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Old 07-18-2018, 06:11 AM   #1
steamboatscott
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Grump alert: camp apps, drones, generators, loud music, etc

Does anyone else miss the “good ol’ days” of camping where campers were quiet without generators/music, enjoyed the outdoors without flying their drones, left with whatever trash they brought, and finding that beautiful dispersed campsite required a bit of work but rewarded you with serenity? It seems that apps like Allstays, Campendium, etc have brought more people than the land can withstand, and too many of those visitors aren’t treating the land well either.
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Old 07-18-2018, 06:17 AM   #2
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I hear you scott, it's not just campgrounds. Concerts, theatres, sporting events, schools, community centres, anywhere humans congregate. I look at camping from a May - June September - October perspective. I don't want to be in a KOA in the summer.
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Old 07-18-2018, 07:07 AM   #3
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Let me take a slightly different view. I do see the crowded conditions, and also the generator noise, but I believe that we, both Canada AND United States as a whole treat our spaces slightly better than in the past, leaving places cleaner and in somewhat better shape. However, I can’t do anything about drones, barking dogs, and adults on their cellphones rather than talking to each other.
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Old 07-18-2018, 07:20 AM   #4
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I feel that true campers treat the land/campsites better now than they did before. I am not a fan of what we call "Weekend Warriors".
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:19 AM   #5
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I went camping with half a dozen "adventure travelers" a while back. I started laughing when I looked around the camp fire and every single one of them had their noses buried in their cell phones. I use my cell phone for work, rarely even know where it is on the weekends/vacation days. Everyone that knows me knows that they have to call my wife to get reach me when I'm not at work.
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:21 AM   #6
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I love listening to music while camping. That being said I always walk my site and all around my camper to make sure others can not hear it. We have two beagles we bring camping. We always make sure they do not annoy others. Dogs bark, but excessive, and they go into the camper to calm down. It seems I'm always picking others trash up when I get to a campsite too.
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:30 AM   #7
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One thing that I don't miss from the old days is that when you moved into a campsite you had to police the area of cigarette butts.
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:37 AM   #8
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With a profile name of steamboatscott, it's no guess where you're talking about.... When we lived in Denver in the 70's, we spent lots of weekends in the area around Steamboat Springs. Back then there was one ski hill with a rope tow and a couple bars on main street. Otherwise, Steamboat Springs was a "sleepy little town".

We went back through the area (we own 5 acres north of Steamboat Lake) a couple years ago. Gone were the 80' fir trees and the isolated campground at Pearl Lake. Gone was the open camping on the east shore of Steamboat Reservoir. The entire campground at Pearl Lake had been "clearcut" and new "level parking pads with tables and fire rings" installed on steeped levels to accommodate as many campers as possible. The trash cans were filled, plastic bags stacked by the dumpsters, paper blowing across the campground and the entire area "screams of overuse"....

Steamboat Lake State Park looks to be, essentially, a blacktop maze of campsites, some with electricity, water and a couple of dump stations. The old camping area, on the east side of the reservoir, near the dam, is a big parking lot, several 55 gallon barrels for trash, no covers, trash blowing around the area. There were signs "admonishing users" to pick up after themselves, a list of 3 pages of "rules" (all of which were common sense for anyone who cares, but obviously being ignored because there was no "enforcement")... That area, also "screams of overuse".

Those fond memories of going to Columbine and not seeing another human for the week??? All just "fond memories"..... Ain't happening in today's campgrounds north of Steamboat Springs.

Sad, honestly, very sad. To me, it's not about "not seeing other people" it's about, "not seeing what they destroy that belongs to all of us."
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Old 07-18-2018, 08:46 AM   #9
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There are 2 types of campers we've noticed lately.
There's those that enjoy the outdoors & all that Mother Nature has provided, pick up after themselves & their pets (everyone has at least 1 pet), & are willing to help others around them.
The other group, which gets larger every weekend, shows up & thinks the ENTIRE park is theirs from the time they arrive until they drive out leaving trash, dog poop, old bbq grills & whatever else they don't need/want anymore behind. The whole time the kids running through everyone's sites with the dogs running/barking behind them, no respect for anyone else. Then at dark they build a huge campfire at each site stinking up the whole park, playing music loudly til the wee hours of the morning. Then they show up in the bathhroms/showers, if you didn't use the facilities Friday afternoon before they all arrived, forget using til late Monday after the poor workkampers have had a chance to scoop out the big stuff & hose it down. Never have understood writing on the bathroom walls with poop?? The worst part is it's not all kids doing it???
Since we've went fulltime we try to find 55+ parks (some of which are not much better) or non kid oriented parks. We're too big for most state/national parks.
Sorry to be so long winded, but that's my "grumpy ole' fart" take on the campgrounds of today.
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Old 07-18-2018, 09:26 AM   #10
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My grandson's (19) hiking app saved the day for us. We were looking for the Proxy Falls trailhead on hwy 242 and I was sure we must have missed it and after some discussion was ready to turn back and look for it. The app said keep going it's further down the road. Sure enough we found the trailhead about 10 minutes later. Grandson put the phone away and we enjoyed a great hike and photography session for the rest of the day.
Had to eat a little crow after being reminded of some remark earlier about map, app, butt, and both hands
Don't really mind crow once you get past the beak and feet...
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Old 07-18-2018, 10:05 AM   #11
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My son and two granddaughters camped with us for three days in June. First thing I did before they arrived was pick up a thankfully minimal amount of previous camper trash (and I always leave a campsite clean). The girls spent car time on the drive up and in their tent with electronics, but when they asked about recharging them their Dad said, "Nope, we're here to enjoy the outdoors." Atta boy son!

My recent irritation wasn't with campers but with rules and regs in California that prompted a "clean-up" and what I supposed was an ADA compliant retrofitting of a favorite campground. I'm a left leg amputee and admit the half-price fee for certain parks is nice, but come on gov't people... do we really need natural boulders, tree trunks and ferns removed to be replaced with decomposed granite and 3-foot high fire pit enclosures? It destroyed the feel of the place. Over the years nature is taking over again, but it's nothing like it was before.

As for the crowds and noisy group camping sites I've been pretty fortunate. One of our annual outings is the weekend after Labor Day when everyone has had their big hurrah last trip of the summer. The lake levels may be low but it's peaceful.

I recently posted about Collins Lake, their high fees and packing people into their 500+ campsites. I guess if you grew up with that it's "normal", but I camp to get away from the daily grind and crowds. We don't have a TV in our trailer, just a selection of favorite music CD's and the button that disconnects outdoor speakers so we don't bother any neighbors.
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Old 07-18-2018, 12:00 PM   #12
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I believe it was Yogi Berra who said " No one goes there nowadays, it’s too crowded."
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Old 07-18-2018, 12:13 PM   #13
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Love quiet (at least most of the time). Our summer CG is usually ridiculously quiet. Want to blab on your cell phone - good luck. If conditions are right, you MAY get a couple bars near the office. Like to drink and party past 11:00 - not at that CG. You WILL get an owner's visit. If you continue, a second visit will occur along with a flashing light bar on a Ford Explorer. You will not hear airplanes, Jake brakes, car horns tho a train horn does occasionally happen way off in the distance. You may wake up to the odor of fresh manure in a nearby field or a black and white kitty may have unloaded.

We escape the noise of a new housing development, the roar of I-87 3 miles away and a couple neighbors incessantly yapping dogs along with the moron across the street that likes to rattle the neighborhood's windows with his truck's stereo.

Those new 'campers' and I use that word loosly are in part a new breed of fairly well heeled people that have heard that it's fun to commune with nature - as long as they still have their TV, boom boxes, cheap beer and can sleep in air conditioned comfort. The next time the economy dips, those that have heavily financed toys based on their past income - those toys, including RVs will sit in back yards or worse. I'm not going to get into the entitlement phenomena that the world is facing, but that is all part of the all me, me,me, me and just because I can!
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Old 07-18-2018, 12:45 PM   #14
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I just remembered something about that camping outing with the DW, my son and two granddaughters. A large TT pulled by a dually with a huge racked cargo area in back (obviously a work truck) took both campsites next to us. The site nearest to us was used just to park the truck and I watched as the guy unloaded kayaks, bicycles, rafts and more in that site. The campsite they occupied was truly amazing with multiple pop-ups, tables, chairs, coolers, hammock, piles of cooking gear, fishing rods and such spread everywhere. It made me tired just looking at everything that would need to be packed up and then unpacked when they got home!
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Old 07-18-2018, 01:18 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Dave W View Post

Those new 'campers' and I use that word loosly are in part a new breed of fairly well heeled people that have heard that it's fun to commune with nature - as long as they still have their TV, boom boxes, cheap beer and can sleep in air conditioned comfort. The next time the economy dips, those that have heavily financed toys based on their past income - those toys, including RVs will sit in back yards or worse. I'm not going to get into the entitlement phenomena that the world is facing, but that is all part of the all me, me,me, me and just because I can!
Reminds me of the 1980's - 90's and the rise of the DINKS (dual income, no kids) when DW and I were boaters. The bigger, loader, and gaudier the boat the more desirable. When the market crashed the boats were on the sales lots in numbers and to us the Chesapeake Bay returned to it's former, friendlier, family and waterman inhabitants. JMHO
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Old 07-18-2018, 01:54 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
...
Gone were the 80' fir trees and the isolated campground at Pearl Lake. Gone was the open camping on the east shore of Steamboat Reservoir. The entire campground at Pearl Lake had been "clearcut" and new "level parking pads with tables and fire rings" installed on steeped levels to accommodate as many campers as possible.
...
Are you sure it was intentionally clear cut just to get rid of the trees? Our timber has been decimated by pine beetle over the last 10 years or so here, and the dead timber cut where there was a potential for personal injury by falling trees. Many other areas are an absolute mess of dead standing or fallen trees. One area north of Kremmling did get logged off to get rid of the beetle killed trees, but something went awry after cutting and stacking logs in landings, where it sits and rots today.
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Old 07-18-2018, 03:32 PM   #17
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I just remembered something about that camping outing with the DW, my son and two granddaughters. A large TT pulled by a dually with a huge racked cargo area in back (obviously a work truck) took both campsites next to us. The site nearest to us was used just to park the truck and I watched as the guy unloaded kayaks, bicycles, rafts and more in that site. The campsite they occupied was truly amazing with multiple pop-ups, tables, chairs, coolers, hammock, piles of cooking gear, fishing rods and such spread everywhere. It made me tired just looking at everything that would need to be packed up and then unpacked when they got home!

LOL! That reminded me of a time.....

I've camped all my life and back in the 70s it was tent camping and the basic stuff. I made a friend that began work at our location (from FL, we were in SE NM) and he had never tent camped. He asked and I told him the basics of what you needed and what it was like. A time later I advised him we were headed to the hills and would he like to come along? Absolutely! He would get his stuff ready. On the day we were to leave I saw him come around the corner in his Ford Supercab….and my jaw dropped.

The front view of him coming down the street looked like the truck had "saddlebags" hanging off the sides. When he got there it was loaded higher than the roof (our location was 4 hrs. away) and stuff was hanging over the sides everywhere; including a 12'x12' piece of carpet! Since our conversations he had accumulated, I believe, every kind of camping "anything" he could find - much, if not most, was not needed at best. It was hilarious when he set up camp with the folding metal cots, on a carpeted floor; interior 12v lights, a 12v tv, little stands to go by the cots and on and on. I called it the Taj Mahal and it stuck...he called it that for many years. Thanks for the laugh and memory recall.
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Old 07-18-2018, 03:44 PM   #18
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Are you sure it was intentionally clear cut just to get rid of the trees? ....
No, I'm not sure of that, but if it was cut for beetle infestation, the beetles respected the road into the campground and all the trees north, east and south of the lake (they're all still standing). The only trees "clear cut" were in the campground area and about 100' on each side of the road into the area. There were stumps 36"-48" in diameter all over the area.

If you pull up a Google satellite view of Pearl Lake, you'll see that the campground is the only "brown, clearcut area" in that part of the state park.

ADDED: Looking closer at the lake, you may be correct about cut trees. There are what looks like fallen timber around the lake. But those areas are green, the campground is brown/gray with almost no vegetation. If you look closely, the old dirt road in the original campground is still visible between the new campground and the lake. In the 70's, it was a 10 site, very primitive campground. I don't think we ever camped there when there was more than 1 or maybe 2 other campers in the campground.
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Old 07-20-2018, 05:40 AM   #19
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Pearl Lake campground was definatepy cleared for pine beetle. I find there and other areas of Northwest Colorado to be better than average for crowds and people respecting the environment. Probably because it’s easier to stop in Breckinridge and the surrounding area than to continue up the narrow and windy highway to Steamboat.

Getting back to my original point, I do believe that convenient locators like the apps mentioned previously allow too many people without respect for the environment to easily overcrowd the land. Without an easy pointer to the boondocks, I believe that more of those people would be in developed campgrounds and RV parks where camp hosts, state park staff, etc are paid to keep the area clean and enforced other rules of respect.
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Old 07-20-2018, 05:56 AM   #20
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Good conversation, valid points.

Most of the people we see are respectful of the CG and others. There are the outliers who somehow survived not being"thinned out" in their home town in their teens. They can be challenging to have in your CG loop. Completely clueless and the other problem is they breed and teach their offspring.

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