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Old 05-17-2019, 03:39 PM   #1
GeekSquadOfUn
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Auto levelling newbie.

I have a question on using Lippert s Ground Control 3 on my new Cougar 5th wheel.

It's a 4 point system.

I have been using my trusted 2x8s for the last many years to level my Sabre 5th wheel from left to right. Looking at my pin box installed LevelMaster, I would know if I needed a few inches on the left for example. I would then move up or down the front landing gear to level back to front. Many sites are not level left to right...

Enter my new system. Ground Control.

Shall I still use my pieces of wood to level LH to RH, and then use Ground Control auto level button?

Would I put lots of stress on the system by not using those pieces of wood. Should I try level it a bit before using the Auto Level function?

I'm worried about breaking it, having never used such a system.
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Old 05-17-2019, 03:46 PM   #2
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The auto level system is pretty handy but isn't a fix all. There is only so much extension you can get out of the legs so if you're off too much the legs will max out their length before you are level. Since that's true you might need to get yourself closer to level left to right before engaging it. You may also need to put down some blocks under the pads on the elevated side give the legs enough room to level your rig. If your parking spot is relatively level then you'll be OK, but if you're off a few inches then a few blocks will serve you well.
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Old 05-17-2019, 04:32 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeekSquadOfUn View Post
I have a question on using Lippert s Ground Control 3 on my new Cougar 5th wheel.

It's a 4 point system.

I have been using my trusted 2x8s for the last many years to level my Sabre 5th wheel from left to right. Looking at my pin box installed LevelMaster, I would know if I needed a few inches on the left for example. I would then move up or down the front landing gear to level back to front. Many sites are not level left to right...

Enter my new system. Ground Control.

Shall I still use my pieces of wood to level LH to RH, and then use Ground Control auto level button?

Would I put lots of stress on the system by not using those pieces of wood. Should I try level it a bit before using the Auto Level function?

I'm worried about breaking it, having never used such a system.
I don't level side to side with the tires anymore, but I have 8 pads that are 2x10 by 12" long to be able to place under the jacks that will have to extend more.

Steve
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Old 05-17-2019, 04:40 PM   #4
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Lippert recommends that you be fairly level before deploying the Auto Level. So, what does "fairly level" mean? To me, if the side to side level is off more than say 2-3 inches, I'm going to level the side to side with some Anderson leveling wedges. Then I will place some 2"x10"x12" long boards under the leveling legs to keep them from having to extend as far on the side that has been brought up with the tire levelers. At some point, if you raise the trailer with tire levelers and don't use some type of blocking or pads under the leveling legs, your cylinder will run out of stroke to finish leveling. the other advantage of doing this (with blocks under the leveler legs) is that the leveling jacks do not have to extends as far and the shorter they are, the more stable the trailer becomes.
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Old 05-17-2019, 04:46 PM   #5
Stircrazy
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Lippert recommends that you be fairly level before deploying the Auto Level. So, what does "fairly level" mean? To me, if the side to side level is off more than say 2-3 inches, I'm going to level the side to side with some Anderson leveling wedges. Then I will place some 2"x10"x12" long boards under the leveling legs to keep them from having to extend as far on the side that has been brought up with the tire levelers. At some point, if you raise the trailer with tire levelers and don't use some type of blocking or pads under the leveling legs, your cylinder will run out of stroke to finish leveling. the other advantage of doing this (with blocks under the leveler legs) is that the leveling jacks do not have to extends as far and the shorter they are, the more stable the trailer becomes.
ya I have found it doesn't matter much, 99% of camp sites are fairly level at the start, I have been in a couple where the one side of the trailer tires are off the ground after the level. I think what they mean is that if you are to far out and you don't put extra blockage under the jacks that are going to extend you can get a out of range stroke err, then it is a pain to clear it, leveling the tires wont help with this situation it is the jacks that you have to be able to add blocks under so you doing get a over stroke conditions. you get this a couple times and you will learn when you have to do it.

Steve
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Old 05-17-2019, 07:36 PM   #6
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As long as you are within 3or 4 inches in either direction and you put some 2 by's under the jacks, especially the jacks that have to do the most travel you will be OK. The system is plenty strong, it will lift the coach off the ground. In an emergency you can use it to change a flat tire. Remember, you need a good fully charged battery to use the system. The truth be known, the DW is in charge of the Level-UP system. Just following orders.

Use some common sense when manually extending the front legs. If your rig is setting nose high, leave enough room under the jacks so the level-up system can retract the front legs enough to level the unit front to back. You will understand after a few uses and the ease of use will be apricated.
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Old 05-18-2019, 03:52 AM   #7
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Thank you all for your comments. Guess I can retire those darn 2x8s. Once again the DW was right, she said she kept reading that it was strong enough to lift and hold, using pads under the jacks to help with stroke travel.

Appreciate it, ��
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Old 05-18-2019, 05:16 AM   #8
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Okay...the whole point of having the AUTO-LEVEL system is to eliminate having to tow your trailer up onto blocks or leveling wedges/widgets. Those of you that say you have to be level side to side BEFORE employing the ground control are, IMHO, mistaken

This is what we do:

1. Park the camper where we want it to be - you know - awning will clear the trees, power cord and hoses will reach, etc.

2. Open the control panel door and observe which of the red/orange lights are blinking - this will give you and idea of what is low.

3. Eyeball the distance from the jack pads to the ground and decide how many, if any, plastic leveler pads to place under each leg.

4. Raise the nose of the trailer and unhook truck.

5. Push the AUTO-LEVEL button. Provided the nose was higher than level when you unhooked (as it should be so that the auto re-connect feature will work) the ground control will then lower the nose of the trailer. While it is doing that, the DW and I go to the rear jacks so that, when they start to deploy, we can make sure the pads are centered under the jacks.

6. Go back and monitor the control panel screen - when it says success, lock the little door -done.

It's what works for us. We leave the 1/2 cord of 2x10s at home
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Old 05-18-2019, 06:15 AM   #9
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I"m a big fan of efficiency in set up and not having to pre-level side to side is appealing. I am fairly new to auto leveling, having done it the old fashioned way for 35 years. I watched some videos on the topic and this seems to be one of varied opinions.

Is there a difference in methology between hydrolic and electric levelers? My understanding has been that the thinking behind pre-leveling if the differential is more than a couple inches is to mitigate sagging and movement in the trailer. by taking too much weight off of the wheels. Is that a concern? What about 4 pt. vs 6 pt. Are these variables that require different answers?
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Old 05-18-2019, 08:03 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by jsmith948 View Post
Okay...the whole point of having the AUTO-LEVEL system is to eliminate having to tow your trailer up onto blocks or leveling wedges/widgets. Those of you that say you have to be level side to side BEFORE employing the ground control are, IMHO, mistaken

This is what we do:

1. Park the camper where we want it to be - you know - awning will clear the trees, power cord and hoses will reach, etc.

2. Open the control panel door and observe which of the red/orange lights are blinking - this will give you and idea of what is low.

3. Eyeball the distance from the jack pads to the ground and decide how many, if any, plastic leveler pads to place under each leg.

4. Raise the nose of the trailer and unhook truck.

5. Push the AUTO-LEVEL button. Provided the nose was higher than level when you unhooked (as it should be so that the auto re-connect feature will work) the ground control will then lower the nose of the trailer. While it is doing that, the DW and I go to the rear jacks so that, when they start to deploy, we can make sure the pads are centered under the jacks.

6. Go back and monitor the control panel screen - when it says success, lock the little door -done.

It's what works for us. We leave the 1/2 cord of 2x10s at home
We do almost the same with exception of step 5. I had to disconnect & move the truck completely out from under as the 1st step in the auto level was to lower the nose til the jacks were almost completely retracted, truck or rv would've been damaged without moving out of the way.
The hydraulic system is much stronger than the electric & in my opinion a better system. As to 4 or 6 point I'd think that would be determined by rv weight & length.
My recommendation is the 1st time using the auto level system is to have the recalibration sequence ready, level in manual mode, level the rv to your liking using levels side to side front to rear & then do the recalibration, now it will relevel to your liking every time. After doing this though it will not go back to hitch height this time, next time it will. Any time you you relevel in manual mode after unhitching & using auto level the reconnect memory will be lost for that time.
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Old 05-18-2019, 10:34 AM   #11
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Starting year two with our 4 point 3.0 Lippert system. Have yet to use blocks left to right. I would it if looked bad enough and I had no other choice in sites. But we have been in 10-12 different sites now and it hasn’t been issue. As I type this my left side tires are off the ground 2 inches and right side is on the ground. Often wonder if I would have less movement if I did have these tires on blocks, but honestly I just don’t have much movement. so it couldn’t improve much.
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Old 05-18-2019, 12:00 PM   #12
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I've been using the Ground Control 3.0 system for a few months now. I'm of the opinion that you should let the system level the trailer. I don't agree that you should recalibrate the system upon first use - I didn't have to do that. I would suggest that as an option only if the auto level claims the trailer is level but it's not.

I've never noticed any movement in the trailer when the tires are off the ground, so this isn't a concern for me. I just let the system do what it wants.

I've had some times when I've received the "out of stroke" error. I just press the auto-level button again and it works the second time. Perhaps when this happens it gives up the hitch coupler position memory? I don't care about that anyway, so I wouldn't have noticed.

When I can see the trailer is leaning one way, I'll place some plastic yellow blocks under those leveling feet, but that's it.

I love this system - what a time saver.

For those that want to level the trailer first and then run the auto-level system, I just shake my head.
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Old 05-18-2019, 12:33 PM   #13
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“Level up” is hydraulic and as stated, will lower the nose before leveling. Ground control is electric and doesn’t.

Level up is 6 point
Ground control can be either 4 or 6 point. I think number of jacks in ground control is determined by GVWR.
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Old 05-18-2019, 01:28 PM   #14
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As per Lippert's literature, 4 point is used for under 15,000 lbs RVs, 6 point for heavier units.
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Old 05-18-2019, 01:43 PM   #15
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“Level up” is hydraulic and as stated, will lower the nose before leveling. Ground control is electric and doesn’t.

Level up is 6 point
Ground control can be either 4 or 6 point. I think number of jacks in ground control is determined by GVWR.
I actually just parked and leveled my trailer with my Ground Control 3.0 Electric 4pt jacks. It first lowered the front, then proceded to auto level. I just looked through my manual and it doesn't really address the issue of leveling when there is a multi-inch difference from side to side. All it says is start by parking on a level surface. Otherwise relocate the vehicle. Not real helpful but they are likely taking the safe road for liability's sake.
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Old 05-18-2019, 01:46 PM   #16
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.... All it says is start by parking on a level site... .
Which is why I asked the question to start with, it's a vague statement.
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Old 05-18-2019, 03:45 PM   #17
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They just don't want you trying to level on a surface where only a mountain goat would dare tread - If the system was designed to work only on a level surface, it wouldn't be very useful.
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Old 05-18-2019, 04:17 PM   #18
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Starting year two with our 4 point 3.0 Lippert system. Have yet to use blocks left to right. I would it if looked bad enough and I had no other choice in sites. But we have been in 10-12 different sites now and it hasn’t been issue. As I type this my left side tires are off the ground 2 inches and right side is on the ground. Often wonder if I would have less movement if I did have these tires on blocks, but honestly I just don’t have much movement. so it couldn’t improve much.
If you are getting the tires off the ground, you may want to check as you are lowering everything back down the the shackles didn't flip. That is one of the reasons that I will try to never have the tires off the ground when leveling.
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Old 05-18-2019, 04:36 PM   #19
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The real issue is whether to lift the tires off the ground or not. I don't know if there is a diffinitive answer but found this

https://www.etrailer.com/question-258321.html

And this from the manual

Never lift the unit completely off the ground. Lifting the unit so the wheels are not touching the ground will create an unstable and unsafe condition.
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Old 05-19-2019, 05:21 AM   #20
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The real issue is whether to lift the tires off the ground or not. I don't know if there is a diffinitive answer but found this

https://www.etrailer.com/question-258321.html

And this from the manual

Never lift the unit completely off the ground. Lifting the unit so the wheels are not touching the ground will create an unstable and unsafe condition.
Thank you, makes sense.
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