5 years on tires - MUST REPLACE

[jerseyphil]

So, here goes my HORROR story!
This past July, my wife and I went on a cross-country trip...NJ to California and back.
OF COURSE, I read all the posts saying you must change your tires after 5 years, but being a smart *** that I am, I looked over the tires, saw NO cracks whatsoever, (I mean really scrutinized them), and decided to go with them.
BIG MISTAKE!
TWO BLOWOUTS LATER, near Carlisle, Pennsylvania, limping into a rest stop on a Sunday night, I assessed the damage. Significant damage.
Both plastic skirts....gone.
Body work on 1 side mangled.
In the wheel wells, the insulation torn out leaving the plywood bare underneath on both sides, since I had 1 blowout on each side.
Someone at the rest stop had a phone number of "John's Mobile RV Service".
Called them. They couldn't come out until Monday morning.
They came. Took all 5 wheels off my RV, brought them to their shop, put on FIVE 12-ply rated Gladiator tires (don't know how good they are, but they were the best they had).

At the next RV Park, I went to Lowes and bought a 4 x 8 sheet of 2" thick styrofoam and 3" wide gorilla tape. I repaired the underneath.

SO....BOTTOM LINE.
It doesn't matter how good your tires look, or how few miles are on them.
Don't be a jerk like I was. Be Smart.
FIVE YEARS - REPLACE THOSE TIRES.

[notanlines]

Phil, there are those who will follow your advice, and then there are those who will post these same stories as yours down the road. I also might change that time period to reflect more along the lines of three-four years unless the brand has the word 'King' in it. Then we swap to the word 'immediately!'

[busterbrown]

Yep, very typical of a blowout event. Service life in my book is 3-5 years on ST tires, no matter the condition or miles. I like the insurance of replacing after a "3 seasons of use" mark. Prevention is instrumental with trailer tires.

Also to note, reserve carrying (load) capacity is something that can help mitigate failures as ST tires age. Having this reserve capacity will help a tire last through those service years.

[jerseyphil]

Thanks for your replies.

Phil

[Lee]

Please post make/model of blown out tires.

Do you have a TPMS?

Thanks,
Lee

[Ken / Claudia]

Also what was the build date on the tires? If you do not know they could have been years old already when you brought them.

[Hblick48]

Originally Posted by busterbrown

Yep, very typical of a blowout event. Service life in my book is 3-5 years on ST tires, no matter the condition or miles. I like the insurance of replacing after a "3 seasons of use" mark. Prevention is instrumental with trailer tires.

Also to note, reserve carrying (load) capacity is something that can help mitigate failures as ST tires age. Having this reserve capacity will help a tire last through those service years.

And that's why I went from load range E to F when I replaced my tires. Of course, I also had to buy new rims since the original ones weren't rated for the air pressure needed for the higher load range.

[CWtheMan]

Throughout the tire industry there are areas where one can research tire life expectancies and find feedback for 3-10 years. Those expectations differ with basic tire design such a Passenger, Light Truck and Special Trailer tires. Mileage tires seem the get the highest time limit recommendations.

Being an “age out” tire the Special Trailer tire (ST) was for many years given a 3-5 year life expectancy. The load it’s expected to support each day plays a significant role in just how long it’s going to last. Other factors are present such as being operated very close to its limit at speeds very close to its limit. They will degrade faster to a point they can no longer support the load they are carrying.

One of the factors in the life expectancy of ST tires is their low speed rating. It’s much better now than it was before the manufacturers added speed letters or MPH limit identifications on the tire sidewalls. Any ST tire without a speed identification displayed on its sidewall is mandated to a maximum speed of 65 MPH. The ST tire’s speed rating is telling us a little something about its ability to carry the load it’s designed to carry. That’s the tires maximum load shown on the tire sidewall. Properly inflated it will carry that load up to and including its speed restriction. Above that speed restriction the tire will start degrading and increase the percentage of degrading with every MPH above the limit.

The real bottom line is tire history and an owner’s knowledge of that history and how the tire was maintained.

[busterbrown]

Originally Posted by Hblick48

And that's why I went from load range E to F when I replaced my tires. Of course, I also had to buy new rims since the original ones weren't rated for the air pressure needed for the higher load range.

I did something similar; went from a ST205/75/14 LRC tire to a ST225/75/15 LRE. Everything the frame rails has been changed out for something bigger and more robust (springs, axles, hangers, tires, and wheels). Failures with any of these components can be vacation ending when your 2500 miles away from home. I worry less now on the road.

[jadatis]

@ topicstarter.
Can you give me weight of TT ( its a TT???) . And specifications of tires.
Then I will calculate a safe pressure for you with my made extra safe calculator and system.
Give tirespecs of old and new then.


If tires have been damaged only once by overheating, they look fine, but mechanical forces distroy them slowly , until mayby only after 3 years, that much damage that they blow or treath seperation.

Additional methode to check the tires yourselfes, is to hammer the treath, and yudge the sound, if gavaties are underneath the surface.

Then together with a high enaugh tirepressure, 6 to 10 years after first use is possible.

If a professional checks them, question is , if he also only checkes the outside, so not better then you.

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by busterbrown

I did something similar; went from a ST205/75/14 LRC tire to a ST225/75/15 LRE. Everything the frame rails has been changed out for something bigger and more robust (springs, axles, hangers, tires, and wheels). Failures with any of these components can be vacation ending when your 2500 miles away from home. I worry less now on the road.

In tire industry lingo, that's "plus sizing". It invalidates the inflation pressures in the vehicle owner manual, tire placard and what's on the vehicle certification label. Did you set a new recommended cold inflation pressure for the replacement tires? It's a necessary step for vehicle safety reasons.

[LHaven]

Originally Posted by notanlines

Phil, there are those who will follow your advice, and then there are those who will post these same stories as yours down the road. I also might change that time period to reflect more along the lines of three-four years unless the brand has the word 'King' in it. Then we swap to the word 'immediately!'

Ahh, boogers. My rig came off the lot with "Trailer Kings." I'm all the way on the wrong side of the country, and now I have one more thing to worry about.

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by LHaven

Ahh, boogers. My rig came off the lot with "Trailer Kings." I'm all the way on the wrong side of the country, and now I have one more thing to worry about.

Your trailer is in the new era of load capacity reserves for RV trailer tires. You have 4400# axles with tires providing 5660# of load capacity for each axle.

http://trailerkingtires.com/content/...rranty0817.pdf

[LHaven]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

Your trailer is in the new era of load capacity reserves for RV trailer tires. You have 4400# axles with tires providing 5660# of load capacity for each axle.



http://trailerkingtires.com/content/...rranty0817.pdf

I have no idea what the implications of this are. It sounds like you're saying that the axles and not the tires are my weak point in terms of load rating, but I don't understand how that does or doesn't reflect on that particular brand of tire having a reputation of being defective "China bombs."

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by LHaven

I have no idea what the implications of this are. It sounds like you're saying that the axles and not the tires are my weak point in terms of load rating, but I don't understand how that does or doesn't reflect on that particular brand of tire having a reputation of being defective "China bombs."

Users are not equal. In the past, your OEM tires have been installed on trailers with very little load capacity reserves. Many of the complaining consumers did not know their tires were being abused and when they failed early "it just had to be bad tires". ST tires today, are not the ST tires they were 5 years ago.

I gave you a warranty reference for those tires. Did you read it? It's not just a warranty. It contains information on the care and maintenance of those tires.

All tires on RV trailers are required to carry the maximum load of the vehicle certified axles. Load capacity reserves are derived from the difference between the tire maximum load and the axles maximum load. Axles do not degrade anywhere near as fast as tires. Tires on RV trailers degrade quite rapidly, especially when misused and/or not properly maintained.

You really don't want the tires to be the weakest link. They blow and make a mess of your trailer's wheel wells and those sacrificial fenders.

[jerseyphil]

I have to get some facts together before I fully reply to some of the questions. It is early Sunday morning here in NJ and still dark.

Some of the info re: tires that blew will embarrass me, but..... whatever.
I bought the 5th wheel RV, a 2011 Keystone Cougar 318SAB, in October, 2010. That means it is now 9 years old.
YES, the original tires, were the ones that blew. I told you it would be embarrassment. They were Towmax China bombs. I try to find better info on them. I think I wrote it down.
The 5th wheel was rated about 9200 lbs empty, so loaded up, I probably at 13 to 14 thousand lbs.

I get info on the new tires in a little while.
Thanks for the interest and comments by everyone.

Phil

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by jerseyphil

I have to get some facts together before I fully reply to some of the questions. It is early Sunday morning here in NJ and still dark.

...I bought the 5th wheel RV, a 2011 Keystone Cougar 318SAB, in October, 2010. ...
The 5th wheel was rated about 9200 lbs empty, so loaded up, I probably at 13 to 14 thousand lbs...Phil

To set the record straight, here's the specs on the 2011 Cougar 318SAB from the Keystone website:
Empty weight: 9495
Cargo weight: 2485
Pin weight (empty): 1580

That would give a GVW of 11980

With these "facts", to state that the trailer was "probably at 13 to 14 thousand lbs" would mean that the trailer was significantly overloaded as well as being supported on "9 year old OEM tires"...

At this point, maybe it's all speculation, but I'd suggest a "true and accurate weight" before going much further. Why? Even with the strongest tires available, all you're doing, if you are exceeding the trailer GVW by as much as 2000 pounds, is moving the weakest link from the tires to another structural component.

The issue, IMHO, is to keep the trailer within its "design criteria and design limitations" not to "make things OK by assuring the new tires won't blow if the trailer is significantly overloaded beyond the GVW".....

If your trailer is "loaded to 13 or 14 thousand lbs" with a GVW of 11980, you're going to have troubles again, possibly in an area that causes significantly more damage than "just a blown tire and wheelwell damage". You could possibly break a pinbox, lose an axle at towing speed, have the trailer "break in the middle" from being overloaded, or heaven knows what.... I'd urge a CAT scale weight before going any further, hopefully your estimate of 13 or 14 thousand lbs is "way wrong".....

You have definitely "solved your tire problems" with such heavy duty tires, but what have you done for the "real problem of being overloaded" ???

[jerseyphil]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

To set the record straight, here's the specs on the 2011 Cougar 318SAB from the Keystone website:
Empty weight: 9495
Cargo weight: 2485
Pin weight (empty): 1580

That would give a GVW of 11980

With these "facts", to state that the trailer was "probably at 13 to 14 thousand lbs" would mean that the trailer was significantly overloaded as well as being supported on "9 year old OEM tires"...

At this point, maybe it's all speculation, but I'd suggest a "true and accurate weight" before going much further. Why? Even with the strongest tires available, all you're doing, if you are exceeding the trailer GVW by as much as 2000 pounds, is moving the weakest link from the tires to another structural component.

The issue, IMHO, is to keep the trailer within its "design criteria and design limitations" not to "make things OK by assuring the new tires won't blow if the trailer is significantly overloaded beyond the GVW".....

If your trailer is "loaded to 13 or 14 thousand lbs" with a GVW of 11980, you're going to have troubles again, possibly in an area that causes significantly more damage than "just a blown tire and wheelwell damage". You could possibly break a pinbox, lose an axle at towing speed, have the trailer "break in the middle" from being overloaded, or heaven knows what.... I'd urge a CAT scale weight before going any further, hopefully your estimate of 13 or 14 thousand lbs is "way wrong".....

You have definitely "solved your tire problems" with such heavy duty tires, but what have you done for the "real problem of being overloaded" ???

AFTER I READ THIS, I decided to take a close look at what I was carrying. The MOST I was carrying was about 2000 lbs. That includes everything, fresh water, stuff in pickup bed, stuff in storage areas, etc., so if my empty weight is about 9500 lbs, I was about 11,500, not 13 or 14 thousand.
Sorry about throwing that in to panic people!!

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by jerseyphil

AFTER I READ THIS, I decided to take a close look at what I was carrying. The MOST I was carrying was about 2000 lbs. That includes everything, fresh water, stuff in pickup bed, stuff in storage areas, etc., so if my empty weight is about 9500 lbs, I was about 11,500, not 13 or 14 thousand.
Sorry about throwing that in to panic people!!

I'd still recommend a "true and accurate" weight by visiting a CAT scale and get some "objective weights" rather than relying on ""a close look at what I was carrying" (which is still a 'best guess' kind of weight).

The only way you'll know for sure what your trailer, truck and rig weigh, and what weight is actually on the tires and king pin is to tow it across an accurate scale.

[skids]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

The only way you'll know for sure what your trailer, truck and rig weigh, and what weight is actually on the tires and king pin is to tow it across an accurate scale.

Sorry, just catching-up on this thread. Considering tow trailers, does changing the angle of the weight distributing hitch (assuming the scales are a bit of a hump) affect the weights on the axles. Would it be accurate?