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Old 06-26-2016, 06:20 AM   #1
Hankintu
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Power loss

Took the 217EXP on the first trip to a state park. Everything went well overall but had a weird experience.

Wife and I were sitting outside watching a movie through the screen door as this model has the swivel TV wall mount located so one can swing the TV around to make it viewable out there. After about 4 or so of the beverage of the night was consumed, all of a sudden, black out. Not all of the electrical went out as the ceiling lights, DVD player and refer stayed on but the outside outlet, AC, and TV went down.

Okay then, opened the fuse center and checked all of the fuses, 13 in total, not one blown. No breakers tripped. Went out and checked the park supply breakers, nothing tripped. 15 minutes later while trying to think of why this was happening, everything started back up again. This was during the week and no neighbors to confer with, so is this normal at some public campsites?
And why would a partial failure happen? I am not an electrician but it seems odd that this would happen with a 120 volt system. Also, the AC was off at the time.
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Old 06-26-2016, 06:45 AM   #2
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This is strictly a WAG, but is it possible that the campground power was off for a while? All of the items you indicated were still "working" are battery driven, and the things you say "stopped working" are "campground power" driven.

My guess would be that the campground lost power for a bit. When that happened, the 12 volt DC system started drawing power from the battery while the TV, outside outlet and A/C stopped working.

It's pretty much the same scenario that would occur if you were to be doing the same "TV watching" and someone "pulled the shore power plug" from the campground pedestal.
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Old 06-26-2016, 08:24 AM   #3
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That response makes a lot of sense. But that poses the question that if the system has an inverter for 12V to 120V, which it does, why is it that the TV and outside plug in were not still active until the battery ran out?
As mentioned, all of the interior ceiling lights were still powered.I can understand why the AC wouldn't work and I am guessing that the fridge switched to LP with the auto light indicator being fed by the 12V battery via the inverter.
I would think that when boondocking, one should be able to watch TV off of a fully charged battery. One might guess that it tripped out and when attempts were made to turn it back on the signal from the remote simply was the culprit, but that doesn't explain why the patio lights went out and did not relight until all the power was restored to the entire camper.
It is apparent I need a better understanding of the electrical system.
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Old 06-26-2016, 08:34 AM   #4
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I think you are confusing inverter with converter. The converter that came with your trailer converts ac to dc and charges the battery. If YOU have added an inverter that would change 12v dc to 120v ac and most likely have to be turned on and off manually. JM2¢, Hank
If you turned lights off with your remote you must turn them back on with it ... switches will not work. ALL lights are 12v dc and work off the battery or the CONVERTER when on shore power.
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Old 06-27-2016, 03:38 AM   #5
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Thanks for enlightening me, I "assumed" that it had an inverter that would switch on when an AC power source for the lower amp devices, I don't know why I thought that. Probably because I had an inverter on my old pop up that didn't have an AC or fridge.
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Old 06-27-2016, 11:03 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankintu View Post
Thanks for enlightening me, I "assumed" that it had an inverter that would switch on when an AC power source for the lower amp devices, I don't know why I thought that. Probably because I had an inverter on my old pop up that didn't have an AC or fridge.

AC would require way more amps than most inverters can provide, not to mention a monster battery system. (Hard core boondockers with tens of thousands of bucks have done it with massive solar arrays and lithium battery banks).

Fridge runs off of DC and propane when shore power isn't available, unless you have one of these "residential fridge" setups they're doing now. I'd never ever buy that in an RV. When shore power is available it'll run off of that. There's also controls for these modes, you should familiarize yourself with yours in case you need to put the fridge manually on one or the other.

If you're thinking about adding an inverter, there are ways to do it, but you have to isolate the interior AC outlets from shore power when on inverter or add outlets for the inverter power or whatever, there's more than one way to skin that cat. Folks here have documented how they've done it. But you'll also likely need much more battery than these coaches come with. A single deep cycle lead acid won't last long driving things and definitely won't drive high current things.

There's also grounding issues to think about if you're going to "backfeed" the coach AC system when boondocking.

If you're not electrically handy, best to consult a pro about what you want to do on battery power and let them design and install a safe system.

Or...

Just know what's DC powered and what's AC powered.

If all you're looking to operate on DC power is the TV, a modest battery upgrade, and a reasonable sized "portable" automotive inverter and a connection to the DC power and an AC extension cord will handle that. Might even get away with it with the stock battery for a night or two.

(Caution: If you run your coach batteries down, remember that your slide outs and landing gear / jacks and/or auto-levelers are also DC and you won't be able to move them without "jump starting" your trailer or having a charge circuit added between the two vehicle and trailer when connected and waiting a loooooong time for that to charge the trailer back up enough for high current draw. You'll also significantly impact the lifespan of your coach's single stock battery anytime you discharge it below about 11VDC which doesn't take much with the wimpy things they install stock.)

If you move up to wanting other things battery powered, it gets progressively more expensive and is pretty much a re-design of the coach's electrical system overall.
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Old 06-28-2016, 03:00 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
This is strictly a WAG, but is it possible that the campground power was off for a while? All of the items you indicated were still "working" are battery driven, and the things you say "stopped working" are "campground power" driven.

My guess would be that the campground lost power for a bit. When that happened, the 12 volt DC system started drawing power from the battery while the TV, outside outlet and A/C stopped working.

It's pretty much the same scenario that would occur if you were to be doing the same "TV watching" and someone "pulled the shore power plug" from the campground pedestal.
I am quite sure this is exactly what happened, thanks again.
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Old 06-28-2016, 03:11 AM   #8
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Yep, I know how the inverter works, have two on the shelf, just thought for some stupid reason this camper had one for low voltage items. I would go the dual power source Champion generator before messing with anything else for booning. Already have tested the LP mode on the fridge, so that's all good. Thanks for the reply though, it reminds me of some of the stuff I did when tent camping and playing VHS movies in the tent for the kids! (yea, me and the wife too.) Happy times.
Quote:
Originally Posted by denverpilot View Post
AC would require way more amps than most inverters can provide, not to mention a monster battery system. (Hard core boondockers with tens of thousands of bucks have done it with massive solar arrays and lithium battery banks).

Fridge runs off of DC and propane when shore power isn't available, unless you have one of these "residential fridge" setups they're doing now. I'd never ever buy that in an RV. When shore power is available it'll run off of that. There's also controls for these modes, you should familiarize yourself with yours in case you need to put the fridge manually on one or the other.

If you're thinking about adding an inverter, there are ways to do it, but you have to isolate the interior AC outlets from shore power when on inverter or add outlets for the inverter power or whatever, there's more than one way to skin that cat. Folks here have documented how they've done it. But you'll also likely need much more battery than these coaches come with. A single deep cycle lead acid won't last long driving things and definitely won't drive high current things.

There's also grounding issues to think about if you're going to "backfeed" the coach AC system when boondocking.

If you're not electrically handy, best to consult a pro about what you want to do on battery power and let them design and install a safe system.

Or...

Just know what's DC powered and what's AC powered.

If all you're looking to operate on DC power is the TV, a modest battery upgrade, and a reasonable sized "portable" automotive inverter and a connection to the DC power and an AC extension cord will handle that. Might even get away with it with the stock battery for a night or two.

(Caution: If you run your coach batteries down, remember that your slide outs and landing gear / jacks and/or auto-levelers are also DC and you won't be able to move them without "jump starting" your trailer or having a charge circuit added between the two vehicle and trailer when connected and waiting a loooooong time for that to charge the trailer back up enough for high current draw. You'll also significantly impact the lifespan of your coach's single stock battery anytime you discharge it below about 11VDC which doesn't take much with the wimpy things they install stock.)

If you move up to wanting other things battery powered, it gets progressively more expensive and is pretty much a re-design of the coach's electrical system overall.
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Old 06-28-2016, 12:58 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hankintu View Post
Yep, I know how the inverter works, have two on the shelf, just thought for some stupid reason this camper had one for low voltage items. I would go the dual power source Champion generator before messing with anything else for booning. Already have tested the LP mode on the fridge, so that's all good. Thanks for the reply though, it reminds me of some of the stuff I did when tent camping and playing VHS movies in the tent for the kids! (yea, me and the wife too.) Happy times.


Very happy times! Camping!

All good then. Have fun!
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