Idiotic Design

[NavyMustang]

I can't help but wonder what kind of moronic engineers they have working at KeystoneRV. We have had nothing but problems with our only THREE YEAR OLD Bullet 248RKS, and most of what we're experiencing is because of piss-poor design. It's pretty common-sense stuff. For example, don't place water tanks directly over a cross-beam that you screw the underbelly into. It results in holes in the water tank when the self-tapping screws are inserted. And who in their right mind would design kitchen under-cabinet storage shelves with cheap staples upwards so as to not be able to store anything whatsoever ON the shelves without the cheap, thin luan bowing and caving in. (See photo.)

Dear Keystone: If you ever read these forums, I'm not an engineer, but I am a HELL of a lot smarter than the morons you have working for you. If you ever need some design tips, please feel free to contact me. We will NEVER purchase a garbage product from your company again.

Cheers!

"Running on MT"

[sourdough]

Sorry for your problems. You might read the disclaimer at the bottom of the page; the website is not affiliated with Keystone RV in any way and I'm not aware of anyone from Keystone that ever reads or monitors it.

[NH_Bulldog]

All manufacturers have their issues, regardless of brand or price. Even in the same factory, on the same production line, you will find a great deal of variance in build quality from unit to unit. If those issues are the worst you have after 3 years of use, it doesn’t sound too bad. Sucks to be sure, but it could be worse.

[LHaven]

I realized that consistently intelligent design was probably an unreasonable expectation when I went to attach my new license plate to my new Cougar (see image).

("Satellite Prep" is actually "Park Cable," but the label isn't the problem.)

[notanlines]

Mustang, sorry, but no hurt feelings on this forum, nor will anyone here give it a second thought. Better that you should address the comments in an email to a specific individual at the plant. And I suspect if you don't tone it down a little it will be posted for all the employees to laugh at. And, whereas what you say is I'm sure true, three years in an entry-level RV with only minor problems isn't too bad.

[B-O-B'03]

Agreed!

I have had to shore up and rebuild just abut every shelf in our trailer, none of them had any structural integrity.

Pretty piss poor, but we still love the trailer, it is perfect for the 2 of us and now that I have fixed it, we have had no more issues.

-Brian

[SummitPond]

Like yours (as shown in the photo) our shelves in the 19FBPR were stapled to the underside of the support braces - something I don't understand - what were they thinking? When ours "fell through" (all the way - total separation) my solution was to remount them on the top side and add additional screws through the support pieces - no further issues.

[sourdough]

I guess, as a person that builds stuff, analyzes "things" and looks for shortcomings, seeing a shelf like that (or any of the hundred other things you find) I just fix it. I KNOW that the shelf can't support anything....but I know that on walk through. Idiotic design? I doubt it. Cheap? Of course, but then again I know that.

As far as Keystone "garbage" due to the shelf design etc., I would encourage anyone to go look at all of the RVs out there....you're going to find it everywhere, not just Keystone....unless you want to plop down 200k for a "toy"; not me.

[pitman44]

Originally Posted by B-O-B'03

Agreed!

I have had to shore up and rebuild just abut every shelf in our trailer, none of them had any structural integrity.

Pretty piss poor, but we still love the trailer, it is perfect for the 2 of us and now that I have fixed it, we have had no more issues.

-Brian

This is why we prefer lightly used to new.

[NavyMustang]

Well, I sure was rather irate when I posted this last night, but I stand by it. It's not only the shelves.

Water tank has a hole in it because Keystone screwed the underbelly into the crossbeam that the tank sits on.

Luan has started to come up in three areas at the edge of the roof causing it to pull up on the rubber membrane.

No support beam installed under flooring on one side of the heater vent next to the dining table. Every time I step on that area, it feels like I'm going to fall through.

Toilet valve failed.

Shelves fell in.

Water heater control board failed.

Refrigerator constantly stops igniting on gas and needs reset.

I know this isn't an official forum, but they likely scan them often looking for issues. They say in their promotional materials that they pride themselves on quality. Total horse pooey. "Entry level" or not, it is garbage. Would anyone put up with a $30,000 AUTOMOBILE that was so cheaply made? Remember the Yugo?

[Fuzion 369]

Good point no tan lines. We have had several trailers and this is by far the best manufacturer in our opinion.

[chuckster57]

I wonder if the worker on the line had problems reading blue prints and thought they went in that way.

[66joej]

Originally Posted by chuckster57

I wonder if the worker on the line had problems reading blue prints and thought they went in that way.

I think the blueprints were handed to Jacob upside down so not his fault.

[wiredgeorge]

I have to doubt that the worker on the line putting those shelves in had specific instruction to staple them from the bottom or some drawing telling him to. More likely they were put in while the cabinet was upside down and that seemed like the right way to do it or it was easier to put staples in from the underside. I doubt any engineer ever considered the direction of the staples. Just a guess...

[blubuckaroo]

We've run into a few things with our new Passport too, but all those things can be contributed to weight savings. Light weight can be cheesy and cheap.

The one that made me realize that was when I installed gas struts on the bed, I found out that the bed base was made exactly like an interior hollow core door. Two pieces of 1/4" paneling sandwiching a frame. The screws pulled right out! I had to line the bed frame and base with 5/8" plywood to make the struts work. I figure I added at least 50 pounds to the trailer.

[WDPatterson]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

I have to doubt that the worker on the line putting those shelves in had specific instruction to staple them from the bottom or some drawing telling him to. More likely they were put in while the cabinet was upside down and that seemed like the right way to do it or it was easier to put staples in from the underside. I doubt any engineer ever considered the direction of the staples. Just a guess...

That actually sounds pretty plausible. Somebody did not understand how a cabinet is built. Clearly they didn't understand the necessary orientation of the Shelf in relation to the hangers. That's really not a forgivable thing. Should have been handled under warranty, at no cost to the consumer.

[Local150]

I have begun to think we are part of the problem! Putting shelves in like that among other things is bull. If everybody complains you get somewhere,,, instead we say,,,, oh I will just fix it myself

[flygrimm]

Originally Posted by Local150

I have begun to think we are part of the problem! Putting shelves in like that among other things is bull. If everybody complains you get somewhere,,, instead we say,,,, oh I will just fix it myself

It's probably by design. Most stuff is relatively easy to fix thankfully. They have made it so difficult to get any kind of warranty work and regular work is backed up for months so you are forced to fix it, live with it or be without your rig for extended periods.

Stuart

[notanlines]

I pulled this ad from the Goshen, Indiana area.

RV Plumber
H L Enterprise Inc.
Elkhart, IN 46516
$15 - $18 an hour

Full Time experienced Recreational Vehicle Plumber. Must be able to install all water lines, drain pipes, toilets, holding tank/s install, water pumps, and pluming fixtures which must include RV terminations and adherence to RVIA pluming codes. Maintain a good work area and environment with little to no supervision.

Job Type: Full-time

Salary: $15.00 to $18.00 /hour

I don't know if this is in line with what most of you thought was paid to their 'craftsmen,' but this is the real world.

[Preyou]

For what we pay, this is ridiculous!!! I agree if everyone starts complaining loudly, improvements might be made. I would imagine that the factory warranty costs are extremely high. Buy a share of Thor stock and let them know your feelings.