Swapping out tankless water heater for traditional?

[govols380]

The on demand water heater sounded positive, but during one brief weekend camp I'm already thinking about retrogtading my 2023 TT to a standard water heater. What do I need to consider?

[Mikendebbie]

Forum member ChuckS has suggested (in several previous threads for on-demand water heaters) the best replacement water heater is the Suburban SW12DEL.

[RickV]

I am kinda curious as to why? Ours has worked great for 3 years (about 15 months of use). We put it in recirculation mode and get almost instant hot water. I thought it would use a lot of Propane but in each of the 3 seasons we end up using about one 30lb tank.

[ChuckS]

The trend for the last 2-3 years on some RVs has been switching to an on demand water heater...

The Standard Dual Mode WH .. either by suburban or atwood is a much better option overall..

On demand WHs only operate via LP mode.. no electric mode

Standard RV style dual mode WHs use either LP or 120 electric (most models)

The Airxcel IW60 and IW60RL are one of 3 popular units
Girard has the GSHW-2 unit
Lippert has a unit
Truma is another
Foggati is yet another

The IW60RL which came ONLY installed in the Alpine fifth wheel is junk.. several owners have had many issues.. to include no heat, erratic heat, recirculation pump cracking, heat chamber cracks

The IW60 is an over the counter unit anyone can buy and install .. it has no recirculation loop but still has main board failures, reliable heating issues, etc

The issue with the IW series is many... replacement parts, finding someone that has a clue on how to work on them, etc

For me... the standard RV style dual mode WH lets me run on 120 power instead of LP when staying at an RV park where I have already paid for the power... I also have the LP mode if boon docking, AND if the LP mode failed I still have electric mode to run with...because the control is two separate systems

Its a personal decision for many... wife and I find that the SW12DEL provides plenty of hot water..

If something were to have an issue with the SW12 series I can quickly TS and repair anything on the unit ( both LP or elec mode )

** Try that with an IW60 series when either the Air pressure switch or an issue on the main circuit board occurs... most Techs have NO IDEA what to do with that unit

good luck with your choice

[dutchmensport]

Before you do any changes, you need to settle on which water heater you want. Then you need to measure the dimensions of the water heater. Then you need to make sure you have a space to put the new water heater. You'll need to run a propane gas line, the electric like, and re-do the plumbing.

Then you'll need to run wires fir the on-off switches (the buttons you push inside the camper) for both gas and electric. No doubt, you'll have pull the underbelly down so you access the plumbing from under the floor, figure out how to run all those wires, and in the end, pray everything actually works.

But, it all starts by getting the dimensions and then make sure you have somewhere it can actually be installed. Remember, you have to cut a hole big enough on the outside of your camper for it to fit. And then, make sure you are not cutting through any of the upright stud framing on the camper.

I can be done, it's just wood, metal, pipes, and wires. But it's also going to be a labor intensive project too. Make sure you have somewhere you can do the work to get out of the weather too. Nothing worse than working on a project like this in freezing weather or miserable rain!

Good luck!

[SargeW]

Originally Posted by govols380

The on demand water heater sounded positive, but during one brief weekend camp I'm already thinking about retrogtading my 2023 TT to a standard water heater. What do I need to consider?

Where were you 6 months ago! I did the reverse, swapped out the Suburban 6 gallon tank WH for a Girard tankless. The swap was pretty easy actually, as they both need similar hook ups. One thing you will need for the tank WH is a dedicated 120 volt line for the AC side of the tank WH. Mine had one (that is now an available extra outlet) that I left in the wall as the tankless only needs a 12 volt line for the display read out.

I did have to buy a new WH door for the new Girard as the old Suburban door would not match up. Some WH come with a door, some do not and are sold separately.

Other than that they are pretty much the same.

[cougar23]

We had this change made on our 2023 Cougar at the dealer. We had a 2022 Thor class C motorhome with the On Demand water heater which we hated.
We sold the motorhome and bought our current 5th wheel which came with a On Demand water heater. Before taking possession I insisted that the On Demand heater be replaced with conventional gas/elect. heater.
The mechanic installed a Dometic WH-6GEA heater which fit in the hole left by the on demand heater. Biggest problem he had was installing wires for the switches between the walls inside the camper. Took him less than 1/2 day to complete the job.
Something to keep in mind is the On Demand tankless heater had no bypass valves therefore my winterizing station would not work. You will need bypass valves for winterizing. The Dometic heater came with bypass valves on the backside but I had no access to them until I made an access panel in back of our pantry.
We love our gas/elect. water heater. No more cold water shock!

[govols380]

Originally Posted by RickV

I am kinda curious as to why? Ours has worked great for 3 years (about 15 months of use). We put it in recirculation mode and get almost instant hot water. I thought it would use a lot of Propane but in each of the 3 seasons we end up using about one 30lb tank.

Ours doesn't have recirculation, and the WH is maybe 20 feet from fixtures. Every time you turn off water it gets 10 or more seconds of cold before getting new hot again. Love the floor plan, didn't appreciate how poorly the mechanical was laid out.

The furnace and electrical are under the kitchen sink and righ beside the bathroom, both in the rear. The water panel and WH are up front neat the batteries and inverter.

I'm usually smart enough to have known better...

[TXiceman]

The tankless water heater might work better if Keystone designers would use common sense. Our 22MLS Cogar has the water heater mounted diagonally opposite corners from the shower and kitchen. You have to wast 2 gallons of water to get hot to the shower. It is really a poor design. And don't tell me to recapture or recirculate the water. We were on a site with electric and water and no sewer.

This winter the stupid Girrard is going adios and a straight propane water heater installed. It is not worth the effort or cost to add for the electric connection.

[Cmarkj]

I wish I had done more research on tankless WHs before we bought or Arcadia this year. It sounds great, a very good marketing gimmick but they are huge water wasters if you’re not on FHUs. We usually camp with only electric and once in a while E/W. You go thru water and gray tank space quickly. Ours doesn’t have a circulation feature. After our first trip with this new RV, I contacted the dealer and Keystone about getting the WH replaced with a standard tank model ….. $1400 estimate. Our only saving grace, our winter trip is almost exclusively FHUs.

[JRTJH]

Recently, many travel trailer manufacturers have moved away from propane and toward electric powered appliances. They first moved away from gas/electric refrigerators to inverter powered residential refrigerators and finally, it seems, settled on 12 volt compressor models. It takes a large battery bank to "dry camp" with an electric refrigerator, so to counter that, along comes "solar ready" and now, SolarFlex systems with lithium batteries. Now, the move to gas powered "demand water heaters" which are, with their 12 volt compressor refrigerators, great for a FHU site, but begin to become "energy wasters" when attempting to "dry camp"....

Some say, "It's a wash, demand water heaters don't use a lot of propane". But they fail to realize that a 43 gallon fresh water tank won't support the "startup hot water flow" very many times before the FW tank is empty, usually filling the gray tank in the process while occupants stand in a cold shower, waiting for warm water....

Years ago, for those who remember, the same happened with the old "propane only gravity furnace systems" that had no electric fan to blow heat into the trailer via ductwork. When forced fan furnaces first came to travel trailers, nearly everyone who owned one woke up in the morning with no lights and no water pump....

We adapted, through the years and through experience, to live with the extra electrical demands on our trailer systems.

I've got no doubt, as the "kinks" get worked out with the demand water heaters, and as we learn to accommodate their peculiar needs, we'll tend to forget the older days (right now) when they simply were not ready for RV use in travel trailers when "off the grid".

In the future, no doubt we'll tend to forget these "growing pains" with demand water heaters just like we've forgotten the "old days of huddling around the gravity furnace to get warm, because the bedroom had frost on the walls"....

Progress doesn't always mean "better as we learn to adapt"... Or maybe it's "growing pains" ??? Either way, demand water heaters aren't "perfected for RV use" just yet

[tallen]

^^^^^

well said!!!

[Mikelff]

Just another consideration. I have an Atwood 10 gal. Dual water heater. NO anode rod required. If I have a “full house” with the grand kids and need extra hot water for showers etc., I can run both electric AND propane at the same time for quicker recovery.. knock on wood, I have never run out of hot water in the last 5 years I have had this 5er. Typically I only use the electric side. If I have 5-10 minutes or so between showers or other hot water demands, my electric side keeps up with the hot water demand without having to use any propane. My Atwood heater works great!