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07-13-2019, 01:33 AM
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#21
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Site Team
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,337
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IIRC it was this one
https://www.amazon.com/Smart-RV-Surg...v+surge&sr=8-9
I have no idea where the original post went, maybe it was zapped by lightning.
__________________
2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.
Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
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07-13-2019, 06:23 AM
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#22
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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Get an analog voltage meter that you can plug into a 120v receptacle.
It has no automatic protective features - won't shut the power down for you - but will give you an "at a glance" reading of the ac voltage in your trailer.
I got mine at Camping World, but, I think you could find one at one of the big box stores.
Not saying you don't need an EMS or surge protector of some kind. Just saying it would let you know if you have a high or low voltage issue and give you some peace of mind at the campground until you get delivery of your EMS. BTW, I would also carry a multi-meter and a cheap polarity tester.
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Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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07-13-2019, 07:43 AM
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#23
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,995
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It looks to me like the "class of surge protector" being discussed is the SURGE GUARD 50 series.
According to Progressive Industries, the manufacturer, the following FAQ's should warn buyers that this is a "LIMITED PROTECTION" device. The following FAQ's are from the SSP questions:
https://www.progressiveindustries.net/faq
Q: Will these models provide voltage protection?
A: No. The surge protector models do not include voltage protection. The surge protectors strictly provide protection during an actual power surge. However, Progressive Industries surge protection units have additional features which include a built-in surge status indicator that note the condition of the surge protector, plus a dual line polarity tester that checks the status of the source prior to use. For complete protection, we recommend our EMS units.
Q: Will these models provide wiring protection?
A: No. The surge protectors do not provide wiring protection. They will identify an improper wire condition and will also shut off power if there are other conditions that are considered unsafe.
The EMS series actually "disconnects the RV from the power source if it tests unsafe" The SSP series does not do that, it only "warns of the condition"....
The only "protection" provided by the SSP models (the ones with the 3 lights on the faceplate) is a visual indication that something is wrong. THEY DO NOT SHUT OFF LOW VOLTAGE POWER TO PROTECT THE RV.
The EMS that you want (if you're buying this brand) is the EMS-PT50X. It has a monitor circuit AND will shut off power to the RV if there is a high or low voltage condition.
The SSP products will only "light LED's to warn of a problem while the RV receives the damaging voltage"
The EMS products will "TURN OFF VOLTAGE TO PROTECT THE RV.
The two models in this thread are SSP-50X and EMS-50X My recommendation is to steer clear of the SSP series......
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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07-13-2019, 04:19 PM
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#24
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Pageland
Posts: 247
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I went with a bluetooth Power Watchdog from Hughes for now. I will have a true EMS before next camping season, but for now this will do, IMO. It is a standard surge protector, but it does have a replaceable surge unit. It will tell you upon plug in if you have an open neutral, open ground, "L1 and neutral reversed". Aside from that, you can connect via Bluetooth and monitor wattage, amps, voltage, and KWH used. You can set custom alarms if any of the parameters rise above or below range.
It's also neat for me to watch amp and watt usage in real time and see the changes certain appliances make, and gives me a good feel for what I would be able to run with a generator of a given size.
It will not shut things off for me if voltage is low, but it will allow me to monitor the park power from inside my camper.
https://hughesautoformers.com/product/pwd30/
They have a 50 amp unit also.
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07-14-2019, 05:01 PM
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#25
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Panama City
Posts: 75
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I have the Progressive 50 amp. Went into park, plugged it in and voltage read 250. Pulled it out and went to another park and it read 120. Probably saved my electronics. I always plug it in first and check readings. If OK then plug in RV power cord.
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07-14-2019, 05:19 PM
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#26
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,685
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Sorry for the late post but I've been on the road for 3 days.
For the OP; if you can't get the EMS or anything else, take a VOM and use it. It will not protect you real time for an extended period but it will give you a look at the status of the power at the plug at "that moment in time" including grd/neutral/reversals/low-high voltage etc. I used to use one all the time and then.....I got an EMS!! Now THAT'S glamping!!
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Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
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07-14-2019, 05:59 PM
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#27
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 764
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The really important thing about 50AMP service is to have protection from a lost neutral. That will fry most/all the AC items that are plugged in. In a pinch I would use a 50A to 30A dog bone as 30 amp service does not create this condition of putting 240V across 120V items in the trailer if the neutral is lost.
The PI Hardwired EMS is the best as it protects against a shore power cable issue and the power inlet/cable reel issue if you have one. Chris
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
2015 RAM 3500 SRW CC SB Aisin Laramie
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07-14-2019, 06:13 PM
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#28
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Box Elder
Posts: 2,908
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There have been quite a few rigs damaged with a 30 amp outlet that has been miss wired with a hot leg to the neutral terminal in addition to the proper hot terminal which puts 240 volts into the rig.
A few hundred dollars spent on a quality EMS device is very cheap insurance to protect these rigs from a lost neutral or a lost ground or high or low voltage. Any of these conditions can damage the rig or a person that becomes the ground if the ground is missing from the pedestal. Like the old ad said, pay now or pay later, or the Dirty Harry quote-"Do you feel lucky?".
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Bob & Becky
2012 3402 Montana
2012 Chevy 2500HD D/A CC
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07-14-2019, 06:49 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 764
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I had 30 amp rigs for decades and never had an issue, including no converter failures. I now have two 50a rigs(a 5th wheel and a TT) and both have PI HW EMS' with remotes.
Chris
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
2015 RAM 3500 SRW CC SB Aisin Laramie
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07-15-2019, 07:46 PM
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#30
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: McLean
Posts: 31
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After careful consideration I decided on the Camco model... I did some research and found it was the best fit for my whole covering of both the low and high voltage... thanks everyone for your help.
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07-15-2019, 08:31 PM
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#31
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 764
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeyCougar
After careful consideration I decided on the Camco model... I did some research and found it was the best fit for my whole covering of both the low and high voltage... thanks everyone for your help.
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I do not see where that unit will drop the circuit if neutral goes away.
*Voltage protector protects your RV from excessive voltage and power surges
Automatically disconnects when dangerous voltage levels are detected
It has lights to indicate issues:
The water-resistant unit incorporates diagnostic lights for visual indication of faults for reverse polarity, open neutral and other power-pedestal wiring issues.
Light might be on after things burn up for loss of neutral. Am I missing something?
PI EMS unit states: Open neutral protection
(one of the most important features)
I can not find the Defender manual online to read about it in more detail. Chris
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
2015 RAM 3500 SRW CC SB Aisin Laramie
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07-15-2019, 09:22 PM
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#32
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,685
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I don't know that I would be comfortable with that unit. First, a readout is mandatory to me simply because it is handy and right here/right now without referring back to the "ledger" or whatever they call it.
Secondly, I don't think this unit protects you from the loss of neutral or other "stuff". It appears it will try to protect you upon startup but after that it will just notify you that your appliances were fried...after the fact as best I can tell.
"Protects your RV from dangerous high (>132 VAC) and low (<102 VAC) voltage levels
Automatically disconnects from dangerous voltage and reconnects after power stabilizes
Shows faults for reverse polarity, open neutral, and other power pedestal wiring issues
Integrated surge protection: 3,850 joules power rating for 50 Amps
Diagnostic lights for visual indication of fault
Protects your RV from dangerous voltage levels
Automatically reconnects after power stabilizes
Cautions user of power outlets wired with reverse polarity and/or voltage on ground
Integrated surge protection
Diagnostic lights for visual indication of faults"
"Protect your RV and appliances from high or low voltage levels and surges with Camco’s PowerGrip Voltage Protector and Circuit Analyzer."
"Once connected, it has a series of diagnostic LEDs that indicate the status of the source circuit. When compared to the key, different lighting combinations will alert you of any electrical issues. The voltage protector protects against faults for reverse polarity, open neutral and other wiring issues and will not let power through to the RV if any of these conditions are present during initial startup. Following startup, if the lighting sequence matches 'Power OK', then power will be supplied to the RV. In the event of a power surge or high/low voltage levels through the power pedestal, power will be disconnected and will reconnect only after the normal operating conditions have been restored. "
All of those descriptions sure sound to me like you won't have much of the protection other EMS units provide past startup. Trying to interpret "keys" is nonsense in this day and age. It specifically states "following startup" it apparently only protects against power surge and high/low voltage - one small step above a surge protector and not, from what I can tell, in the same ballpark as Surge Guard and Progressive...but extremely costly for what you get. I'm not a big fan of Camco and have never bought a product from them that was "top of the line" but that's JMO.
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
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07-16-2019, 05:17 AM
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#33
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Panama City
Posts: 75
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Let us know your experience
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07-16-2019, 05:38 AM
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#34
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 764
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Here is a good write up about it. http://www.henrylahore.com/rv/rv%20s...rotection.html
Back in the late 80's early 90's I had a electrical contractor lift neutral to a circuit that feed the back room computer equipment on a floor of one of the banks high rises in down town Seattle. They ended up paying 10's of thousands of dollars for new equipment.
I had a friend plug his American Eagle MH into a park outlet in California and the bill was over 10K to replace "things".
This a very important issue to 50 service RV, and one wants the best protection available.
Like I said earlier in the thread, we have two RV trailers and both have the hard wired PI EMS with remote displays at the electrical panel. Top item in both pictures.
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
2015 RAM 3500 SRW CC SB Aisin Laramie
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07-17-2019, 05:02 PM
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#35
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 21
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Consider the fact that if you do not have a surge protector of some form on your RV, your warranty will not cover any damages caused by power surges if there is no surge protector in place.
Even if you don't have it under warranty, the chance of a fire is greatly increased when you get power surges from shore power.
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07-18-2019, 09:17 AM
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#36
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Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Mesa, AZ
Posts: 58
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We bought a Surge Guard many years ago when all it had was a couple of lights. It has been used at every hook-up and we were grateful we bought this "insurance." We were at a campground where the neutral opened (aluminum wire) putting 220 Volts across the pedestal. The other campers around us lost TV's, inverters, power supplies, etc. Our simply shut off with no damage. this has happened to us twice. So send the bucks for the EMS because it is cheap compared to the damage without it.
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07-18-2019, 09:24 AM
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#37
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Eastern GTA
Posts: 195
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I have the hard wired 50A Progressive Industries EMS. I've installed a PI EMS in my last 3 campers. I like the security of having the hard-wired version but it sure would be nice to be able to plug in the portable before even backing your trailer into the campsite. When we had the 30A trailers, I used this Prime Products Power Line Monitor with a 30A-M to 15A-F adapter to check the 30A receptacle, but there's no such thing for a 50A. So, I've gotten into the habit of using a multimeter to check the 50A receptacle in the pedestal before plugging in.
__________________
2023 Rockwood Signature 8262RBS
2016 Ford F-250 XLT SuperCrew, 6.2L, 4x4, 6'9" bed, 3.73
2019 Rockwood Signature 8290BS (2019-2023)
2011 Rockwood Signature 8293SS (2014-2018)
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07-18-2019, 09:57 AM
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#38
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Tucson
Posts: 822
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Thanks to everyone for all the great responses! This is an expense I have been putting off - you guys have convinced me to do the right thing!
I just ordered a new Southwire Surge Guard #34951 and a #40301 monitor. This is the same EMS as the 34950 shown on the Southwire site but also includes an internal (bluetooth?) communications system to a remote wireless monitor. This gives complete protection and management features and allows remote monitoring of current levels, etc. Pretty slick system - but not cheap.
Here are the links to a couple of videos - I like this company where I made the purchase. Good website, great videos.
https://youtu.be/2ex3uVoHRgE?t=11
https://youtu.be/-u2umT-zbes?t=40
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07-18-2019, 10:04 AM
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#39
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Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Derry
Posts: 21
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I use a 50 Amp Surge Guard on My Keystone 29rld which I bought last September.
It has saved me twice.
I would no connect to a campsite with out it.
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07-18-2019, 12:12 PM
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#40
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Farmington
Posts: 1
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I bought a 50A Surge-Guard (hard-wired) as soon as we bought our 2007 Montana fiver. I could not imagine going on the road without one. With this installed, We have don't have the surges that cause light to suddenly glow brighter, have not even popped a bulb on the 120V side, while have had to replace some on the 12V side. The guard offers a lot of protection for the microwave, refrigerator, all the heating systems, air conditioners, etc. We got ours from Amazon.
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