front landing gear

[Firestorm]

went camping this weekend, I have a 2012 cougar high country 299 rks, only its 7th trip longest travel 240 miles one way, went to wisc park by Chippewa falls , went to unhook pass side front leg didn't move MMMMMM I looked at the square transfer rod , it snapped the bolt off the motor MMMMM ok, I tried to spin it by hand, no go, there wasn't any weight on it, thought I would go buy a bolt, hand a smaller one to see if the motor would turn it , nope snapped that to called the dealer, they told me to call keystone , Ketstone told me to have the dealer fix, prob a broken drive shaft in leg, any thoughts
Has this happened to anyone else?

[JRTJH]

It sounds like it was working fine when you hitched up at home, then when you got to the campground it was "frozen" and wouldn't extend. If that's what happened, chances are when you ran the jacks up at home getting ready to tow, you ran them too high and jammed the gearing in the up position, shearing the pin. Now, you've got gears that are jammed together (locked up) and won't unjam.

When you get your trailer back with the repaired jack, I'd suggest you put a couple of pieces of reflective tape just below the fully retracted spot on the jack legs.

When I first bought my fifth wheel, during the PDI the dealer cautioned me not to over retract my jacks because it could damage them. He got under the trailer to point out to me the difference in color where the jacks had tarnished below the area which was inside the upper housing. I tried to carefully watch for this difference in color on the lower jack legs, but as I used my trailer the color became closer and closer to the same above and below the spot he pointed out. I've applied two pieces of reflective tape on mine, a yellow band and just below that, a red band. I know when the yellow starts disappearing inside the upper leg to be "CAREFUL" and when the red starts disappearing to "STOP"

Since I've put that tape on my front jack legs, I've not ran the jacks to the full up position.

My "fear" is to jam the legs in the middle of "nowhere" and be stuck, unable to hitch, unable to unhitch, unable to move because the jacks are stuck and the manual crank won't work.

Hope this helps you to prevent over retraction next time

Cheers
John

[Firestorm]

Thanks for your input, I dont know if this is the cause or not, I remember retracting them till they stop or show resistance trying not to jamm them tight, the tape thing I've been meaning to do The dealer will look at it Mon, i will post the results, Thanks again

[smiller]

I think John has it right, and from what you describe I had the same thing happen to me (unfortunately no one cautioned me about over-retracting the gear.)

When I got home I disassembled and un-jammed the unit myself but it was a messy and PITA job. I watch the paint marks now.

[Firestorm]

If that's it , which makes sense to me, I will never bury it again , Just want to make sure it rides in the highest possible position

Thanks guys

'

[Johnnyfry]

Yes, this happened to me at a remote CG. The motor and the other leg worked fine.. I took the cover off the drive gear in the bad leg, no problem there.

I stuck a1/4 inch hardened drift pin in the bolt hole and gave a few heavy jerks. It popped back inti proper alignment, or whatever. I replaced the bolt and it has worked fine since. I put marks on the moving section of the leg and NEVER raise beyond that.

Carry extra grade 8 1/4-20 bolts and a long 1/4 inch drift pin.

Try it, even if it doesn't work it won't make it any worse as the dealer will just sell you a new one.

John

[JRTJH]

Johnnyfry, Do you use grade 8 bolts as "shear pins"? I was told to use grade 5 bolts. As I recall, (and that gets to be more problematic yearly) shear pins on farming equipment are grade 5 or softer.

Any information on using grade 8? If so, I'd definitely like to make sure I use the right shear pins.

Thanks
John

[Firestorm]

well I put a bolt in it , did what you said would happen, works fine, I do need to get the grade 8 bolts tomm
Thanks guys, save me a trip to the dealer , It pays to research
Bob and Anne

[JRTJH]

Glad it worked for you. But, hold off for a bit on the grade 8 vs grade 5 bolts. Let's get it cleared up before you put too strong a bolt in your landing gear and it won't shear, causing more damage. We'll know what grade bolt to use pretty quick, Big thing is you're back in business. Happy to hear that

I am going to the dealer tomorrow, so I'll find out what Keystone recommends be used for shear pins. Will post the results probably tomorrow around supper time.

Cheers

[smiller]

Originally Posted by Johnnyfry

I stuck a1/4 inch hardened drift pin in the bolt hole and gave a few heavy jerks. It popped back inti proper alignment, or whatever.

What happens is that the jackscrew jams at the end of its range. If you are lucky you can force it free, if not it's a PITA disassembly job. The dealer will tell you the unit has to be replaced but in fact it can be repaired.

I too would be careful about what grade bolt is used, better to have it shear early than jam the thing solid (DAMHIK.) I use a common grade 1 bolt... it's plenty strong enough for normal use and I want that sucka to shear before the thing jams next time (and hopefully there won't be a next time.) We'll see what info John can get.

[Firestorm]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Glad it worked for you. But, hold off for a bit on the grade 8 vs grade 5 bolts. Let's get it cleared up before you put too strong a bolt in your landing gear and it won't shear, causing more damage. We'll know what grade bolt to use pretty quick, Big thing is you're back in business. Happy to hear that

I am going to the dealer tomorrow, so I'll find out what Keystone recommends be used for shear pins. Will post the results probably tomorrow around supper time.

Cheers

Good info, I may look for a shear pin at ace hardware, they have tons of inventory, I will check back to the post tomorrow to see what you found out

[Johnnyfry]

I think that you guys are correct, grade 8 is probably too much. In fact, I used what I had, which was a clevis pin.

I picked up some 1/4-20 bolts at HD which have 3 bars on the head. I believe that is grade 5.

Thanks for the correction.

John

[JRTJH]

Accordiong to CW in Houghton Lake, MI. They recommend NOT using grade 8 bolts. They say they are too strong and may well shear the gear drive shaft (the round shaft with the hole the bolt fits in). Recommendation was for Grade 5 1/4-20 bolts. He said that if you buy them a "bit" longer than needed and use a nylock nut so they won't loosen, that they are easier to get off if it should shear because there's something to grab hold of to pull or twist it out.

So, from what I can gather, use grade 5 bolts for the pins.

Hope this helps.

John

[Firestorm]

sounds good , I will repair it , question is is the hole at the motor threaded? or just a hole , to tighten up with a lock nut

[JRTJH]

The hole is not threaded, but it is easier to "screw" it into the hole. On mine, there is the round gear drive shaft with a 1/4" hole, a plastic "buffer" that fits over the shaft and is square to fit inside the square drive tube. There are no threads, but it is a tight fit.

I bought 2" grade 5 bolts with threads only on the last 3/4 inch. Once I got the threaded part through the assembly, they pushed the rest of the way pretty easily. I used Nylock nuts and haven't had any problems.

The one thing I did have some concern about was making sure that both jacks were extended the same distance when I "pinned" the gear drive. I used the jack switch to get the side that still worked to a measured 2" below the upper jack assembly, then turned the "loose" side by hand until it also measured 2" below the upper jack assembly. Once I pinned them together, I ran the jacks down to raise the trailer about 6" further than it was sitting and remeasured the jacks, they were the same. then I ran them all the way up to my red tape line and they hit the red at the same time so I guess they are aligned properly.

Reason for doing that was to prevent the frame from twisting if one was hitting the ground before the other.

Hope that makes sense to you

John

[Firestorm]

Awesome, great information, Just goes to show ya its always sumpin
Thanks

[Firestorm]

So as I sit here on hold with Lippert, Im trying to see if my trailer had a plastic part for the square shaft on my front landing gear I fixed it with a new bolt, but seems a little loose, so that plastic ( buffer) as you called it, Im trying to see if it suppose to have one, dealer said they would look it up, and call me back, No call, called keystone this am, she tried to see the part , but couldn't really fined the proper schematic, ,she had me call lippert direct, no problem, call them , go through all the phone menu's wait, wait ,wait, after an hour on speaker phone, called the dealer back, Charlies on the other phone he will call you right back, nope didn't, called lippert again , same thing its been a half hour now, Im bored so i thought I would write this, customer service at its best, last time they smiled and appreciated my business was when I wrote them a check for the $12,000 down payment,Man the worlds changed, all I want is a dollars worth of plastic , still on hold, do they even answer?

[Festus2]

"We are experiencing an unusual volume of calls. Please stay on the line. Your call is important to us." Sound familiar? Welcome to the New World of Customer Service.

[Firestorm]

[QUOTE=Festus2;20136]"We are experiencing an unusual volume of calls. Please stay on the line. Your call is important to us." Sound familiar? Welcome to the New World of Customer Service.[/QUOTE

WOW Im sitting there , phone on table, someone answered , long story short, there sending me the proper parts , yea

[hankpage]

Originally Posted by Firestorm

WOW Im sitting there , phone on table, someone answered , long story short, there sending me the proper parts , yea

Somebody still has to pick the parts, pack them and ship them to you. Still plenty of chances to screw up .... but a least there is now HOPE.