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10-03-2019, 07:44 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Des Moines
Posts: 366
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Low axle rating
This isn’t limited to Keystone but why do manufacturers instal axles lower than the gross gvr?
For example my trailer grosses at 9800 lbs. I have 4400 lb axles for a total of 8800 lbs. if I load up to the max I’m over 1000lbs. You would think there would be a liability issue if someone had a problem due to overdoing the axles.
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Brant
2020 Ford F-350 CCLB, 7.3 gas
2022 Arcadia 3940LT
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10-03-2019, 07:50 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: SE Michigan
Posts: 1,659
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It's assumed that at least 10% of a travel trailer's "overall weight" (20% in the case of a 5ver) up to its GVW will be carried by the tow vehicle.
Secondly, larger axles, tires, wheels, and springs that provide significant load carrying reserves cost $$$$, taking away from corporate profits. This is something an owner discovers on their own after a failure leaves them stranded or abruptly ends a vacation.
My resolution to this was a new set of "everything" below the frame rails to provide that reserve.
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2017 Keystone Bullet 308BHS in Saddle.
2017 RAM 2500 Laramie Mega Cab 4x4 Hemi 6.4L
2008 GMC Yukon XL Denali (SOLD)
Hensley SwiftArrow Control Hitch with 1000 lb Spring Bars
Me, DW, (3) little DS's, and 1 rambunctious Boston Terrier
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10-03-2019, 10:09 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Taylors, SC
Posts: 3,031
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The OPs Question is often asked. Actually the answer is quite simple.
All RV trailers are built under the guidance of the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (FMVSS). Once the trailer manufacturer has determined the target GVWR for the trailer, they must conform to the FMVSS. The standard says that when the vehicle certified weight of all GAWRs is added to the manufacturer’s recommended tongue weight, the result must not be less than GVWR.
The tow vehicle carries the tongue weight.
The vehicle certified GAWRs may differ from the axle manufacturer's weight certification label on the axle and even the brochure information which will list the axle's real value.
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10-04-2019, 06:58 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Hurley
Posts: 350
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That is probably the reason I don`t have a keystone right now. Found the floor plan we wanted and started looking at different brand in that floor plan. Liking the Passport I wanted to look at keystone. Found one and really like what it seemed to offer so I started digging deeper. This was a 8600 pound UVW. It had 4400lb axles and load range D tires. I understand tongue weight but it turned me off. The Passport had right at the GVW tires when I bought it and it wasn`t even a year before I went a load range up. The dealership even wanted me to talk to the factory sales rep about the larger trailer and I told them I just wasn`t interested. The one I did buy in the same floor plan with a UVW of 8300lbs. has 5200lbs axles and came with load range E tires. In looking I find the factory usually run the same axles and tires on a line of trailer than can give you some extra carrying weight right up to the GVW. Yes it meets the requirement and yes it will work but it is something I think about.
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Kenny & Susan
2017 Passport 2670bh
2017 F250 6.2 4wd
Equalizer 4 pt.
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10-04-2019, 08:40 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Taylors, SC
Posts: 3,031
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retired Copper
That is probably the reason I don`t have a keystone right now. Found the floor plan we wanted and started looking at different brand in that floor plan. Liking the Passport I wanted to look at keystone. Found one and really like what it seemed to offer so I started digging deeper. This was a 8600 pound UVW. It had 4400lb axles and load range D tires. I understand tongue weight but it turned me off. The Passport had right at the GVW tires when I bought it and it wasn`t even a year before I went a load range up. The dealership even wanted me to talk to the factory sales rep about the larger trailer and I told them I just wasn`t interested. The one I did buy in the same floor plan with a UVW of 8300lbs. has 5200lbs axles and came with load range E tires. In looking I find the factory usually run the same axles and tires on a line of trailer than can give you some extra carrying weight right up to the GVWR. Yes it meets the requirement and yes it will work but it is something I think about.
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That's because the vehicle manufacturer has the authority to certify the axles below the axle manufacturer's axle certification. In short, they can install 5200# axles and degrade them to 5080# and use that 5080# on the vehicle certification label. Owners may see that as an extra load carrying feature but it is really just a little load capacity reserves as the GAWR's on the federal certification label are the installed axle's only limiter.
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10-11-2019, 06:16 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Florissant
Posts: 701
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It all makes me a little nervous about raising a tire off the ground for maintenance by driving the nearby tire up a ramp.
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Skids
2019 Bullet 248RKS
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10-11-2019, 07:37 AM
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#7
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skids
It all makes me a little nervous about raising a tire off the ground for maintenance by driving the nearby tire up a ramp.
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The ramps such as the Trailer Aid are not intended to be used for"maintenance" but rather to facilitate changing a flat tire. Changing a flat tire is a short term (10 min.?) endeavor . Using one to perform "maintenance" would be analogues to using only the scissors jack in the trunk of a car to lift a car while you crawl under it to change the oil.
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Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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10-11-2019, 09:57 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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Lifting the entire weight of one side of the trailer by driving up on a ramp. How does that not overload that tire/spring?
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Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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10-11-2019, 10:07 AM
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#9
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmith948
Lifting the entire weight of one side of the trailer by driving up on a ramp. How does that not overload that tire/spring?
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It does, but again it's not intended as a storage solution and should not be a problem if used for it's intended purpose.
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Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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10-11-2019, 02:25 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmith948
Lifting the entire weight of one side of the trailer by driving up on a ramp. How does that not overload that tire/spring?
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If you use a jack under the axle u bolts you'll do the same, but as already said it's only for a short period & shouldn't hurt a thing.
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Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
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10-11-2019, 03:04 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,461
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If you try one of those tire changing yellow ramp things, you may find it doesn't lift the other wheel on that side high enough to get the job done. Try it before you rely on it.
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wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
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10-12-2019, 05:49 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travelin texans
If you use a jack under the axle u bolts you'll do the same, but as already said it's only for a short period & shouldn't hurt a thing.
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Sorry...but have to disagree. If I use a jack to raise one wheel, the other wheel is still on the ground supporting its share of the weight. If I raise that same wheel by driving the other wheel up on a ramp, the wheel I'm trying to raise is hanging down on the fully extended spring and the tire on the ramp is supporting all of the weight.
Everyone will do what is best/easiest for them. For me - I carry the jack anyway, so, I'll use it to change a wheel rather than overload the other wheel and spring in an attempt to save time/effort. JMHO - FWIW
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Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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10-12-2019, 08:34 AM
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#13
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,685
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I've used the Andersen Rapid Jack and Trailer Aid for several years now. Used to think I needed to use a jack. Last time I used a jack, after a blowout, crawling under the trailer to position it and get it up, covered in grassburrs and goat heads no matter what I put down plus a knee six weeks out from replacement, I said I would NEVER do that again if there was an option.....welcome the Andersen Leveler! I am not concerned about the temporary lift of the one tire; those tires and suspension are subjected to far worse driving down todays highways and biways. JMO/YMMV
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Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
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10-12-2019, 05:43 PM
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#14
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmith948
Sorry...but have to disagree. If I use a jack to raise one wheel, the other wheel is still on the ground supporting its share of the weight. If I raise that same wheel by driving the other wheel up on a ramp, the wheel I'm trying to raise is hanging down on the fully extended spring and the tire on the ramp is supporting all of the weight.
Everyone will do what is best/easiest for them. For me - I carry the jack anyway, so, I'll use it to change a wheel rather than overload the other wheel and spring in an attempt to save time/effort. JMHO - FWIW
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If you raise 1 wheel of the ground then the weight gets distributed to the other 4 points (3 tires and hitch or pin). It won't be an "even" distribution but it won't all be "all on the adjacent tire".
I have the Trailer Aid Plus which has an extra 1" or so of lift. I've had to use it twice and both instances were in conditions where I was thankful not having to lay in slop or have my feet out in the travel lane to crawl under. I keep a 9 ton bottle jack and cribbing in the bed of the truck as well in case a more lengthy repair is needed. I prefer to use tools/devices that are "appropriate" for the task. YMMV
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Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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