Air conditioner not working?

[patagoniadave]

Hello, tried a search and could not find anything on this, maybe I need some search tips.

Anyway, rig was just delivered, and I had a 50 amp service wired into our main box outside for when parked at home. The main air conditioner does not seem to be working, although it worked before it was transported. I am guessing it is something incredible simple that I am missing? I checked all the breakers, although have not pulled fuses yet (are the fuses only for the dc?) I have the propane off, and while I know the ac does not use propane, the furnace does, and the thermostat controls both? Grasping at straws there. I'll try and attach a photo of the controller.

Thanks

[SAABDOCTOR]

FUSES ARE 12VDC CIRCUT BREAKERS ARE 120VAC. YOUR AC RUNS ON AC ONLY.Need a bit more info here. fan work? relays click? or just plane dead? Sorry about the caps forgot to turn them off wasn't yelling. It's 3 degrees here ac! we don't need no stinkin ac just heat. have fun!

[patagoniadave]

FUSES ARE 12VDC CIRCUT BREAKERS ARE 120VAC. YOUR AC RUNS ON AC ONLY.Need a bit more info here. fan work? relays click? or just plane dead? Sorry about the caps forgot to turn them off wasn't yelling. It's 3 degrees here ac! we don't need no stinkin ac just heat. have fun!


:) It was over 75 in Tucson this weekend. Do not necessarily need the AC though, just wanted to make sure all of the systems were working when hooked up to power. (for all I know it could be my connection at the pole that is causign the problem).

Fan would not turn on, but I could hear relays clicking in the unit as I was fiddling with the controls. The fan would turn on for the furnace if I had it on the heat side.

[SAABDOCTOR]

Oh what I'd give for 75 right now!!!:Dany chance the new plug at your house is not wired correctly? sounds like maybe only half of your ac panel is getting power. How about other 120 volt stuff like the microwave tv set etc? one thing maybe to check is your power cord. there have been stories of the wires not secured to the terminals! if you are not comfortable working with ac give a qualified electrician a call let me know what you find. good luck. remember to unplug from shore power before you go fingerpoken!!

[JRTJH]

The fan for the furnace is DC, so there is no connection (other than they both use the same thermostat). If the relays are clicking in the A/C, the thermostat is working. Put the thermostat in COOL, the fan switch in AUTO, and either high or low. Adjust the temperature on the thermostat to about 60, and give it about 5 minutes to work. There is a "thermal cutout" built into the A/C to protect the compressor from starting until the head pressure is relieved. What happens if it "powers on" then off (clicking relays) is it will go into the thermal protection" and the delay must be "waited out".... It is between 3 and 5 minutes depending on model. Remember that "age" of the unit may also affect the relays.

If it doesn't start in 5-10 minutes, I'd doublecheck the power at the pole to make sure it's working properly, then check the "other end" of your power cord as there may be a loose connection somewhere in the plugs. Once you do that, if it's OK, pull the inside A/C cover and check the romex connections there to make sure they haven't vibrated loose.

If it was working previously, it's a power problem (or you're just not waiting long enough). My "guess" would be something in the way the power plug is wired.

Here's a link to the correct wiring for 50 amp power: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&ved=0CGgQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.janeandjohn.org%2Fdocs%2F50am pRVoutletInstallation.pdf&ei=Dc_nUvrzLofnsATvyIDwCw&usg=AFQjCNFqjL05PQ8RXTod5j4PC2sCDYPDCQ&bvm=bv.59930103,d.cWc

[mazboy123]

down size your 50 amp and use an extension cord and plug into a regular 110 outlet.

you are confusing 12volt with 110 volt.

[patagoniadave]

Ok, I did not realize that there was such a long time delay before the air conditioner kicks on, so hopefully that is the smack in the face stupid thing I was missing. Also, all of the rest of the electrical items were working, microwave, electric fireplace, television, and the aftermarket secondary airconditioner that has its own controls.

However, after looking at the wiring diagram link, and going out to my breaker box, I am nervous to plug back in and try. It is embarrassing to admit this much ignorance, but my breakers have 60's printed on the end of the switches. Does this mean they are 60 amp, not 50? Is this causing damage to my unit?

Not sure if this is related, or a separate issue. My landing gear motor has decided to quit working, or maybe the switch has? I put it down yesterday, and it bottomed out. Realized later that it was still too out of level, but I had already moved the truck so went back today to level it, and no motor. Was wondering if bottoming out tripped something, but could not find any reset switches on the unit, and the inline fuse seemed to be in tact. Now I am wondering if there are larger electrical issues, either that existed, or from my plug being wired wrong? I though the landing gear was on DC. Oh, and water (or fluid of some sort) was leaking out of the top of the battery as I was messing around with the landing gear.

Thanks for any help, I am working up to a mild panic attack, any thoughts to point me in the correct location would be more than appreciated.

[Festus2]

You said the fuse was "intact" ...... If the motor was working before you bottomed out.....

When you bottomed out or over-extended your front landing gear, this probably caused the gear fuse to blow. There is a 30A fuse located in the wiring harness about 12-18 in from the battery. The fuse is in the + wire and may be hard to find since it is probably inside the plastic coil wiring shield. It's there somewhere.
Instead of a fuse, you may have an auto reset breaker (30A/40A) so keep your eye open for this.

To avoid over-extending your jacks again, paint a red line, about 1 1/2" wide at the place on the jack where it bottoms out. Above this red line, paint another line - yellow or orange. When you lower your jacks, the yellow lines will be an indication that you should be releasing the switch very soon --- a caution if you like. Don't lower the jack into the red zone -- STOP!

Check the fluid levels in your battery - they may be overfilled. Are all the caps secure?
Did you see fluid coming out of the top of the battery? Or was there some just sitting on the battery top?

Hey - you said you weren't going to sweat the small stuff!! Take a deep breath and relax.... you'll be driving yourself crazy soon.

[patagoniadave]

You said the fuse was "intact" ...... If the motor was working before you bottomed out.....



Hey - you said you weren't going to sweat the small stuff!! Take a deep breath and relax.... you'll be driving yourself crazy soon.

:) My ignorance feels tremendous. Not crazy yet, but getting there. Going to try and upload some photos. I went back out and poked all over, could not find a reset switch. The inline fuse seems to be in the same wiring harness as the motor and switch for the landing gear. It looks ok, but I will replace it regardless. The fluid was coming out of the top of the batteries, which for some reason were uncovered when when the rig arrived.

I would actually be very happy if the landing gear was not working due to me bottoming out, at least I could point to the cause. I will happily pay the ignorance fee of a new motor, thank you for the redzone tip.

Air conditioner still will not kick on, it has been set at 40 degrees for about a half an hour, and I have the electric heat going to make sure it is at least over that.

[SAABDOCTOR]

Any chance the battery disconnect switch is in the off position? if it is the landing gear will not work.Just a thought. Also your breakers are 60 amp which will NOT do any damage to your electrical system. but did you confirm the power at your post as in the info john sent you? keystone has a sense of humor! the battery disconnect switch does not totally disconnect the battery, just the landing gear and the slide motor/pump motor go figure!.:banghead:

[patagoniadave]

Any chance the battery disconnect switch is in the off position? if it is the landing gear will not work.Just a thought. Also your breakers are 60 amp which will NOT do any damage to your electrical system. but did you confirm the power at your post as in the info john sent you? keystone has a sense of humor! the battery disconnect switch does not totally disconnect the battery, just the landing gear and the slide motor/pump motor go figure!.:banghead:

Well, I have no idea where the disconnect switch is, and would be much obliged if someone told me, but I was able to put the slides in and out on battery juice alone so guessing that is not it.

I am waiting for my electrician to come, and we will go over the diagram, and test the wire at the rig plug.

Thanks again to all

[SAABDOCTOR]

if the slides work it is on. my switch is in with the water and cable hook ups but mine is a 2010. After the electrician comes and you get squared away pour yourself a tall one. also if you have to go back to the dealer tell him he owes you a pdi walk through to show you how everything works. All most sounds like you got a "sign here and thanks enjoy your camper good luck" There is a sticky on the forum for a pdi check list print it out and take it with you if you have to go back. if everything works out read the list and do your own check and post questions here. if you wish feel free to pm me and i will get back to you asap. I hop on the forum inbettween repair orders at work and will be glad to help out. like john said don't sweat the small stuff and if your healthy it's all small stuff. Adult soda helps too:D

[patagoniadave]

if the slides work it is on. my switch is in with the water and cable hook ups but mine is a 2010. After the electrician comes and you get squared away pour yourself a tall one. also if you have to go back to the dealer tell him he owes you a pdi walk through to show you how everything works. All most sounds like you got a "sign here and thanks enjoy your camper good luck" There is a sticky on the forum for a pdi check list print it out and take it with you if you have to go back. if everything works out read the list and do your own check and post questions here. if you wish feel free to pm me and i will get back to you asap. I hop on the forum inbettween repair orders at work and will be glad to help out. like john said don't sweat the small stuff and if your healthy it's all small stuff. Adult soda helps too:D

No electrician till Friday now, will I be causing problems if I plug in and the plug is not wired properly, all of the other items seem to be working. Maybe I will just step away from the rig till Friday, and get caught up on work :-). New toys are distracting.

The pdi is grey area, I did get it from a dealer, but it was a private party consignment "as is". We did a minor walk through before purchase, and everything was working. Course it sat for a week, was moved around the lot, and then delivered to my place which is an hour drive through a mountain pass without having an rv behind. To the dealers credit, they replaced the hatch that blew of en route, gave me a new propane tank pigtail because the existing was leaking (glad we found that) and offered to send a guy down to look at the a.c. I just wanted to rule out any incredibly stupid things like "push the on button" before having the guy come all the way out here, and now I want to check the wiring on the plug first too.

Adult soda sounds like a fantastic idea. I am glad to be working the bugs out before a big trip, and got quite the work out manually leveling the rig with the hand crank.

If it turns out my motor on the landing gear is broken, I was wondering about an aftermarket upgrade that would run the two stands independently for easier leveling, but have not had time to sift through old threads yet.

Thank you very much for the offer of PMing! I may take you up on that, but do not want to abuse it, so for now will try to work with the data I have. Is beer delivery legal in your area? I may need to set up an account with someone if it is :)

[SAABDOCTOR]

PM ME ANY TIME it is ok may be unplug the unit till the electrician gets there and un hook the battery so you do not run that down too. as far as two seperate motors go for the landing gear nope they are gear together. to adjust for un even ground use the pin holes in the legs and blocks of wood. you want the camper to go up and down without twisting the frame! good luck on friday keep us informed.

[patagoniadave]

Thank you again, will post a follow up on my issues.

Good point on the frame twist. I kept seeing the option for 6 point leveling systems on the newer models, and figured there would be some sort of after market option for the older units. Probably waaaaay to pricey even if there was.

[patagoniadave]

In line fuse replacement did not fix the motor on the landing gear, so I guess next I will try to pull the motor and hook power up to it directly.

[JRTJH]

Before you start pulling the landing gear motor, you might want to locate the manual crank handle, insert it into the little hole and try to crank the landing gear about half a turn of the gearbox. Sometimes all that happens when you get to the extreme upper or lower travel is "jam" the gears. Often, is you can take the pressure off the gearbox the motor will have enough "umph" to take over and start to work normally again.

Keep in mind that if the drive leg goes up and down and the "follower" leg doesn't, there is a shear pin (actually a grade 5 bolt) in the top of the gearbox on the follower leg. That is not your problem right now, but it could easily be the culprit "next time"

As Festus2 said, DO NOT run your landing gear all the way up or all the way down. When you reach the end of travel in either direction, you stand a very good chance of destroying the gears and/or shearing that follower drive bolt.

I'd urge you to try to manually unjam the gears by using the hand crank before disassembly.

[patagoniadave]

Before you start pulling the landing gear motor, you might want to locate the manual crank handle, insert it into the little hole and try to crank the landing gear about half a turn of the gearbox. Sometimes all that happens when you get to the extreme upper or lower travel is "jam" the gears. Often, is you can take the pressure off the gearbox the motor will have enough "umph" to take over and start to work normally again.

Keep in mind that if the drive leg goes up and down and the "follower" leg doesn't, there is a shear pin (actually a grade 5 bolt) in the top of the gearbox on the follower leg. That is not your problem right now, but it could easily be the culprit "next time"

As Festus2 said, DO NOT run your landing gear all the way up or all the way down. When you reach the end of travel in either direction, you stand a very good chance of destroying the gears and/or shearing that follower drive bolt.

I'd urge you to try to manually unjam the gears by using the hand crank before disassembly.

Ah, I did something right! I tried that when it first happened, and it did not help. Hopefully the fact that I was able to manually jack the trailer up, put it on the truck, adjust the hole pegs, and put it back down means the gears are still in tact. The motor is not trying at all, either power is not getting to it due to something fried in the wiring, the motor is burned, or there is some reset switch that I am not yet able to find. I figured putting power directly to the motor would tell me, but did not want to do it while it is still attached.

Thank you for the feedback!

[patagoniadave]

:D

Not sure that "big grin" is the appropriate emoticon. Looking for something that denotes rolling on the floor laughing at myself.

So, went out to the rig, disconnected the battery (why only one when there is space for two?), took the wire nuts off of the motor and removed the two mounting screws. Took the wires on the motor, and touched them to the battery posts, it nearly spun out of my hands. Seems to be working, must be the switch? Mounted the motor back on, put the battery back in, and in the process took another look at the in line fuse. Looked awfully familiar. Took a closer look, yup, put the old one back in. There is now a large palm print on the left side of my face. Oh well, got excited, put a new one in, went to the switch, and....... nothing. Ok, switch is really freaking broken. Pulled the covering off of the wires, pushed them all onto the back of the switch to see if they were seated properly, and traced them through the sidewall to make sure that the in line fuse was really part of that system. It was. Oh well, started putting things away, noticed some extra wire nuts, looked up at the motor, and now there is a large palm print on the right side of my face. Took the battery back off, wired the motor back together, re-hooked up the battery, went to the switch, and....... She worked perfectly.

I put a red line just up from the bottom, and with my best Middle Earth Script, wrote "YOU SHALL NOT PASS". Will add some other lines next time I raise it.

On a side note, on the first day that it was not working, I noticed that the top left mounting screw had wiggled almost all the way out, it was not seated in threads at all. That probably helped contribute to my blown fuse when bottoming out.

Thank you so so much to all that helped me figure that out. Lets hope the a.c. is equally simple, I will post an update on Friday. (tx)

[JRTJH]

:bfart:

I don't know why I didn't remember this earlier, but.... Pop the front cover off your thermostat, check the 2 amp fuse. That may well be why your A/C isn't working......

MAYBE !!!!!!!!!!!! <shot in the dark> :)

[patagoniadave]

:bfart:

I don't know why I didn't remember this earlier, but.... Pop the front cover off your thermostat, check the 2 amp fuse. That may well be why your A/C isn't working......

MAYBE !!!!!!!!!!!! <shot in the dark> :)

Oooh, that sounds like something I will break when trying! Non the less, I will give it shot in the morning. Thank you

[patagoniadave]

popped teh cover off, and did not see anything that screamed "I am a fuse", but I am not sure what anything in there is.

Oh, found my battery cutoff switch, it had been removed and placed int eh silverware drawer, not sure why yet.

[patagoniadave]

Electrician just left. Power is (and was) properly wired at the plug, and we checked the end of the plug wire, it also has the proper currents coming through. He checked the wiring into the a.c., and said there is no power coming into it, so somewhere there is an interruption. All the breakers and fuses seem fine, it is a stumper.

Thanks to all who tried to help, if I figure out what it is, I will post a follow up.

[patagoniadave]

Ok, so I took what I thought was the main breaker panel off from where it is mounted under the fridge to see if I could find a place to mount a surge protector, and found another breaker box stashed behind it? Not sure what all of those breakers run, but one of them for sure runs the air conditioner, because it is all systems go now.

Is this a normal setup, or did someone do something aftermarket. Seems an awkward place to have a breaker panel. If nothing else, I am worried that the screws on the outer breaker box will strip out their osb holes if I have to access it very often. Maybe I won't, although will I need access to the surge protector on a regular basis? Maybe I can mount some sort of hinge to the outer box, that would allow it to swing open when I needed access to the space behind?

Thanks again to all who tried to help. Who knew there was a secret breaker box?

[hankpage]

It looks to me as if the previous owner upgraded to 50amp service. I'm surprised that your electrician did not not find that.

[patagoniadave]

It looks to me as if the previous owner upgraded to 50amp service. I'm surprised that your electrician did not not find that.

Upgraded? For some reason I assumed this rig came with that standard. That means they had to switch out the plug? so in theory I should have no trouble getting into it to install the power surge.

Oh, and it was hidden pretty well, I am not upset with the electrician, we assumed that it was all wired into the one panel.

[JRTJH]

What size is the main breaker in the outer electrical distribution panel? I mean the one that's attached to the wall that you have to take off to see the "other one"...... My guess, like Hank's is that your RV came with a 30 amp system and someone decided to upgrade it, but rather than buy the 50 amp breaker box, they bought a "cheaper" box to wire the second incoming leg and ran a couple of new circuits for the front A/C, etc. It's not an "unsafe" system, just an "unorthodox" one..... At this point, I'm wondering just how expensive it would be to buy a new 50 amp distribution panel, new converter and simply wire the entire thing properly. Shouldn't be much over a couple hundred bucks.... That might be something to put on your "to do" list for a "rainy day improvement" :)

Oh I'm still very curious about what size the main breaker is in your original distribution panel. I'm betting it's a 30 amp breaker.....

[patagoniadave]

What size is the main breaker in the outer electrical distribution panel? I mean the one that's attached to the wall that you have to take off to see the "other one"...... My guess, like Hank's is that your RV came with a 30 amp system and someone decided to upgrade it, but rather than buy the 50 amp breaker box, they bought a "cheaper" box to wire the second incoming leg and ran a couple of new circuits for the front A/C, etc. It's not an "unsafe" system, just an "unorthodox" one..... At this point, I'm wondering just how expensive it would be to buy a new 50 amp distribution panel, new converter and simply wire the entire thing properly. Shouldn't be much over a couple hundred bucks.... That might be something to put on your "to do" list for a "rainy day improvement" :)

Oh I'm still very curious about what size the main breaker is in your original distribution panel. I'm betting it's a 30 amp breaker.....

You sirs are very correct, it is a 30. So that means the 50 is an upgrade? I literally just started a post on how to hinge the outer panel for easy access, but maybe I should just replace the entire thing with a 50 amp service panel? Like you say, it gets me the new converter I was worried about the fan on.

Food for thought.

I cannot express how much I appreciate everyone's help, this has been a "jump in the cold lake" experience for me. So much to learn!

[patagoniadave]

oh, if I decide to wire this for a generator, does all teh service need to be moved out to the generator then anyway? I have not even begun to research generators or installs, it seems so far down on the list of priorities, as we are going to be plugged in almost all of the time

[JRTJH]

As for generator use, the simplest thing to do is to get a 3000 watt or two 2000 watt generators and a tether cable and just use your existing power cord to plug in. That way you're not installing genertors, transfer switches and fuel tanks to an existing RV. There's much more than just sticking a generator in a compartment and installing an off/on switch on the wall.

[patagoniadave]

As for generator use, the simplest thing to do is to get a 3000 watt or two 2000 watt generators and a tether cable and just use your existing power cord to plug in. That way you're not installing genertors, transfer switches and fuel tanks to an existing RV. There's much more than just sticking a generator in a compartment and installing an off/on switch on the wall.

I love simple!

[Tarfu]

Brought home, my new to me 2002 30' Sprinter, started exploring the rig, the frig, microwave, water heater, water pump, all electrical works, EXCEPT the AC fan....I can hear the pump running but not feeling anything from the fan...checked breakers, fuse panel next to the door everything looks good....any ideas where to start looking?

[Tarfu]

Ok...this is a TT that's sat for about 8 years unoccupied...opened the lid on the roof...nearly fell off when the wasps came pouring out...found a big wasp nest jammed in the squirrel cage...pulled the next....Got Air Flowing!!!