Synthetic Oil or Regular Oil and which brands?

[busterbrown]

Originally Posted by jack65

I always thought synthetic oil was best for higher mileage motors (100+miles) and regular oil was fine for lower mileage motors. At least that was what the Corvette Forum were saying.
Any debate on that?

I'm not sure that is widely accepted. High performance and heavy duty cycle vehicles benefit from the properties and additives in synthetics, even from the factory. Higher mileage vehicles will benefit too but there is the risk of leaks from seals if introduced after using conventionals for many miles. Well, that's at least what some oil fanatics say. All modern day cars and trucks can benefit from using today's superior synthetic oils.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by jack65

I always thought synthetic oil was best for higher mileage motors (100+miles) and regular oil was fine for lower mileage motors. At least that was what the Corvette Forum were saying.
Any debate on that?

The first time I used synthetic I used it on a vehicle that had maybe 20k miles, all using regular motor oil. I had problems with oil usage whether from leaks or oil burning; I don't know. I stopped and figured the "synthetic" hoopla was pure hype (decades ago). Fast forward to 10--12 years ago and I decided to start using synthetic in a new car I bought (all my cars are bought new). Noticeably cleaner oil; no usage. Then, modern cars came out with it as OEM. I've had superior results running it and wouldn't run anything else anymore. Just my thinking - to each his own.

[jack65]

Originally Posted by jack65

I was mostly curious to what you guys were running on your rigs.
What my manual says is attached screenshots.
I ran Mobil 1 synthetic oil in my high performance Corvette for years.
I usually go by what my mechanic of 20 years tells me... he has never failed me yet. Him and his son, grandkids all have Ford/Ram pickups.
So, I'll ask him what he is running next time I see him. According to my gauge sensor says I'm 78% good at only 1,558 miles on last oil change. Pic attached.

I just got this pickup three months ago and only put 1,558 miles on it so far, so when the six months is up, I'll change the oil.

BTW, I was quite shocked to see that the tranny oil was never to be changed and no dipstick either for a 8 speed tranny. 120K if you have a 6 speed.

It looks from what most of you say here that "Synthetic Oil" is the way to go.
I likes the Mobil 1 Synthetic Oil I ran in my Corvette:

Question is, many say the Amsoil or Purple Synthetic better than the rest or now. Seems Mobil 1 did a good job for me.

[busterbrown]

Originally Posted by jack65

It looks from what most of you say here that "Synthetic Oil" is the way to go.
I like the Mobil 1 Synthetic Oil I ran in my Corvette:

Amsoil and Redline are heavily promoted on the RAM forum as they deliver good Blackstone OA results when used in our Hemi engines. PUP is next up.
Surprisingly, Mobil 1 synthetic doesn't live up to it's reputation with our trucks. I've seen several OA's with Mobil 1 and will not use it. I've elected to stay with PUP for the duration of my ownership. Redline and Amsoil aren't as readily available. Although I would use them too if price and availability weren't a concern.

[sourdough]

I don't really look to forums to tell me what is good or bad...on anything usually - too many folks doing too many things for too many reasons with too many things looking for....?? I try to read technical results, particularly those that apply to me.

I've ran Mobil 1 in many vehicles now for many years and use Wix premium filters and my vehicle oil looks just really good with zero problems with oil, usage or getting dirty.

Just as a thought, Toyota, which I figure everyone understands is probably one of the best engine builders out there, uses Mobil 1. Just food for thought. My son in law swears by Amsoil because he can stop doing oil changes except for 15k miles....I'm out.

[gearhead]

My final words. I do admit to using Mobil1 in a Corvette. Don't tell the boss. LOL
Most of the name brand oil based synthetics when paired with a decent filter will do just fine when changed at recommended intervals.
The PAO synthetics are a bit better but their main advantage is extended oil change intervals, which will likely raise serious issues if you file a warranty claim.

[JRTJH]

Since almost all of this is opinion rather than fact, I'd opine that the subject of synthetic vs fossil oil is much the same as whether you can get drunker on wine or beer? Both do the job, both come in bottles (or for oil, in plastic/cans) and both are usually sold in the same store.

Years ago (before synthetics) I refused to use Quaker State oil (paraffin based) because of the "gunk" that accumulated under the valve covers. I used Pennzoil which was (I believe) sulfur based. I had clean valve covers every time I took them off to adjust the tappets. Made me happy, but my neighbor always smiled as he used old T-shirts to wipe out his Quaker State gunk was just as happy. Now that synthetics and blends are available, I tend to use what the engine manufacturer recommends. They built the engine, specified the oil requirements and provide (usually at a competitive cost) products under their name that meet those requirements. Makes it easy to maintain the engine "IMHO"....

Point being, this discussion, more opinion than fact, is just that..... OPINION....

Use the oil that makes you feel "warm and fuzzy" without regard for what makes your neighbor's "fuzziness smile".....

YMMV

[boxcar]

sourdough makes a good point about trusting forums and busterbrown brought up Blackstone Labs so I'll add that I prefer to seek information from real-world testing rather than the religious wars and marketing hype. Certainly, Blackstone has a business to run and promotes their testing service, but they have nothing to gain by promoting one oil over another as you'll see in this newsletter:

https://www.blackstone-labs.com/News...uly-1-2017.php

The net result on synthetic brands: "We just don’t tend to see much difference in wear metals between different oil types, so whichever one you want to use is fine.”

I had my dealership replace the break-in oil with synthetic at 1000 miles, sent a sample to Blackstone, and change at 7000 mile intervals on their recommendation. I let Ford use whatever brand synthetic they use and I'll use whatever is on sale when I start changing the oil myself soon. I expect to be buried in this 6.7L so I hope I'll need a half-million miles out of it. But I said that about my 7.3L and sold it at 1/4 million.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by boxcar

sourdough makes a good point about trusting forums and busterbrown brought up Blackstone Labs so I'll add that I prefer to seek information from real-world testing rather than the religious wars and marketing hype. Certainly, Blackstone has a business to run and promotes their testing service, but they have nothing to gain by promoting one oil over another as you'll see in this newsletter:

https://www.blackstone-labs.com/News...uly-1-2017.php

The net result on synthetic brands: "We just don’t tend to see much difference in wear metals between different oil types, so whichever one you want to use is fine.”

I had my dealership replace the break-in oil with synthetic at 1000 miles, sent a sample to Blackstone, and change at 7000 mile intervals on their recommendation. I let Ford use whatever brand synthetic they use and I'll use whatever is on sale when I start changing the oil myself soon. I expect to be buried in this 6.7L so I hope I'll need a half-million miles out of it. But I said that about my 7.3L and sold it at 1/4 million.

This is a little off topic, but;

Where did you find a place that would let you get buried in your truck? I'm thinking that would be a great alternative to a $10k fancy box - and it would be paid for and comfortable for..... "the ride".

[boxcar]

I was just planning on digging a hole at the farm - wasn't going to ask anyone.

Speaking of a 10K box, I really do have an agreement with my granddaughters that they'll hand decorate a pine box and put me in the cemetery a mile from the farm. My great grandfather paid $100 for 12 plots there and there are still 3 vacancies. I have no intention of wasting money on anything except a fantastic wake with all the grandkids there.

[Big Boy w/ Big Toys]

You know I will throw one more monkey wrench at this subject....how about running Diesel rated oils in your gas trucks? They have higher additive/detegent packages for carbon, better shear stability and a few other things that gas only oil does not have.When you look at diesel oil is rated for CK and SN....Gas oil has only the SN rating.....I run Amsoil 5w-40 diesel oil in everything I own....well except for the motorcycles, those get the 15w-40 diesel oil treatment. I got a high performance 4 cylinder with 150k and running strong even being abused regularly. The lawn equipment don't care, the work trucks love it and our water pump-s that run WOT all day long never miss a beat.

[GrumpyCat]

Originally Posted by jkohler70

I read once that synthetic blends are a waste of money. There's no regulation on what constitutes a synthetic blend or semi-synthetic. Is it 80/20? 50/50? Only the manufacturer knows and they aren't telling.

You are partially correct. There are no performance requirements or specifications for a motor oil to be sold as synthetic, not just semi-synthetic. The only requirement is that accepted synthetic methods be used for manufacture. There is no requirement of the end product.

There are no reputable specifications or requirements which stipulate use of synthetic motor oil. Those who stipulate synthetic do not know of which they speak. Sadly this sort of thing is sneaking into owner's manuals.

There are performance specifications for which no motor oil other than synthetics have met, but the specification does not say synthetic is required to meet. And not all synthetics meet the spec.

Buy Mobil-1 (or whatever) because it is a proven product, not because it is labeled "synthetic".

[GrumpyCat]

Originally Posted by sourdough

The first time I used synthetic I used it on a vehicle that had maybe 20k miles, all using regular motor oil. I had problems with oil usage whether from leaks or oil burning; I don't know. I stopped and figured the "synthetic" hoopla was pure hype (decades ago). Fast forward to 10--12 years ago and I decided to start using synthetic in a new car I bought (all my cars are bought new). Noticeably cleaner oil; no usage. Then, modern cars came out with it as OEM. I've had superior results running it and wouldn't run anything else anymore. Just my thinking - to each his own.

In ancient times the admonition was to never change the exact brand and model of motor oil after break-in for fear of leaks. It was understood the seals were saturated in whatever oil and once used to that oil sealed best with that oil, synthetic or refined didn't matter.

Then the synthetic guys came along not really knowing all the history and folklore of motor oil so they started over, repeating mistakes of the past. Pretty much like Elon Musk and Tesla manufacturing. The synthetic guys didn't know they needed to provide seal swelling agents which other oils were adding in varying amounts.

If you were using a motor oil with lots of seal swelling agents then your seals swelled up nice and tight, and wore faster. Another oil comes along with less swelling properties and suddenly your seals are worn and loose. And of course oil manufacturers bragged their oil didn't leak from your engine because it was better!

Today seal swelling properties are part of the SAE/API and everyone else's industry specs. The oil seal manufacturers know. The oil manufacturers know. Everything is now compatible.

[larryflew]

I put a LOT more miles per year on both of our Hemis. Dodge magnum is light use and have used regular Valvoline for 130K and change every 8k. Never on dirt roads and only highway driving. Durango 160K pulling 28 ft light weight trailer and a lot more hauling every 5K. Both have never seen any other oil and for the first half of their lives Fram filters. Switched to better filters but same changes. Neither used oil. Durango went with truck and trailer trade to GMC 1 ton and 16K trailer so totally different ball game.

[Frank G]

It would be nice if those that make a post that we, the reader, are to take as creditable information please give us some background or cite references. Other than that it is just another opinion, and there is nothing wrong with expressing your opinion.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by GrumpyCat

In ancient times the admonition was to never change the exact brand and model of motor oil after break-in for fear of leaks. It was understood the seals were saturated in whatever oil and once used to that oil sealed best with that oil, synthetic or refined didn't matter.

Then the synthetic guys came along not really knowing all the history and folklore of motor oil so they started over, repeating mistakes of the past. Pretty much like Elon Musk and Tesla manufacturing. The synthetic guys didn't know they needed to provide seal swelling agents which other oils were adding in varying amounts.

If you were using a motor oil with lots of seal swelling agents then your seals swelled up nice and tight, and wore faster. Another oil comes along with less swelling properties and suddenly your seals are worn and loose. And of course oil manufacturers bragged their oil didn't leak from your engine because it was better!

Today seal swelling properties are part of the SAE/API and everyone else's industry specs. The oil seal manufacturers know. The oil manufacturers know. Everything is now compatible.

Ancient times?? What? Those experiences were in the 70s (seems like yesterday ) when I was in my 20s - 30s....I'm not THAT old!! Here I am, fighting with a torn rotator cuff, torn bicep tendon feeling like I'm falling apart , and then, implying I'm ancient!! No wonder I'm not motivated today...

[Frank G]

Back in the 70's when Amsoil was gaining traction in the market you were asked to drain and add one Qt. of Amsoil to clean the engine, as the product had a cleaning effect in the crankcase. After a 1,000 miles or so you were ok do the oil change. It wasn't long before they started to market a engine cleaner and flush. They also provided warnings of oil leaks in higher mileage engines. My past brother was a successful dealer with regular 5 figure quarterly commission checks.

[Sk734]

Engine flush. 1/2 cup of kerosene-let it idle 10 minutes then drain and put in new dino. You would see a lot of sludge come out-back in the 70's. Cheap flush. GM now calls for dexos rated oil and I run it since it is under warranty. No oil usage 66K. Silverado 2500. 6.0 Gasser. Change when DIC says to. Before this I always changed at 5K. Great post.

[ron130fe]

My 2 cents, I have a 2014 Ram 1500 bighorn 5.7 and I’ve been running Synth since I got it (used)and I run it till the change oil gauge gets to about 10-15 %. Somewhere around 7500 miles, I have 57000 and will never go back to regular oil. Now my wife has a 2015 Ram 2500 longhorn and on the oil cap it says to use synthetic. So that’s my 2 cents, hope it helped

[gearhead]

Fiat Chrysler has a relationship with Shell. My Ram Cummins owner manual recommended 15W-40 Rotella or 5W-40 synthetic Rotella for extreme cold temps.
May have something to do with the Shell Ferrari (Fiat) long time relationship.