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Old 04-07-2022, 10:27 AM   #1
Cgjersvik
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Solar Charging Questions

We have been learning all about our 400i Solarflex system with two 100 amp lithium ion batteries. The night of April 4th we tested the system to see how many amps would be consumed. The next morning 107 amps had been consumed. Since then, the next 2 days have been cloudy and the 200 amp batteries are only 91% charged. I thought the converter would continue to charge the battery especially at night. Output from the Solarflex system is within specs, but it seems to be the only system charging the batteries. Does the 390DS have a converter? If so, where is it located? How can I check it to see if it is working properly? Thanks in advance! - Charlie
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Old 04-07-2022, 10:52 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Cgjersvik View Post
We have been learning all about our 400i Solarflex system with two 100 amp lithium ion batteries. The night of April 4th we tested the system to see how many amps would be consumed. The next morning 107 amps had been consumed. Since then, the next 2 days have been cloudy and the 200 amp batteries are only 91% charged. I thought the converter would continue to charge the battery especially at night. Output from the Solarflex system is within specs, but it seems to be the only system charging the batteries. Does the 390DS have a converter? If so, where is it located? How can I check it to see if it is working properly? Thanks in advance! - Charlie
Depends on the converter.

RV wiring between battery and converter is always marginal, so there's a big voltage drop which forces a lower charge current. If you have a typical converter that charges to 14.4, absorbs at 13.8 and floats at 13.2, you would not get any charging at float, and you would get very slow charging at 13.8V.

A common technique is to disconnect the AC input to the converter (breaker or plug) for a few seconds and then re-energize it. This will restart the charging cycle.
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Old 04-07-2022, 11:09 AM   #3
Cgjersvik
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I think you may have hit the nail on the head. The converter is probably float charging and is probably set up by default for lead acid batteries. Just the same I reset the converter per your suggestion. Thanks!
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Old 04-07-2022, 11:22 AM   #4
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I meant to ask, what device is reporting the batteries at 91%?
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Old 04-07-2022, 11:25 AM   #5
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The Victron Smart Shunt using the Victron Connect App.
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Old 04-07-2022, 11:58 AM   #6
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The Victron Smart Shunt using the Victron Connect App.
Tickled to hear it. That's a number you can trust. Too often folks take the reading off some charge controller that reports % based on voltage, and it's bunk.

Are you using a Victron SmartSolar MPPT? If so, do you have them in the same VE.Smart network to have the shunt report correct battery voltage to the MPPT?
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Old 04-07-2022, 12:13 PM   #7
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Tickled to hear it. That's a number you can trust. Too often folks take the reading off some charge controller that reports % based on voltage, and it's bunk.

Are you using a Victron SmartSolar MPPT? If so, do you have them in the same VE.Smart network to have the shunt report correct battery voltage to the MPPT?
Yes, we are using a Victron SmartSolar MPPT and it and the Smart Shunt are on the same VE.Smart network. My only gripe was that Keystone did not include the Quick Start Guide for the 400i that contains all the settings for lithium batteries. It took a bit of searching until I stumbled across it. - Charlie
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Old 04-07-2022, 01:18 PM   #8
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Sounds great!
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Old 04-07-2022, 01:32 PM   #9
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My only gripe was that Keystone did not include the Quick Start Guide for the 400i

Everything is right there on Keystone's website.
From the main page, click on Owners, then Owners Manuals.

https://www.keystonerv.com/owners-manuals

Also, there is lots of info on YouTube.
I find that YouTube is one of the best places to look. Nothing beats a good video explaining how some issues can be resolved.
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Old 04-20-2022, 06:48 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Cgjersvik View Post
Yes, we are using a Victron SmartSolar MPPT and it and the Smart Shunt are on the same VE.Smart network. My only gripe was that Keystone did not include the Quick Start Guide for the 400i that contains all the settings for lithium batteries. It took a bit of searching until I stumbled across it. - Charlie
It's also worth hitting up your specific battery manufacturer for their recommended settings. I started with Battle Born's recommendations (along with the LiFePO4 preset) but Enduro (who we actually have) recommended slightly different settings.
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Old 04-20-2022, 05:45 PM   #11
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Following this conversation. We just purchased a Cougar 23MLS with the 400i package and I just upgraded to 2 Battleborn 100 Ah batteries. Our rig is also equipped with an inverter/charger which comes as part of the 400i package, which should also charge the batteries when on house power. Is your inverter turned on?

Honestly, I've called Keystone a couple of times asking about how the solar, converter, and inverter are all wired, and how they work together, but can't seem to get to anyone who really knows this system.
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Old 04-20-2022, 05:58 PM   #12
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Following this conversation. We just purchased a Cougar 23MLS with the 400i package and I just upgraded to 2 Battleborn 100 Ah batteries. Our rig is also equipped with an inverter/charger which comes as part of the 400i package, which should also charge the batteries when on house power. Is your inverter turned on?

Honestly, I've called Keystone a couple of times asking about how the solar, converter, and inverter are all wired, and how they work together, but can't seem to get to anyone who really knows this system.
I'll preface with I have no idea but based on my observations over the past week, it seems to charge via AC and solar simultaneously. I plugged the trailer in on Friday to top off the batteries before our trip and was still seeing SmartSolar reporting some wattage (late afternoon and it was down around 50w if I remember right). Once the batteries hit 100%, the app reported 0%.
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Old 04-20-2022, 06:12 PM   #13
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I'll preface with I have no idea but based on my observations over the past week, it seems to charge via AC and solar simultaneously. I plugged the trailer in on Friday to top off the batteries before our trip and was still seeing SmartSolar reporting some wattage (late afternoon and it was down around 50w if I remember right). Once the batteries hit 100%, the app reported 0%.
I assume your are correct. The solar controller can be set to charge a variety of different batteries, and I set mine via the app for LiPo batteries. I'm curious to find out what charge profile the converter and inverter are set up for. I assume the converter has just a typical charge profile, but maybe the inverter, since it came as part of the 400i package might be different(?)
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Old 04-20-2022, 06:25 PM   #14
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I assume your are correct. The solar controller can be set to charge a variety of different batteries, and I set mine via the app for LiPo batteries. I'm curious to find out what charge profile the converter and inverter are set up for. I assume the converter has just a typical charge profile, but maybe the inverter, since it came as part of the 400i package might be different(?)
Now that you mention it, does the a/c power go through the solar converter or is there a separate charger for shore power (trailer is in the shop or I'd go crawl in there)? I changed the solar converter to lithium but didn't even think to check for a standard charger/converter. I have the 400i with 2, 200ah Enduro Bajas.

Edit: if it does, perhaps that is why I was getting power via solar as well (the "Power Center/Converter" wouldn't provide enough voltage to top them off if it was still in AGM mode).
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:01 AM   #15
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The Victron Smart Shunt using the Victron Connect App.
I am installing a Victron Smart Shunt this weekend as part of upgrading our SolarFlex 200 to the 400i.

Question on how it is wired? Coming from the battery minus is obvious but where is it pulling the “System Minus” from? If possible a photo of your input to that lug and where it is coming from would be super helpful.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:02 AM   #16
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I have a 2021 Cougar 26RBS with the Zamp solar option of panels on the roof.. There are actually 4 ways batteries get charged in a trailer...

1. Shore power thru main trailer converter/charger
2. Roof solar power thru Zamp 30 amp converter/charger in my case
3. Side port solar panel and converter/charger if you have optional portable solar panels
4. Towing vehicle alternator when running

I bought and upgraded to two 100ah Battleborn LiFePO4 heated batteries...
-- I had to also upgrade my shore power converter to support a LiFePO4 charging profile... The 2022 trailers with lithium option should already have a suitable shore power converter/charger.
-- You need to set the roof (and side port if you have one) converter/charger to LiFePO4 pattern.
-- The towing vehicle alternator will most likely no be at a high enough voltage to 100% charge LiFePO4 batteries, but will not hurt the batteries for the time it is used.

For LiFePO4, you are looking for around 14.4/14.6 charging voltage for the bulk charging and 13.6/13.7 for the float charging...

https://battlebornbatteries.com/char...po4-batteries/
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:11 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by pasayten View Post
I have a 2021 Cougar 26RBS with the Zamp solar option of panels on the roof.. There are actually 4 ways batteries get charged in a trailer...

1. Shore power thru main trailer converter/charger
2. Roof solar power thru Zamp 30 amp converter/charger in my case
3. Side port solar panel and converter/charger if you have optional portable solar panels
4. Towing vehicle alternator when running

I bought and upgraded to two 100ah Battleborn LiFePO4 heated batteries...
-- I had to also upgrade my shore power converter to support a LiFePO4 charging profile... The 2022 trailers with lithium option should already have a suitable shore power converter/charger.
-- You need to set the roof (and side port if you have one) converter/charger to LiFePO4 pattern.
-- The towing vehicle alternator will most likely no be at a high enough voltage to 100% charge LiFePO4 batteries, but will not hurt the batteries for the time it is used.

For LiFePO4, you are looking for around 14.4/14.6 charging voltage for the bulk charging and 13.6/13.7 for the float charging...
Wouldn't the roof and side solar be connected to the same solar charge converter?
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:14 AM   #18
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Question on how it is wired? Coming from the battery minus is obvious but where is it pulling the “System Minus” from? If possible a photo of your input to that lug and where it is coming from would be super helpful.

System minus is the collection of ALL your minus/ground side wiring... Any "black" (minus) wiring that was on your batteries must be switched to this side.

https://battlebornbatteries.com/faq-all-about-bmvs/
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:24 AM   #19
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Wouldn't the roof and side solar be connected to the same solar charge converter?
The side port on my 2021 Cougar goes DIRECTLY to the batteries and not thru the roof solar converter charger. This makes sense as they do not know how many watts you are going to hook up thru the side port and you could overload the roof converter/charger. For the side port make sure you buy panels WITH a converter/charger. Normally thay come with them but is an option on some.
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Old 04-21-2022, 05:30 AM   #20
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The side port on my 2021 Cougar goes DIRECTLY to the batteries and not thru the roof solar converter charger. This makes sense as they do not know how many watts you are going to hook up thru the side port and you could overload the roof converter/charger. For the side port make sure you buy panels WITH a converter/charger. Normally thay come with them but is an option on some.
I'll have to add that to the list of things to check, thanks.
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