'12 Raptor 395LEV Layout Question

[Dan Lockwood]

I'm hoping that someone here has a '12 Raptor 395LEV that can confirm or deny my concerns.

As some of you know my wife and I just purchased a new to us '12 395LEV and we love how well its been taken care of and how well it will meet our retirement travel needs.

BUT... I've always told her that the master bedroom main door is just dumb the way they have it laid out in our unit. When you walk into the bedroom the door is hinged on the left and it swings in towards the corner of the bed. It could swing with right side hinges up against the wall as there's nothing there but wall, but it doesn't.

I tell her how easy it would have been to put the door in that direction, but alas, it's not and it's going to be a REAL pain.

Then in the garage the main entry door from the living space, that's 36" wide, swing into the garage and not into the living space. When the garage is full, it could be very difficult accessing the garage area.

So last night I'm in the Keystone Archive looking through the brochure for my year and model and I see that the factory layout is exactly the way it "should be", not the way mine is built.

In the picture below I've added RED lines to show how my doors swing relative to the published factory layout. Red me, black factory brochure. If I had purchased new, I may have some recourse with the factory, but now it is what it is I guess.



There may be a simple fix for the master bedroom and that would be to just take out the door assembly and flip it around so the door hinges the same side, but now would swing into the hall way towards the living area and NOT into the bedroom at all. This would be a lot easier than trying to swap the latch etc to go the correct way, to the right and into the bedroom. Also the light switch has been mounted accordingly on the right side of the door as you enter the bedroom. So if I could swap the hinges to swing to the right and inward, it would cover up the light switch.

Any thoughts?

Anyone with a 395LEV that cares to add to my frustration or tell me theirs is correct?

Sorry for the rant and rambling. It's just frustrating that someone didn't catch this installation at the factory before shipping.

Thanks and have a great weekend.

Dan

[JRTJH]

It may not have left the factory with the doors as you describe. Many members here have posted how they "switched the dumb door location" to better fit their needs. Some of them, I scratch my head in wonder, other's make perfect sense....

Oh some "upper deck RV doors" the door hardware is directly in the middle and you can not only change from left to right, but you can sometimes invert the door to get the correct orientation (in the room/in the hallway)... Measure your door hardware and see if possibly it's the same distance from the bottom of the door to the handle and from the top of the door to the handle. If so, you may be able to turn the door "upside-down" and hang it in the correct location. Then it's just fill the 9 screw holes left by the hinges.

[Dan Lockwood]

All of the lights in these rigs are 12v, correct?

I would definitely want to move the door switch to the opposite side of the door if possible. My guess is that IF I took off the door frame to swap it around for the latch plate etc, I could just route wiring up and over the door inside the door jam framework and be good to go.

I'll check out the top/bottom to center tonight. This could be an easy 2 to 3 hour job tomorrow.

Thanks!

[JRTJH]

Often times the door hinge edge is routed so the hinge sits flush. On many RV's the factory routes the entire surface, not just where the hinge sits, so you can reverse the hinge on the door edge to switch the "hinge side of the door". You might be able to "re-hinge" the door between the garage and living space by changing the side the hinges swing and reverse the door in the plastic door jamb. Most RV doors that are routed on both edges (where the hinge sits) the extra routing space is concealed by the hinge pin, so there's no "ugly scar" from the open area where the router cut the door edge. That may also work on the upper door if the hardware isn't centered top to bottom.

[Dan Lockwood]

You've increased my work load for tomorrow quite a bit....... Thanks!

[travelin texans]

Is it possible to remove frame work & turn it around? These aren't constructed like your home so it should be only a few (depending on the guy using the gun, it could have a few hundred) wire brads holding it in place. As for the switch, all the interior walls are hollow, so you should be able to relocate the switch easy enough & cover the hole with a blank cover.

[SummitPond]

I've never understood why the door would open INTO the bedroom; this (to me) is less safe than having it open OUT. If there was a need to quickly evacuate and using the door was an option you'd have to pull it towards you and get out of the way as it swings in; it would be easier to push it out of the way as you leave.

I know it's this way (swings into the room) in S&B homes, but that doesn't mean that's the way it should be for a TT.

I like the idea of turning the frame around so the door opens into the hall.

Just my two cents.

[Cbrez]

First of all I’d like to say thanks for attaching such a clear graphic depicting the situation you’ve got. Here are some things I would consider.

For the door into the garage, I wonder how far it would open if it swung into the living area? It doesn’t look like it would open much at all with the sofa bed pulled out, but even in the dinette position do you think the door would open more than 45 deg? If not, I’d leave it as is. You could check the swing radius with a 36” straight edge. I would not expect the door swing into the garage would be an issue once you’ve set up camp.

The bedroom door is another story. First of all can you even access the bedroom thru the hallway door when the bedroom slide is closed (say at a rest stop or pull out) or do you have to snake thru the bathroom to get access? I would definitely change the door to be right-hand swinging into the bedroom. I would not change the door to swing into the hallway for two reasons; your hallway window will be covered up all day when you are camped and the bedroom and hallway bathroom door will inevitably beat each other up over time.

[Dan Lockwood]

Originally Posted by travelin texans

Is it possible to remove frame work & turn it around? These aren't constructed like your home so it should be only a few (depending on the guy using the gun, it could have a few hundred) wire brads holding it in place. As for the switch, all the interior walls are hollow, so you should be able to relocate the switch easy enough & cover the hole with a blank cover.

Danny, thanks.

Just for your information, My wife's name is Linda and I used to go by Danny.

My first wife's name is Lynda, so I can say the wrong name, but I better not miss-spell it...

Steve, you bring up some good points.

I'm going to take another look this morning at the bedroom situation and see what might be doable.

Last night quickly looking, I could flip the door upside down, they are centered to the door knob, and just re-hinge to the right side as going into the bedroom; like the layout from the brochure indicates.

But to do this I'll have the old door latch plate hole on the left side and the old four door hinge holes to contend with. The door frames are probably particle board and vinyl wrapped, as some of the film is coming loose in the top inside corner. I could probably tap into the hinge screw hole with a small ball peen hammer and then fill smooth. I could do the same for the latch plate hole. THEN, just maybe, I could find some woodgrain contact paper that matches or close enough and just lay a few pieces over the patch work.

If doing this works, I'll still have to deal with the light switch now being behind the door when swung into the bedroom. But that's not as big of deal as having to move around a door that's swing the wrong way.

And the garage door may be best to just leave as is, time will tell after we start using the RV.

"IF" I could remove the bedroom door frame and swap it around, that would be best as I could probably fish the new wiring around the inside of the door frame and relocate the switch to the correct location. I'll try to pry off some of the trim to see how easy it may come off. If easy enough, I may try to do the whole move rather than just re-hinge the door.

I can't believe that there are no other 395LEV owners chiming in on this, but they may not be online.

Thanks again everyone for the great suggestions! I'll update everyone as I move forward with this project.

Have a great weekend...

[jsmith948]

Don't know how skilled you are at wood working - but, why not ditch the cheap plastic door frame and build your own out of some nice, clear white pine? Stain it to match the trim and you're done.

[JRTJH]

Dan,

If you go to the community section of the forum and do a "member search" using the advance options, enter 395LEV in the RV model tab, you'll see that only 24 members (of the nearly 31,000 members) own that model. Of those 24, only you and one other have logged onto the forum since August 2018 and only 6 have ever posted to the forum. The other 18 have 0 posts and most have only one visit to the forum with that being prior to 2015.

So, as for "other owners chiming in". It looks like you and one other, who hasn't been on the forum since you began this thread, so he hasn't seen any of the posts.

Don't fret, all is not lost, but the volume of owners of your brand is critically limited, at least on this forum. There are some, but chances are they either are out camping, too busy to bother with the forum, have no need for help from other RV owners or have sold/traded their 395LEV.

[Dan Lockwood]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Dan,

If you go to the community section of the forum and do a "member search" using the advance options, enter 395LEV in the RV model tab, you'll see that only 24 members (of the nearly 31,000 members) own that model. Of those 24, only you and one other have logged onto the forum since August 2018 and only 6 have ever posted to the forum. The other 18 have 0 posts and most have only one visit to the forum with that being prior to 2015.

So, as for "other owners chiming in". It looks like you and one other, who hasn't been on the forum since you began this thread, so he hasn't seen any of the posts.

Don't fret, all is not lost, but the volume of owners of your brand is critically limited, at least on this forum. There are some, but chances are they either are out camping, too busy to bother with the forum, have no need for help from other RV owners or have sold/traded their 395LEV.

John, you da man! Thanks.

After my last post yesterday, I went back to YouTube and did the same 395LEV videos and guess what, they're all laid out like mine with the door swinging opposite to the factory floorplan. So from that I can assume that the change was made after the brochure was made and none are as the brochure suggests.

That is except for mine NOW!

Here are a couple pictures of my AFTER work done.





I pulled off the trim molding and with a drywall knife and some painter's tape for guidance, cut about a 1/4" of the lauan off around the door frame. This gave me a thorough to lay my recently cut up 2-wire extension cord. I slit the cord between the leads and used a small brad to drive into the door frame to retain the wiring. I did a little prying on the lauan right at the switch plate height and was able to get a drill bit into the door frame and make a groove for the cord to lay in so the lauan would then be flat and the cord in the thorough. On the NEW switch side, I used a hole saw and did the same groove method for the cord. Now the switch is in the correct location and boy does this layout work well... I cannot believe that someone thought swinging inward to the bed was a good idea.

I still have to get a wall outlet cover to cover the old switch location behind the door, but that's an easy Home Depot purchase later today.

Then I have the four hinge screw holes to deal with and the old opposite side door latch holes.

I'm hoping that I can get some filler at Lowes for wood, or worst case I just mix up some of my Bondo and fill the holes smooth. My hope is that I can find some similar contact paper to just put over the hole patches, or maybe the full length vertical of each door jam. Either way it will be much more livable for us now.

I greatly appreciate all the interest and suggestions. I've decided to leave the garage door swinging outward into the garage. After looking at it more yesterday, I think it will work better that way anyways.

I did get my Bluetooth adapter hooked up to my Sony head unit yesterday. I have a Rocket Fish Bluetooth receiver I purchased at Best Buy about a year ago that was such a great deal that I couldn't pass it up. Well it's taken me a year to use it, but it's still cheaper than today's price. I mounted the power wall wart on the 120v duplex behind the TV and screw mounted the BT receiver just under it. The only bad thing about this, and I guess I'm being to anal about this, but I was hoping that my Sony head unit had a rear AUX input, but alas, only the front 3.5mm input jack. So when using the BT as an AUX in, I have to run the cord down from under the TV and plug it into the head unit. I just like the clean look instead of the cord showing. But hey, this thing works great and I had my iPhone X over 50' away and it was still streaming XM to my liking. So that was a great half hour investment of my time.

I'm sure that I will find many other little tweaks to do or modify as needed over my tenure with this RV.

Again thanks and I'm sure I'll have many more questions as I get a chance to use it soon!

Have a great Sunday!

[Cbrez]

Dan - looks beautiful, as in better than a lot of factory work. Great job.

[wiredgeorge]

Mr. Lockwood, You asked why no other Raptor 395LEV owner chimed in... go to the COMMUNITY tab at the top of the page. Under, click on MEMBERS. Go to advanced search and you can search on your model. 24 owners out of thousands registered. You already have the second highest post count of these 24. The higher post count was a user with just over 50 posts who hasn't been active for 13 months on the forum.

Just for grins, I searched for 278 as I have a 2002 Cougar 278EFS and there were only nine owners including myself and I am the only one with a significant post count so I guess if I put out a Cougar 278EFS request for specific model info, I would be unlikely to hear from one of the other owners.

BTW: That is a BIG toy hauler! I would love to have a toy hauler 5ver but am sort of limited to just a shade over 30' due to my at-home parking space and would need an 11' garage (Goldwing trike).

[Dan Lockwood]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Mr. Lockwood, You asked why no other Raptor 395LEV owner chimed in... go to the COMMUNITY tab at the top of the page. Under, click on MEMBERS. Go to advanced search and you can search on your model. 24 owners out of thousands registered. You already have the second highest post count of these 24. The higher post count was a user with just over 50 posts who hasn't been active for 13 months on the forum.

Just for grins, I searched for 278 as I have a 2002 Cougar 278EFS and there were only nine owners including myself and I am the only one with a significant post count so I guess if I put out a Cougar 278EFS request for specific model info, I would be unlikely to hear from one of the other owners.

BTW: That is a BIG toy hauler! I would love to have a toy hauler 5ver but am sort of limited to just a shade over 30' due to my at-home parking space and would need an 11' garage (Goldwing trike).

George, thanks.

Being a true newbie on toy haulers, I have no idea what models of each brand are the most popular. Not like looking up Ford F-150's for popularity etc.

I also have no idea which of the manufacturer's models for any given year are the top of the line model. Maybe there are no top of the line models and each floorplan is the top of "that" floorplan. Again, unlike Ford F-150 XL, Lariat, etc. I do know, or think I know, that my model Raptor has all solid wood cabinets and solid surface countertops. This is supposed to be an upscale interior.

The morning before we purchased this Raptor 395LEV, we were at RV One in Ankeney IA and were looking at a Seismic with a 12' garage, rear patio deck and front patio deck off the kitchen. It was an '18 model trade in and they had the same model in a new '19 next to it. The new one listed for around $125k and they wanted $69k for the used '18. We hemmed and hawed around and finally the lady was down to $62k and I feel if we were ready to sign, may have gotten it for $60k. But it was only a 2-slide rig and the living area was cramped a bit in that regard because of the sliding doors and the front facing part deck option. While looking around inside the used one, the cabinets/doors seemed to be pressed particle type boards and probably over 50% of the cabinet doors had pulled screws in the hinges and when opened they would sag terribly. The edges of the interior doors were worn and started to fray or delaminate a bit. This was really disheartening considering the original selling price and that it was only a year old.

Granted we have no idea how many people were in the family that used it, nor how many miles or if it was a full timer home. But I do know that our 7 year old Raptor looks new inside other than a bit of slightly worn stairway carpeting. The rubber ramp bumpers look to have never been used, but we know they PO had a Harley trike, so they had to be used at some point, but very little. The toy lock under the side of the rig still has the factory padlock on the end with the keys cable tied to the lock. The generator only had 4.1 hours and it had a quarter tank of gas in the generator tank, so probably original gas. But the exhaust does not stink like old gas does, so maybe had stabilizer in the tanks. The toy gas tank was empty and maybe never had gas in it, who knows for sure.

So overall, for what we paid we could have done a LOT worse. We could have paid almost double and gotten a lesser quality "top of the line" toy hauler. For that money I would have expected an interior and build similar to a Pinnacle. No sour grapes here, we're very happy so far with the Raptor and I'm sure most of the kinks have already been sorted out.

So now it's up to Linda and I to get used to it and learn about it as much as we can before we get blind sided by something really stupid that we just weren't aware of.

Thanks again to everyone!