Hello from Kentucky

[wiredgeorge]

Originally Posted by rhagfo

Well before 2006 most trucks didn't have payload stickers, but they had a VIN sticker which had GVWR, and front and rear GAWR. All the Payload sticker introduced about 2006, was do the math for you, taking the curb weight (with allowance for a 150# driver) and subtracting that from the GVWR.

That said the Payload sticker is only valid on an unmodified new vehicle sitting on the dealers lot!

The best way to determine CURRENT payload is to scale the vehicle loaded ready to tow, then the difference between the scaled weight and the GVWR, is the available payload for the hitch.

The payload sticker is a good way to guestimate if you have enough payload for a 5th wheel you are considering. Hard to pull a camper off a lot and go to the scales before owning it. Better to know if you are close to exceeding your tow vehicle's payload by estimate. I know what my truck's payload is and look at some of those 40' 5th wheels and can estimate and know they are not for me without buying a dually.

[JoeVMorton]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Answered on the other thread. The payload indicated by the sticker 34xx is the amount this truck can safely carry. The rest of the number might mean something but that payload number is usually the short pole in the tent. I had an F250 pulling a trailer almost the same size as the one you are considering (2002 Cougar 278EFS) and have no idea what the payload was (1996 model) and the truck had drum rear brakes which I could smell in the hills/canyons of the Hill Country. Now have a 2006 F350 (6.0L 4x4 LWB) and the payload is right at 4K lbs. Other than the hot rear brakes, the 7.5L gas engine pulled the camper fine. I suspect I was over whatever payload that truck had been rated for; no placard on a 1996.

I am probably using the wrong term here, but I think that the "towing capacity" is good. In haul mode the engine breaking of the diesel is pretty amazing. I have hauled 7-8K of horses and like you said, you don't really even notice them.

The thing that I didn't understand was the payload number. I guess in part because we never had a gooseneck.

Thanks for providing some real life info though, that's sort of what I was thinking it would be.

[JoeVMorton]

Originally Posted by jxnbbl

Welcome from NH!

Thanks Jay, nice to meet you!

[JoeVMorton]

Originally Posted by rhagfo

Well before 2006 most trucks didn't have payload stickers, but they had a VIN sticker which had GVWR, and front and rear GAWR. All the Payload sticker introduced about 2006, was do the math for you, taking the curb weight (with allowance for a 150# driver) and subtracting that from the GVWR.

That said the Payload sticker is only valid on an unmodified new vehicle sitting on the dealers lot!

The best way to determine CURRENT payload is to scale the vehicle loaded ready to tow, then the difference between the scaled weight and the GVWR, is the available payload for the hitch.

Ours isn't modified, so hopefully it would be close. Do the dealerships usually have a scale?
Thanks,
Joe

[JoeVMorton]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

The payload sticker is a good way to guestimate if you have enough payload for a 5th wheel you are considering. Hard to pull a camper off a lot and go to the scales before owning it. Better to know if you are close to exceeding your tow vehicle's payload by estimate. I know what my truck's payload is and look at some of those 40' 5th wheels and can estimate and know they are not for me without buying a dually.

Yes, that's the thing, I would have to purchase it to be sure. It seems that at 20% pin weight it would be fine. I do get that it's potentially (or likely) at the max for payload though.
Thanks,
Joe

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by JoeVMorton

Ours isn't modified, so hopefully it would be close. Do the dealerships usually have a scale?
Thanks,
Joe

Originally Posted by JoeVMorton

Yes, that's the thing, I would have to purchase it to be sure. It seems that at 20% pin weight it would be fine. I do get that it's potentially (or likely) at the max for payload though.
Thanks,
Joe

It's not just modifications that you have to consider. The curb weight increases (payload reduces) with everything you put in the truck. The GPS on the dash, the tool box in the bed or under the back seat, the maps in the door, the running boards you added, that extra quart of oil or windshield washer fluid, the floor mats, the change in the console, the flashlight and gloves in the glovebox, the coloring book and crayons for the kids, the water dish for the dog, the hitch for the trailer, the 2" drawbar you left in the OEM truck receiver all add up and are "payload"..... So, don't just think "modifications", but think people and what they bring after you bought the truck.

Then, depending on the trailer floorplan and how you load, the pin weight will vary. Brochures list the "empty trailer pin weight" which is a "federal requirement to calculate the axle size" more than it is a "true and honest weight you can measure on the scale for every trailer. That "brochure weight" does not include propane in the tanks (60 pounds for most trailers) nor does it include the batteries, the spare tire or any options on the specific trailer. As an example, adding a second air conditioner to the front bedroom will add roughly 75-100 pounds to the pin weight (above the brochure weight). So, the brochure is only a "might be close if you're lucky" type of specification.....

So, using a "specific percentage" is a mistake many people make, only to find they're off several hundred pounds. Most will do a "best case/worst case" calculation using two percentages to get a "pin weight range that should be more accurate".... I use 18% as the "best case" and 25% as the "worst case". Doing this helps prevent surprises. As an example, a 10K GVWR trailer would have a "pinweight range" from about 1800 pounds to about 2500 pounds....

So, when you do the "estimated calculations" you can be better assured that your specific truck payload will fall within the trailers "anticipated range". Then, with all the "stuff in the truck, the people in the truck and a full tank of fuel (also payload), you can add the "least probable" and then the "most probable" pin weights to get a better answer to the question: "Will my truck's payload be enough?" .....

[JoeVMorton]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

It's not just modifications that you have to consider. The curb weight increases (payload reduces) with everything you put in the truck. The GPS on the dash, the tool box in the bed or under the back seat, the maps in the door, the running boards you added, that extra quart of oil or windshield washer fluid, the floor mats, the change in the console, the flashlight and gloves in the glovebox, the coloring book and crayons for the kids, the water dish for the dog, the hitch for the trailer, the 2" drawbar you left in the OEM truck receiver all add up and are "payload"..... So, don't just think "modifications", but think people and what they bring after you bought the truck.

Then, depending on the trailer floorplan and how you load, the pin weight will vary. Brochures list the "empty trailer pin weight" which is a "federal requirement to calculate the axle size" more than it is a "true and honest weight you can measure on the scale for every trailer. That "brochure weight" does not include propane in the tanks (60 pounds for most trailers) nor does it include the batteries, the spare tire or any options on the specific trailer. As an example, adding a second air conditioner to the front bedroom will add roughly 75-100 pounds to the pin weight (above the brochure weight). So, the brochure is only a "might be close if you're lucky" type of specification.....

So, using a "specific percentage" is a mistake many people make, only to find they're off several hundred pounds. Most will do a "best case/worst case" calculation using two percentages to get a "pin weight range that should be more accurate".... I use 18% as the "best case" and 25% as the "worst case". Doing this helps prevent surprises. As an example, a 10K GVWR trailer would have a "pinweight range" from about 1800 pounds to about 2500 pounds....

So, when you do the "estimated calculations" you can be better assured that your specific truck payload will fall within the trailers "anticipated range". Then, with all the "stuff in the truck, the people in the truck and a full tank of fuel (also payload), you can add the "least probable" and then the "most probable" pin weights to get a better answer to the question: "Will my truck's payload be enough?" .....

Good advice, I wish the worst case looked better. At least now I know what might be ahead of me.

I found a scale to measure pin weight that I can keep at home. I think I am going to get one so that I can stay ahead of any possible issues.
Thanks,
Joe

[spicercars]

Welcome from northern MN.