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05-30-2012, 08:40 AM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 27
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Black tank flush
I just purchased a 2012 fuzion 322. When I hooked up the black tank back flush hose, opened the black tank valve and turned on the hose, it did nothing. The water line looked like it pressurized, but there must be a clog or somethin as the water did not ever seem to make it into the tank and nothing came out the drain.
Thoughts?
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05-30-2012, 08:56 AM
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#2
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fraser Valley BC Canada
Posts: 7,015
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Benrubid -
There have been a number of members who have experienced black water tank flushing problems similar to the one you described. The culprit may be a broken or faulty vacuum breaker located in the flushing system. If you do a forum search (black tank flush or similar) you will find quite a number of threads and posts about this topic.
One of our members, geo, has a diagram of this system and a post about an anti-back flush valve he installed.
Again, use the search feature to find input about the black tank flushing system.
__________________
2008 Cougar 5th Wheel 27RKS
2005 2500 GMC Duramax
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06-03-2012, 12:27 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Colorado Mountains
Posts: 422
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Might be a silly question, but how long did you wait before turning off water? Mine sometimes take almost a full minute before "stuff" starts to emerge. I think it sprays back of tank first.
__________________
Chuck
Wonderful Wife
Australian Shepherd
2010 Ford Expedition TV
2010 Outback 230RS Toybox, 5390# UVW, 6800# Loaded
Not yet camped in Hawaii, 2 Canada Provinces, & 2 Territories
I can't be lost because I don't care where this lovely road is going
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06-03-2012, 01:01 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Oswego Il
Posts: 820
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When I dump the first thing I do is open the black tank valve. Than dump three or four 5 gallon buckets of water down the toilet. This tends to add more water to the tank and help to get the debris to start moving out of the tank. When the debris flow slows down from the black tank, I will than turn on the water to flush the black tank. The black tank flush will run for at least 10 min's or more, you will be surprise at the amount of crud that will come out of the tank the first time you do this.
Jim W.
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Jim & Jill
2010 318SAB Cougar
2008 Dodge 6.7LCummins the original 6.7L engine, w/68RFE Auto
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06-07-2012, 05:40 AM
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#5
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Georgia
Posts: 14
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I too had the same problem with a Bullet 230bhs. I took it back to dealer and was told the check valve was installed backwards. This seems to be a popular problem with the flush systems. I also use two 1 gallon jugs filled with water that I pour down toilet as the tank empties. This seems to really wash out anything left behind. Everyone seems to have great ideas on getting the funk tank cleaned out. The best idea I have used is on your way to your site, drop a small bag of ice down toilet. That combined with the little water thats in there really cleans it out. I pull up to the station before I set up and dump. Its a small hassle but works.
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06-26-2012, 04:06 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: VA
Posts: 109
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Black Tank Flush
I have one of these on my Cougar and I tried to use it and it really didn't seem to do much. It did put water in the tank, made an awful lot of noise and my friend I was camping with laughed at me. So I disconnected the water line (after 10 - 20 minutes of "flushing") and he let me borrow his 45 degree connection that has a flush line built in to it. I used that and you would have thought that I never even emptied my black tank previously. That is what I use now. Maybe something's wrong with my flush, but the 45 connection with a flush line is the ticket for me. They don't really explain how to use the flush on the RV so maybe I'm doing something wrong or just not doing something I should be. Any ideas?
****
I tried using mine again and this time I noticed water dripping out from under my camper. It was leaking into the camper from the connection just inside the camper which is under the sink in the bathroom. After soaking up all the water I could I decided to just never use it again. I had let it run for nearly an hour! and when I hooked up my flush attachment I got a WHOLE LOT MORE out of the tank still.
__________________
Paul
2011 Toyota Tundra, 5.7L, Double Cab, 4x4, Tow Package
2013 Keystone Premier Bullet 33BLPR
BlueOx Sway Pro WD Hitch
Husky Escort Time Ramp Brake Controller (need an upgrade)
Air Lift [Load Lifter 5000] Air Bags
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06-30-2012, 04:37 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Ontario,Califorina
Posts: 415
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Back water flush valve (antisyphone)
Well, maybe some of you were lucky black water flush valve plugged. Mine was putting all the hose water in the 5th wheel. In the wall through the contol pannel, down to the breaker pannel. Water was running out the storage compartment. So P.O. Only used this about 6 times. Ok here goes replacement part was changed to a different manufactor. Because????
So went to a different rv store and Order a Brass Instead of plastic back flow preventor anti syphone valve. Keystone should had a recall. My big question is why put this suff around your electrical.
Randy, 39.7 foot Raptor
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06-30-2012, 08:27 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: On the road
Posts: 163
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Sorry to hijack but Randy you private messaged me but aren't allowing private messages yourself so I can't reply. Turn that feature on and let me know. Thanks.
__________________
Kent K.
Full Timer
2010 Raptor 300MP
2004 Harley Screamin' Eagle Electra Glide (for fun), 1 dog (great company)
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10-22-2012, 11:09 AM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kansas City MO area
Posts: 48
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Well here's my experience with the black tank flush system FWIW. I have a new to me Cougar I got this summer, and used the flusher once with no problems, dump open, I used a water hose from outdoor shower faucet on RV . All went well.
This past Saturday I dumped and flushed, only the second time I've used it. This time I used a garden hose 100' hooked to the house (I'm doing this at home), with a shutoff valve on the end of the garden hose at the RV, dump open. All hooked up from the house to the RV. Shutoff is closed, I go to the house and turn on the water, then go to the RV, open shutoff on my garden hose and a split second later, I hear a noise-POP! and water is running out of a hole (for the water lines) in the floor of the bathroom into the basement storage. I had the storage door open so I noticed it very quickly. I instantly shut off the water and went inside to find water all over bathroom floor. Under the bathroom sink I found water all over and pieces of the vacuum breaker valve.
I'm pretty sure what happend was that when I turned on the water at the house, it created air pressure in the hose and when I released it all at once the breaker valve couldn't handle it and it blew the top off of it, like those water rockets we had as kids. I didn't realize that vacuum valve thing was even in there. Live and learn. Sure will do it different next time, I should have connected a water regulator.
Has anyone ever had one of these valves apart? I think I found all of the pieces. Is there supposed to a spring that goes in that valve, or does it just close by gravity? It looks just like the one in the picture on this thread.
http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/sho...ghlight=vacuum
P.S. I've already read all the threads about these breaker valves and I understand what it's for and what it does, I just didn't know it was there until 2 days ago. Now I know. Thanks
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10-22-2012, 01:59 PM
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#10
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Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Clackamas, OR
Posts: 41
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I have a 2012 Cougar and use the black tank flush every time I dump the black tank. So far no problems! I use a pressure regulator on the Park faucet when I am flushing the tank, I read in the Keystone Owners Manual that water pressure should not exceed 40 psi on the flush line.
I run the flush about 15 minutes after each dump. It takes about 10+ minutes for the water to begin running clear. I wouldn't own an RV that didn't have a black tank flush system installed.
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Dave
2012 Cougar 327RESWE & 2011 Dodge Ram 2500 HD LB 6.7L Cummins
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10-22-2012, 02:25 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: North Texas
Posts: 1,000
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TDF5G -
You have pretty much figured out the problem. You just need a name - water hammer. Water hammers can occur under different circumstances, in your case, you say there was air in the hose, and with or without - doesn't matter in this case - a regulator, you turned the water on. So there is that front of water, pushing out the air in the pipe, rushing along and gaining momentum. Then, pow! The restriction of the plastic vacuum valve is introduced. The water acted like a hammer and blew the top off the valve. Kinda like doing a belly-buster off the high diving board!
That is but one reason the "experts" (who ever they are) recommend running water through the hose until the line is cleared of anything in the hose and any air. Looks like time for a replacement.
Ron
__________________
2011 Alpine 3640RL (Beauty)
(Gone! Now replaced by Beauty3)
2016 Ford F-450 (The Beast)
Diesel 4x4, DRW, LB, CC
Comfort Ride Hitch
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10-22-2012, 04:31 PM
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#12
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Golden, Colorado
Posts: 85
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Black flush
Ditto what Dave said.
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Marc and Janice
Golden (home of Coors beer) Colorado
Oscar and Abby (Westies)
2012 Laredo 294RK TT "Larry"
'09 Chevy 2500HD Crewcab, 6.0L vortec (gas)
*Wishin' for a diesel*
Equal-I-Zer sway control hitch
Life is good!
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10-26-2012, 05:20 AM
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#13
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kansas City MO area
Posts: 48
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Yeah, that's a good name for it. It sure hammered that vacuum breaker. I've got all the pieces to it, this will be a job for super glue.
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10-27-2012, 05:43 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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I would not recommend gluing the vacuum breaker.
If you do a search, there was some discussion on replacing the plastic vacuum breaker with on made of brass as a way of preventing failures and the resulting leaks. FWIW
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Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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11-01-2012, 08:19 AM
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#15
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kansas City MO area
Posts: 48
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Yes, I remember reading about those, available at hdwe store. I'm going to glue it. It should be OK, if I don't put too much pressure on it again. If it does fail again, (most likely not) I'll replace it with one of those.
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11-01-2012, 08:48 AM
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#16
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Marysville PA
Posts: 65
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I have found that if the water pressure is too low, the black tank flush will not work.
__________________
2011 Passport 280BH LE
2009 Dodge Ram 1500
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11-01-2012, 11:19 AM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Monticello, GA
Posts: 256
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Couldn't you (me, really) just stick a garden hose down the crapper turn it on and let the tank drain till clear? Do I have to have one of these spray cleaner things?
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11-01-2012, 11:48 AM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Northville NY in the Adirondacks
Posts: 2,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CUFFS054
Couldn't you (me, really) just stick a garden hose down the crapper turn it on and let the tank drain till clear? Do I have to have one of these spray cleaner things?
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The tank sprayer hits the walls of the tank with a pressure blast similar to that from a garden hose nozzle. Stuffing a hose down the toilet just puts water in the tank. The idea with the sprayer is to clean the tank, not just drain it.
__________________
'11 Cougar 326MKS loaded with mods
'12 Ford F250 SuperCab 6.7 PowerStroke Diesel
Amateur Radio: KD2IAT (146.520) GMRS: WQPG808 (462.675 TPL 141.3)
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11-02-2012, 07:32 AM
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#19
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Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Kansas City MO area
Posts: 48
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My old trailer didn't have a flush system for the black tank. I used one of those wand sprayers stuck down the toilet or just a hose itself. I would shake the trailer and rinse until it was draining out clear water. This seemed to work just find, no problems. I would recommend not using your potable water hose for this though.
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11-02-2012, 08:37 AM
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#20
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Northville NY in the Adirondacks
Posts: 2,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDF5G
My old trailer didn't have a flush system for the black tank. I used one of those wand sprayers stuck down the toilet or just a hose itself. I would shake the trailer and rinse until it was draining out clear water. This seemed to work just find, no problems. I would recommend not using your potable water hose for this though.
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I have one of those wand sprayers, too. It worked great in our last trailer, but the Cougar's toilet is above the basement which means the wand isn't long enough to reach down into the holding tank. My drain pipe is straight down so I suppose I could get some PVC pipe and couplers and make the wand longer. However, a longer wand (4' or so) becomes a pain to store. It would also be a lot harder to clean off when you pull it out of the toilet.
Second issue for some fiver owners is that the 3" drain pipe from the bottom of the toilet to the holding may not be straight. A number of them have one or more bends in them which means that the wand, even if long enough, can not reach the tank. We had an extensive discussion on this a while back.
__________________
'11 Cougar 326MKS loaded with mods
'12 Ford F250 SuperCab 6.7 PowerStroke Diesel
Amateur Radio: KD2IAT (146.520) GMRS: WQPG808 (462.675 TPL 141.3)
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