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09-14-2018, 06:00 AM
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#21
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imenzies76
I used antifreeze last year and it was cold enough to freeze it. Lucky that the lines didn't burst. ....
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The "claim to fame" for RV antifreeze is that it doesn't typically freeze solid, but turns to an icy slush. Even if it does freeze completely, it doesn't expand as it freezes. It's the expansion that causes the damage by splitting tubing, valves, etc.
Many people simply "run some pink stuff through the pipes, when it's pink at the faucet, they're good"... It doesn't work that way. The plumbing is filled with water, when you introduce RV antifreeze into the system, it mixes with the water and, until all of that mixture is pushed out of the plumbing, you don't have "full protection" to the advertised rating on the antifreeze container. What you do have is diluted antifreeze that can still cause damage if it gets cold enough, and yes, that dilution will freeze, expand and can damage or destroy your plumbing system. That's the reason to either "run until the faucets flow dark pink" or "blow the lines to remove as much water as possible before using antifreeze". It's "cheaper to remove the water with air" than it is to "remove the water with antifreeze" so most people in cold climates use a compressor before they add the antifreeze to their system. YMMV.
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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09-14-2018, 10:18 AM
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#22
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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Thank you sugarhillltd . Please do send pictures if you can. Would be helpful as I would think there in the same place. Thank you
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09-14-2018, 10:23 AM
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#23
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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Sugarhill ltd
Pictures would be very helpful as I am sure they would be in the same place. Will be in TN next Wednesday to winterize them grandsons 7 th Birthday then fly home to MD. Can’t wait to get the pictures and put all the advice to good use. I am sure I can do it. Just take my time got all day. Have to do it right as I do not want a repeat of this year replacing so many faucets. Will let you know how it went when I get finished.
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09-14-2018, 10:29 AM
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#24
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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To JRTJH
Thank you makes a lot of sense. One I replaced all my faucets and pipe that water hose connects too. I am hope I have no tubing that is bad. Guess the only way to find out turn on the water and see if you have good water pressure coming out. Fingers crossed! Will let everyone know how it goes.
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09-15-2018, 06:14 AM
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#25
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Flint Tx
Posts: 21
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Ok I will ask the obvious stupid question. Where do you insert the air blower to blow out the lines? I live in NE Texas and have always drained low points and water heater and put antifreeze in p traps. But with our new Cougar I want to go the extra step to be sure. Also we are due for colder than normal freezes. Normal for us is 20 F and colder than normal single digits. I usually don't have to worry much as we don't stay below freezing more than a few hours. BUT this may be the year.
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09-15-2018, 06:30 AM
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#26
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Macedonia
Posts: 217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWS
Ok I will ask the obvious stupid question. Where do you insert the air blower to blow out the lines? I live in NE Texas and have always drained low points and water heater and put antifreeze in p traps. But with our new Cougar I want to go the extra step to be sure. Also we are due for colder than normal freezes. Normal for us is 20 F and colder than normal single digits. I usually don't have to worry much as we don't stay below freezing more than a few hours. BUT this may be the year.
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The fitting screws into the city water inlet: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002XL2IEA...537021797&sr=1
__________________
DocP (Michael)
Former: Keystone Cougar 32RLI and 34TBS
Current: 2019 Georgetown GT5 31L5 motorhome
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09-15-2018, 06:32 AM
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#27
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mountain Home, Idaho
Posts: 3,012
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I prefer to use low pressure air to blow out water system first. This is done after draining water heater and low point drains ...
A RV air hose adapter is available at just about any place selling RV stuff. Wally World carries it as well
Make sure to also blow out outside shower drains and washer line.
I then pump RV anti freeze thru all fixtures and toilet.
And don’t forget to blow out the black tank flush as water will sit in the line and anti siphon valve and crack if it freezes.
__________________
2007 GMC Classic club cab 4x4 Duramax LBZ
2014 Alpine 3010 RE. 34 foot fifth wheel
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09-15-2018, 06:49 PM
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#28
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Flint Tx
Posts: 21
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Thanks for reminding about the black tank flush. It wasn't even on my radar!
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09-16-2018, 12:56 AM
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#29
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Gone Traveling
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Ajax
Posts: 431
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Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.
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09-16-2018, 04:46 AM
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#30
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyDean
To JRTJH
Thank you makes a lot of sense. One I replaced all my faucets and pipe that water hose connects too. I am hope I have no tubing that is bad. Guess the only way to find out turn on the water and see if you have good water pressure coming out. Fingers crossed! Will let everyone know how it goes.
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One of the easiest "shortcuts to check plumbing leaks" is to just turn on the 12 VDC pump and let the system pressurize, then close all the faucets and listen for the pump to cycle. If there are leaks, it will run momentarily to repressurize as the leak reduces the standing pressure. If the pump doesn't turn on through the night, you don't have any leaks. If it does, something's either dripping out a faucet, a fitting or a broken pipe.
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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09-16-2018, 04:54 AM
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#31
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,995
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingRobert
Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.
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That's a good way to dislodge the O-ring in the backflow valve located on that "stem" that you're pushing. If you dislodge the valve, it will leak when using the 12 VDC pump to flow water through the system.
Consider this: If you use compressed air, you'll push the water out of that part of the line, and when you add the anti-freeze, it'll backflow into that section of the plumbing to "fill the void" created by using the air to displace the water. There's no need to "push the stem" and risk destroying the backflow valve on conventional fill systems. If you have a "convenience center" with all the connections/fittings in one location, you "could have" a different setup, so check to be sure. However, on separate city water fill ports, blowing them with air will displace the water sufficiently to protect it from freezing.
As for putting antifreeze in the fresh water tank. Many find the taste/odor of RV antifreeze to be offensive. It takes hours and hours of flushing the fresh water tank to clear the antifreeze. If the tank is empty, the small amount of water remaining on the floor won't be able to expand and stress the tank, so there's no danger of damage from freezing. YMMV
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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09-16-2018, 05:46 AM
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#32
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingRobert
Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.
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I don't think most people mess with the city water inlet check valve. I've never heard of one freezing. Putting antifreeze in the fresh water tank will make for at lot of flushing to that tank to remove it. As was already stated some water left in the tank freezing won't hurt it, as long as it's not in the drain valve. When I de-winterize the system I'll mix a little bleach with the water and use the fw system to flush the lines instead of city water. My thinking is is that after setting over winter season here in MD where temps can swing from 80 to near zero why not cleanse the fw tank and kill any possible contaminants. Then flushing the camper with it will serve another use for it and use less water. YMMV
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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09-20-2018, 11:29 AM
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#33
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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A big thank you to all you who gave me great advice on winterizing my cougar
Thank you. With all your help and great advice I was able to save $250 and feel good about myself being able to do it myself. Everything went well following step by step procedures. One item I forgot to buy and don’t need it till I go out in May is a new shower head and hose. Did look over my water heater for about 1/2 hour followed the hoses and my unit does not have a cold and hot water shut off valve. Jut one that shuts both off and by passes at the same time. Now I have a permanent pump winterizing kit on the pump.
One happy camper!
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09-20-2018, 11:33 AM
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#34
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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I Scratch on the side of my 2015 cougar extra light fifth wheel.
Scratch on the side of my 2015 cougar extra light fifth wheel.. it’s about 12 inches don’t know how it got there. Under my window. It is noticeable. Most of the scratch doesn’t go all the way through the decals or the paint not sure if it’s paint or not but about 3 inches in the black detail it does go through the decal and is rough. Any suggestions To fix this issue as it is my home away from home and I take pride in it like everyone else takes pride in their’s. Thank you
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09-20-2018, 11:33 AM
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#35
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Macedonia
Posts: 217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KennyDean
Thank you. With all your help and great advice I was able to save $250 and feel good about myself being able to do it myself. Everything went well following step by step procedures. One item I forgot to buy and don’t need it till I go out in May is a new shower head and hose. Did look over my water heater for about 1/2 hour followed the hoses and my unit does not have a cold and hot water shut off valve. Jut one that shuts both off and by passes at the same time. Now I have a permanent pump winterizing kit on the pump.
One happy camper!
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Good for you. Nobody is going to care more about doing it right than you. My wife thinks I'm crazy (she's a "just pay the guy" sort of person), but I really enjoy working on my camper and learning everything about it that I can.
__________________
DocP (Michael)
Former: Keystone Cougar 32RLI and 34TBS
Current: 2019 Georgetown GT5 31L5 motorhome
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09-20-2018, 11:59 AM
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#36
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: prophetstown
Posts: 318
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I messed with that valve and it never quit leaking,, ending up replacing it,, wasn't much room to replace, but eventually got it with nearly every knuckle bleeding lol
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09-20-2018, 12:12 PM
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#37
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Gone Traveling
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Ajax
Posts: 431
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I've seen a few videos now about pushing that button in on the city fill to let some antifreeze out? Apparently that valve can be damaged in freezing temps. It made sense to me letting any air or water out and having antifreeze at that valve also. How does that valve work when you hook up the city water? Doesn't that button/button get pushed in when there's pressure?
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09-20-2018, 01:04 PM
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#38
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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DocP
Yes in deed. Need to learn everything there is to know on the camper. It will save$$$$$ and it’s fun too. Before I take off in May I will be sure to pick up the correct tools and put them u set into the storage
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09-21-2018, 01:33 PM
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#39
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingRobert
I've seen a few videos now about pushing that button in on the city fill to let some antifreeze out? Apparently that valve can be damaged in freezing temps. It made sense to me letting any air or water out and having antifreeze at that valve also. How does that valve work when you hook up the city water? Doesn't that button/button get pushed in when there's pressure?
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One more advantage to blow out the lines with low pressure air.
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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09-21-2018, 03:34 PM
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#40
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Silver Spring
Posts: 25
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Just completed my winterizing and all I needed was to push the valve in air and pink cane out. So should be ready for winter. Fingers crossed. When May comes I hope all I have to do is drain and go camping. My lesson was costly but sent most of them.
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