jacks, not the wheels.

Hope that all makes sense.

As for the tripod, I'd say leave it at home. Mine is solid as a rock with the jacks down.

[hoffbrew]

Makes sence to me. When not on the level part of the driveway, I hit the auto level, dang it scared me at first, front end retracted almost all the way, started moving around and I thought it was going to turn into a transformer!! By the time it was done, the door side wheels were off the ground about an inch. Seemed pretty solid. I pushed retract, then auto level and the front retracted all the way down and stopped. I have to check this process again. Just a whole different ball game from the last 3 trailers I have owned.

[canesfan]

Yes, BE CAREFUL with the auto level! Make sure your truck is out from under it! It does dip the nose first and you don't want your truck under it. Thankfully my dealer warned me AND demonstrated it to me AND I read the manual. :) Haven't watched the DVD yet though.

Dealer also warned me about using the auto retract or whatever it's called. He said it doesn't know if your truck is under it or not, and it WILL retract all the jacks whether it is or isn't. His suggestion for idiot proof is to forget the auto retract and just use the manual front retract and the rear retract (or whatever it's called) so you know exactly what you're retracting. :) If I remember correct the rear retract controls both the rear and both the mid jacks.

Also, the recall or whatever it's called that is supposed to return it to the height it was when you unhitched may or may not work, depending if you are higher or lower then when you unhitched, I forget which, but there is info about it. I can't remember if there is something on this forum about it or where I read about how to make it work, but I've been managing to hookup for many years without a computer doing it for me.

[hoffbrew]

Dealer went over it with me and yes on truck not being hooked up. But once I got home and opened up the lid, everything he told me went right out the door!! lol, I will grab a couple more "sodas" and the book and go from there.

[hoffbrew]

But I do remember dealer telling me when I did auto retract the the trailer would go back to where it was before I hit auto level???

[canesfan]

Yeah, I remember the dealer going over it and me thinking, yeah, I'll forget this by time I drive off the lot. Then by time I got to the campground it was dark, my controls are in the LP compartment :rolleyes: and there is no light in there. Of course I couldn't see a thing, couldn't find my flashlight since everything was packed in boxes for the move from last rig to this one, so I'm lighting a match in the LP compartment to see the controls. :rolleyes: Have since solved the lack of light problem in the compartment with a battery LED puck light.

I thought there was another option besides auto retract that got you back to where you were before auto leveling. I'm not in front of it and I'll have to look at it now. I'll join you on the "couple more sodas" later this afternoon. :)

[hoffbrew]

I will grab some sodas and meet you by the trailer to figure this out!

[canesfan]

Sounds good to me! I'll meet you there. :)

Here's the online manual but my aren't exactly the same.
http://www.lci1.com/images/support/manuals/om-level-up-automatic-leveling.pdf

[hoffbrew]

I just found on YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M08moJU9ilE

[canesfan]

I saw that. Mine says different things, I wonder if it's a newer or older version?

Also, mine didn't come with the girl to push the buttons and move the truck. :D

[hoffbrew]

I guess I have the older version, mine wont push any buttons and I wont let her get close to driver seat and ....... oh wait... yes, control panel... yes looks like mine!

[canesfan]

Hmmm, know what you mean. :)

My control panel looks the same but seems the display readings are different and I don't recall pushing the 2 arrow buttons to get back to unhitch height, now I have to go out there and look at it (which will require some of those "sodas"). At least the sun is out and it's not freezing. Come on 4:00!

And now I have to look at my roof, too.

[hoffbrew]

I emailed Keystone Sunday about wheels coming off the ground:
*
*
Good morning Scot,

Thank you for contacting Keystone RV. In regards to your email, Scot when using the auto level the wheels should never leave the ground if you are in uneven terrain yes blocks may have to be used, once again you should never have the wheels off the ground this means the jacks are taking all the weight this can lead to component failure.

I hope this assists you

[bobbecky]

That is just a bunch of lawyer talk. What the heck, the front jacks are always taking all the weight. What is the purpose of having a leveling system if we are expected to hassle with leveling with pads under the low side tires before using a hydraulic level system?

[hoffbrew]

I was just trying to confirm but didnt get the answer I was looking for. I see motor coach wheels of the ground at RV parks?? Same concept?

[Quad]

I'm not understanding it ether. What would be the point of the leveling system if I still had to use blocks? I have the 4 point electric version and for over a year now been using it without blocks and have yet to have a problem. It lifts just fine, little here, little there until it levels. Like mentioned above mine use the same jacks to lift/lower the front while hitching as it does to auto level. So those jacks are always holding the weight of the camper in the front. Where would the difference be in that?


2005 Silverado 2500HD D/A
2013 Laredo 321BH

[canesfan]

Well, I have my own opinions, but let's look at this just because.

Say my rig weighs ~14000 lbs (note - all my figures are rough and rounded)

The front jacks are supporting rough pin weight per Keystone of ~2500 lbs.

That's ~1250 lbs per jack. If I lift one side off the ground, that's ~7000 lbs and each jack on that side is supporting ~2300 lbs.

How much can each jack lift/support? I don't know. Would Lippert tell us? I doubt it.

Here's what the online manual says:

> NEVER LIFT THE UNIT COMPLETELY OFF THE GROUND. LIFTING THE UNIT SO THE WHEELS ARE NOT TOUCHING GROUND WILL CREATE AN UNSTABLE AND UNSAFE CONDITION.

The word "completely" is a key word, what if I lift it "partially" off the ground? Yeah, I know, you can read into it however you want.

Opinions welcome. :)

[hoffbrew]

Those figures are going through my head too, I guess we need to find out how much weight these levelers can handle.

[hoffbrew]

lci1.com has a short video showing you "no more blocks to drive up on", "are you tired of trying to level"

[Quad]

I would think those figures would be a little low. I'd think they'd be holding more then the pin weight. You'd have to factor in cargo, and other things


2005 Silverado 2500HD D/A
2013 Laredo 321BH

[canesfan]

And another thing. It is called a "leveling system" as opposed to a "stabilizing system". How can you level something without lifting part of it or lowering another? I tend to think the whole lift the wheels off the ground thing is more of a CYA thing. Now maybe if I lifted the entire coach a foot off the ground, yeah, that might be "unstable", but I'm not thinking lifting one wheel an inch off the ground is making it "unstable". As a matter of fact it felt more stable than any other rig I've owned.

Now if the jacks collapsed under the weight than that would be unstable.

The above is my personal opinion and not to be taken as fact. :)

[canesfan]

lci1.com has a short video showing you "no more blocks to drive up on", "are you tired of trying to level"
What's funny in the video they show a diagram of a coach with no wheels held up by only the jacks. :D

[bobbecky]

While browsing around on another thread, a link was post about Trekwood RV Parts, and I just happened to see this: http://www.trekwood.com/products/138404/Jack-Jack-Leg-8000-w-Foot-Pad-For-BS-Auto-Level-Up-System
Seems they are saying the individual jacks are rated 8,000 lbs. If that is accurate, six jacks would have almost 300% the capacity of what these rigs weigh. I also understand, they are not intended to fully support side stress but are only rated vertical load, so there would be some danger if the entire rig were lifted off the ground, but if the tires on at least one side were in contact with the ground, I would think that would provide some stability to prevent bending the rams. Just my opinion "bouncey:

[hoffbrew]

I was hoping you saw that! I came across this video as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_URQEGYlG4

There is a spiff on that show Truck U, they show the LCI system working... note the toy haulers triple wheels.

This has confirmed for me. Next....... lol

[canesfan]

bobbecky, I tend to agree regarding having at least one side on the ground, and I'm trying to think why you would ever need to have all 4 wheels off the ground to get level anyway? Well, I've seen some campers trying to do some odd things, but, you know what I mean. :)

Also, thanks for the link. It says for a BS AUTO LEVEL UP SYSTEM, whatever that is I can't find it online but that leg looks a lot like mine.

hoffbrew, since that second video showing the triple axle with the wheels off the ground was posted by Lippert, well, you know, do I need to say anymore? :rolleyes:

Be careful and use common sense, it goes a long way when RVing. :)

:party:

[canesfan]

FYI, I just read somewhere if you store your rig for more than a week with the jacks down to use a silicone lube on the pistons weekly. Damn I can't find it now.

Edit - here it is http://www.lci1.com/images/support/manuals/om-levelup-fifth-web.pdf on page 3

If jacks are down for extended periods, it is recommended to spray exposed leveling jack rods
with a silicone lubricant every seven days for protection. If your coach is located in a salty
environment, it is recommended to spray the rods every 2 to 3 days.

[hoffbrew]

For sure! I am thinking an inch on one side is no biggie now, Both sides... No.

[bobbecky]

On the next to the last page of the Level Up Manual, this is what it says:

PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE PROCEDURES
1. Change fluid in RESERVOIR ONLY every 36 months.
a) Check fluid only when jacks are fully retracted.
b) Always fill the reservoir with the jacks in the fully retracted position. Filling reservoir
when jacks are extended will cause reservoir to overflow into its compartment when jacks
are retracted.
c) When checking fluid level, fluid should be within ¼” of fill spout lip.
2. Check the fluid level every month.
3. Inspect and clean all Pump Unit electrical connections every 12 months. If corrosion is evident,
spray unit with WD-40 or equivalent
4. Remove dirt and road debris from jacks as needed.
5. If jacks are down for extended periods, it is recommended to spray exposed leveling jack rods
with a silicone lubricant every seven days for protection. If your coach is located in a salty
environment, it is recommended to spray the rods every 2 to 3 days.

The manual is located at: http://www.lci1.com/support/leveling-stabilization/hydraulic-leveling/levelup

This page also has all the Lipsheets that have all the data, fluid recomendations, etc on their systems. Lipsheets are on left side, manuals in the center, service forms on the right. I have this site bookmarked so I don't lose it.

[hoffbrew]

Do you think the X-Chocks would help with this system? Trailer seemed pretty stout with the auto level.

[bobbecky]

I seriously doubt you will see any difference putting chocks, X-chocks, or anything else when using the level up. About a month ago, I serviced the wheel bearings and ended up replacing the brake assemblies as a couple had grease on the shoes and Redneck in Fowler doesn't stock the shoes but had the entire assemblies in stock. Also had to get the drums turned. Had the entire trailer raised on all six jacks for four days, and we full time, so still living in it, and never noticed anything different from when it is setup normally. I carry plastic chocks, just in case we have to drop it on a bad slope, but rarely have to use them.

[Ram189]

Libbert does a good demo of the system also on YouTube.

The Auto Retract will only go back to the hitch point if the front end started out above level I think.

If it has to lower itself I don't think it will go back up. Might be the other way around.

The youtube show was good about it.

[canesfan]

I don't see the need for X chocks at all. I didn't feel any movement whatsoever with the jacks down and I jumped around and all just to see how stable it was. But I'm also one who hates to drag around all kinds of extras, never had a tripod, never had X chocks, only put the rear stabilizers down if I had company or was staying more than a day or two. My biggest concern was if I put my beer down on the table and it didn't slide off onto the floor I was good. :D

[hoffbrew]

Over the weekend I will auto level again and check it out! The old Raptor was a bucking board without tri-pod and stabilizers down, drove me crazy.

[hoffbrew]

Trip was fantastic!! Everything worked great in and out of trailer. Towed beautifully up to Bass Lake.

I watched the YouTube video on the Lippert Auto Level over and over, still cant get it on the auto retract that puts the trailer back to where it was when you un hooked and before you hit auto level to begin??

[Quad]

When I unhook from my camper I raise it with the manual front raise and drive out from it. Then hit auto level and it does it's thing. When I'm ready to hook up I just hit the left and right arrow buttons together and then it'll retract all the jacks (or just front jacks, can't remember) to the memory height when I unhooked. Then just back under and I'm done. But if I manual stop the auto level, hit any other keys or sequence of keys, or my jacks run out of stroke it'll forget the memory height that I disconnect at.


2005 Silverado 2500HD D/A
2013 Laredo 321BH

[hoffbrew]

Called Lippert this a.m. and tech person said it was ok to have wheels off ground a little, you just dont want extreme off ground, I asked if 1-2" was ok, answer was yes.
tech said to be safe, park trailer on even flat ground and calibrate system and go from there.

[MBD]

As this thread is still alive, I will add: We full time in a Fuzion 342, it is one year old this month. The jacks have been down with no problem. Wipe them every so often with silicone rag. If I can find the brochure from when we bought the unit I will copy it because Fuzion states that you can use jacks to change tires. Every tire I have ever changed required the wheels/tires to be off the ground.

[beemerguy]

MBD I'm looking at a 2015 Fuzion, because I will be getting a 371. Page 12 states it will "lift 60,000 lbs. off the ground-need to change a tire"? I know all brochures have DISCLAIMER's, but thought this was interesting.

ron

[Cnc_hemi]

Be careful lifting ya tires off the ground all at the same time. If you flip ya hangers they can get stuck upside down and not flip back. The new axle systems are not meant to hang unsupported. I'm sure it will lift. Saw this happen it a couple at an Alabama state park. So be careful.


LSU TIGER FAN
2013 FUZION 310
2012 GMC 2500 HD SIERRA DURAMAX 6.6L