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Old 05-23-2018, 10:53 AM   #1
MattE303
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Battery charging/converter behavior???

When I leave our Carbon toy hauler plugged into shore power, shouldn't it keep the batteries "topped off"?

I was surprised to discover that when plugged in, the batteries run down pretty far (10.4v the last time) before the converter kicks in and charges them. If I leave it plugged in, the cycle then repeats...batteries run down, then get charged when they're really low.

If this is expected behavior, how can I ensure the batteries are fully charged when leaving for a trip, particularly if it's a short drive and I can't rely on them getting fully charged from the TV connection?
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Old 05-23-2018, 11:32 AM   #2
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MattE303, Howdy;

Allow me to ask a few questions.

1 How old are your batteries?
Could be they need replaced.

2 How often do you check the electrolyte level and top off as necessary?
Perhaps they have boiled out dead, kaput, finiteo ...

3 When plugged in what does the Monitor/control board (tank levels and such),
indicate re. your batteries?
If it does NOT indicate FULL (4 lights lit), then your converter is crappin' out
on ya. Mine did that this past winter. Had to replace the converter.

Some things to get ya started, Hope it's a quick easy fix. Let us know what
ya found, might help someone else on down the road.

hank
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Old 05-23-2018, 01:23 PM   #3
MattE303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hankaye View Post
MattE303, Howdy;

Allow me to ask a few questions.

1 How old are your batteries?
Could be they need replaced.

2 How often do you check the electrolyte level and top off as necessary?
Perhaps they have boiled out dead, kaput, finiteo ...

3 When plugged in what does the Monitor/control board (tank levels and such),
indicate re. your batteries?
If it does NOT indicate FULL (4 lights lit), then your converter is crappin' out
on ya. Mine did that this past winter. Had to replace the converter.

Some things to get ya started, Hope it's a quick easy fix. Let us know what
ya found, might help someone else on down the road.

hank
The trailer was purchased new last May. The batteries are zero maintenance. Maybe my post was unclear. I'm not saying the batteries drain unusually quickly, I think I get reasonable life out of them. My reason for posting was that I was just surprised that when plugged in, the converter would only kick on and charge the batteries after they drain to a pretty low level. I would expect that when I plugin, the converter would immediately begin charging, and keep the batteries topped off (fully charged) while the rig remains plugged in. Instead, it waits until they drain to a pretty low level, then charges them fully, then stops charging and lets them drain down again. This cycle will continue to repeat if I leave the trailer plugged in and the batteries connected.

I was wondering if this is normal behavior or not. It certainly isn't what I would have expected, and, as I mentioned, makes it challenging to ensure I leave for a trip with the batteries fully charged (I've never had to deal with this before, as our previous RV had a solar panel which kept the battery topped off while parked at home.)

I installed a voltmeter so I could accurately determine both the charge level of the batteries, and know when the converter is charging them and when it isn't. I also look at the 4 lights, but the voltmeter gives a much better indication of what is happening. The 4 lights are all lit while the converter is charging (as indicated on the voltmeter by a voltage around 13.8-14).
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Old 05-23-2018, 01:36 PM   #4
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I would think that running down then charging is a good thing. Kind of like a battery tender or autatic charger. That keeps them from boiling from constant charging. If you want to be sure they are "topped off" before a trip I would put aanual charger on a low amp setting the night before.
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Old 05-23-2018, 02:31 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tech740 View Post
I would think that running down then charging is a good thing. Kind of like a battery tender or autatic charger. That keeps them from boiling from constant charging. If you want to be sure they are "topped off" before a trip I would put aanual charger on a low amp setting the night before.
I understand what your saying, it does make sense, but I was really hoping a few people would chime in and say either "yup, that normal, that's exactly what mine does"...or "no, it shouldn't do that, sounds like a bad converter".
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Old 05-23-2018, 02:39 PM   #6
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Are you sure they are maintenance free batteries? My friend thought his were too for the last 3 years, I looked at them & they were not. Unless you paid extra at the time of purchase for maintenance free, I would doubt yours are. Typically rvs do not come with maintenance free batteries & just because your dealer may have said they were/are means absolutely nothing unless you verified for yourself.
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Old 05-23-2018, 03:27 PM   #7
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One of the first things I will probably do after I pick up my 5th is change out the Convertor/Charger, it is a single “mode” of “stage” along with 4 AGM batteries.

Google 4 stage Convertor/Charger and there is a big difference in the way they charge vs some of the cheaper models they put in trailers.
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Old 05-23-2018, 03:39 PM   #8
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That ain't normal, not sure when the charger should cut in, I suspect it should be about 12 or a bit higher. My unit keeps the batteries at 12.6 -12.8. I think your changer is on the fritz, the older ones used to have an voltage adjustment screw, probably not the case any more.
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Old 05-23-2018, 04:50 PM   #9
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My 2017 Carbon reads a constant 13.4-13.6 when shore power or generator is on. Batteries shouldn't drop below about 12.2 before charging. It is hard on them to drop to 10.4. It won't take too many times and they won't hold a good charge anymore. I am adding a 2000 watt inverter charger to do away with the factory converter for reasons stated above. 3 stage is much better for the batteries. Plus there are no 12v plugs anywhere inside my rig, planning on adding a few...
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Old 05-23-2018, 05:07 PM   #10
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Battery charging/converter behavior???

Yours doesn’t appear to be functioning correctly. The converter should immediately supply DC voltage in the range of 13.4 to 13.6 almost all the time. It could hit boost mode which is about 14.2

From trekwood for a 2017 Carbon you should have this converter

http://www.trekwood.com/products/630...ck-Mount-w-PFC

Manual for your converter... I see there is a selector switch for type of battery and if dip switches are not set correctly for your type battery that could be an issue

http://wfcoelectronics.com/wp-conten...ors-Manual.pdf

And if the batteries are in good shape they should never get below 12.6 with that converter plugged in and functioning correctly. That’s part of the purpose of he converter.... supply all DC needs for the RV plus charge and maintain batteries.
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Old 05-28-2018, 07:58 AM   #11
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Just got back from a 4 day trip. I monitored the battery charging pretty closely while the gen was running. Behavior was similar to what I described for shore power; on initial startup, batteries would fully charge, then start drawing down (if we were using 12v stuff). I tracked them down to 11 volts before I got concerned that I wouldn't be able to restart the generator if I let them get any lower, so I turned off the generator and restarted it. After the generator restart, the converter kicked in and charged the batteries.

Thanks everyone for the great info. I'm going to confirm the converter model that ChuckS indicated, read the manual he linked, check the DIP switch settings, and maybe call their tech support to confirm expected behavior and figure out what to do from there.

travelin_texans, they definitely are maintenance free, says so right on the sticker.
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Old 05-28-2018, 08:10 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Dreamer View Post
My 2017 Carbon reads a constant 13.4-13.6 when shore power or generator is on. Batteries shouldn't drop below about 12.2 before charging. It is hard on them to drop to 10.4. It won't take too many times and they won't hold a good charge anymore. I am adding a 2000 watt inverter charger to do away with the factory converter for reasons stated above. 3 stage is much better for the batteries. Plus there are no 12v plugs anywhere inside my rig, planning on adding a few...
I know what you mean. I installed this one in our Carbon to have some USB outlets and a volt meter, works really nice.

Cllena Dual USB Socket Charger

I mounted it right above the main control panel and wired it into an unused 15amp slot on the fuse panel. I'd like to add a couple USB charger outlets next to the bed if I can figure out a clean way to run the wires to one of the 12volt lights.
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Old 05-28-2018, 01:41 PM   #13
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I am a little worried about adding outlets to existing light wiring, but may be ok with the factory LED lights? There are two right above headboard that would be easy to access....
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Old 05-29-2018, 06:19 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by SC Dreamer View Post
I am a little worried about adding outlets to existing light wiring, but may be ok with the factory LED lights? There are two right above headboard that would be easy to access....
yeah, it seems to be okay to do, I've seen quite a few threads here where people did that without issue, especially if you're just charging cell phones.
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Old 05-29-2018, 07:48 AM   #15
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If you're using a "tap" from a 14 or 16 gauge DC wire to connect a USB charger port, there is usually no problem with power. If, on the other hand, you're connecting a DC port (cigarette lighter type) and plan to use it to power anything that draws more than a couple of amps, then you'll probably wind up with some "warm wires" or possibly "melted insulation". Trying to operate a 150 watt inverter to power the bedroom TV (for example) is not something those small gauge wires can handle without problems.

So, as said, no problem using a "tap" on the wire to charge cell phones or to charge a tablet is usually OK, but nothing more than that without running a larger DC supply line to the circuit.
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Old 05-29-2018, 10:13 AM   #16
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That is most definitely not normal, and it will shorten the life of your batteries. I agree with Fishsizzle: Get yourself a good multi-stage charger and some AGM batteries. Then set the voltage on the charger for the correct type of batteries. "Deep Cycle" batteries are rarely that. The more charge you maintain in the batts, the longer the life.
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Old 05-31-2018, 09:42 PM   #17
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UPDATE: So I figured out how to get to the converter the other day. It's mounted vertically in the basement behind a carpet covered panel. I removed the screws holding it in place so I could confirm the brand and model number, and get a look at the back side where the DIP switch for selecting the battery type is, as ChuckS suggested. The switch was set correctly so I remounted the converter and put the cover panel back in place. The strange thing is now it seems to be working correctly; I left the trailer plugged in for a couple days and my volt meter showed a constant 13.7 volts the entire time, the battery didn't drain at all. I unplugged it earlier today, and the volt meter has shown 12.9 volts for several hours. I also noticed that the cooling fan hardly runs at all now, previously it ran almost constantly, even when the trailer wasn't plugged in to AC and the converter should be inactive.

I didn't change anything, just removed it from the wall so I could get a better look, then put it back. So it would appear that just jostling it around has fixed (at least temporarily) whatever problem it was having. Does that make any sense?
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Old 06-01-2018, 03:18 AM   #18
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Check all wiring connections, may be some loose ones!
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Old 06-01-2018, 06:02 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Dreamer View Post
Check all wiring connections, may be some loose ones!
I didn't notice any when I was in there last time, but I wasn't specifically checking for that, so I'm gonna open her up and take another look tomorrow, and maybe pull out the three fuses on the converter and check them too.
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Old 06-01-2018, 07:35 AM   #20
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I'd also say a loose wire somewhere. Get a screwdriver and go to the power center (UNPLUG YOUR SHORE POWER and DISCONNECT THE BATTERY first) and tighten every connection on the power center. Every hot lead, every neutral lead, every ground wire, every 12 VDC line and every connection at the fuse block. Don't forget to check the connections on the converter as well as inside the power center.

Those wires have a way of "not being tight enough" when they leave the factory and towing will vibrate them to loosen even more. Seems vibration NEVER tightens a screw.....
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