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11-14-2018, 02:16 PM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 5
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Opinions on Factory Defects
I have a general question and concern. Long story short I purchased my camper in Nov of last year. Stored it under cover but during one of our trips noticed the window in the bedroom was leaking while it was raining. Took it in for repair (under warranty) and over the past 2 months the repair shop has been sent 3 windows and it's now determined the cutout for the window was incorrect. Keystone wants me to choose between having the repair shop put a rubber seal in around the window to make it fit and would cause the window to stick out about an inch or to install a frameless window that will not match the rest of the windows in my camper.
I'm curious if other have experienced similar issues and how they dealt with it. I personally don't feel that either is a proper fix as I bought this camper new and I shouldn't have a "workaround" for an issue that should have never left the factory. I asked the repair shop if the frameless window was noticeable different and they said you would be able to tell. If the window didn't match or stuck out an inch at the time of purchase the purchase would not have been made.
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11-14-2018, 02:33 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: radium hot springs bc
Posts: 2,007
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If Keystone wants to change one have them change all windows to frameless. JMO
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2018 Ram 3500 6.4 Harvest Edition
2018 Cougar 27RESWE
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11-14-2018, 02:34 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Muskegon
Posts: 356
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I would ask if a slightly larger window was available. Another option which probably wouldn't work would be to insist on a different trailer. I think the larger window option has a better chance of succeeding. I wouldn't be willing to settle for what they are offering so far
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07 GMC CC LB dually LBZ, Idaho Rob EFI, DeeZee boards, 50 gal TransferFlow inbed tank
05 32' Montana Mountaineer 5th wheel 2 slides
1941 Ford cpe 454/700R4
1917 T roadster 270 Hemi/4 spd
34' car trailer w/63" semi sleeper on the front
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11-14-2018, 02:34 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,467
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Just curious, what would you have the "repair shop" do? What do you consider the reasonable remedy? Just curious.
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wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
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11-14-2018, 02:41 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 352
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Sounds about right....
Keystone put 2 different side by side refrigerators in my Outback.
I caught it during the walk through....here we are 5 months down the line and my dealer says Keystone won't replace the 17` refer unit to match the 18`?....handles are a slight different color & style.
I was told Keystone pushed out over 200 units with different year side by side refrigerators.
It's not that big of a deal, but still....seriously?!
So yea, I guess Keystone is fine with piecing a few components together....aka window, refrigerator; seems whatever they have leftover laying around in the ole warehouse, etc...
Again,... I guess just let them do the warranted >err....repair.
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11-14-2018, 06:17 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Oregon
Posts: 783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hornet28
I would ask if a slightly larger window was available. Another option which probably wouldn't work would be to insist on a different trailer. I think the larger window option has a better chance of succeeding. I wouldn't be willing to settle for what they are offering so far
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Well now... I kinda like this idea of the larger window (obviously if
there is room for enlargement)!
__________________
Jeff & Jan - Retired & Full-timing since 2013
2019 Ram Big Horn 3500 Aisin 4x4
2012 Alpine 3450-RL
Double Coin 235/75R-17.5/16 J rated 125lb
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11-14-2018, 07:10 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Muskegon
Posts: 356
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I was thinking that being it's a bedroom window it's not overly large to begin with
__________________
07 GMC CC LB dually LBZ, Idaho Rob EFI, DeeZee boards, 50 gal TransferFlow inbed tank
05 32' Montana Mountaineer 5th wheel 2 slides
1941 Ford cpe 454/700R4
1917 T roadster 270 Hemi/4 spd
34' car trailer w/63" semi sleeper on the front
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11-15-2018, 07:06 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Near Saratoga Springs,
Posts: 1,131
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A 5-6 buck tube of outdoor window and door clear silicone will usually handle this kind of problem and what the folks on another Keystone branded 5ers site have used with good resulys. This is what I'll be using on one of our windows that just recently showed a minor leak. You can also use some butyl tape(12 bucks), found at any RV store. The stuff that I bought on AMAZON for our last 5er was advertised as butyl but wasn't.
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11-15-2018, 07:12 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
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Please don't start gobbing silicone every where!! There are better sealants for the job & hopefully a better solution.
Some pictures would help if you could post them.
Maybe find a dealership that has technicians that can FIX it rather than cover it up.
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Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
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11-15-2018, 07:24 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Dandridge TN
Posts: 260
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Just off the cuff here but is there any way you can arrange with Keystone to get the unit back to them for a factory fix and install a like kind larger window?
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11-15-2018, 07:37 AM
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#11
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Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W
A 5-6 buck tube of outdoor window and door clear silicone will usually handle this kind of problem and what the folks on another Keystone branded 5ers site have used with good resulys. This is what I'll be using on one of our windows that just recently showed a minor leak. You can also use some butyl tape(12 bucks), found at any RV store. The stuff that I bought on AMAZON for our last 5er was advertised as butyl but wasn't.
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As a temporary fix before I could get my camper in for repair I tried to silicone around the window to prevent water from coming in, but it didn't stop it. The cut out in the fiberglass is bigger than than the window. This is a brand new camper with a factory defect. I feel that silicone & tape is a "workaround" not a fix.
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11-15-2018, 08:02 AM
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#12
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,997
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I find some "issues" with the OP's problem. First, the trailer sidewalls are "vacuum bonded and built in a jig" and all the window openings are "pattern cut" while in the jig, which means all of the sidewalls for that particular model are "built on the same jig and should be the same. My concern is that if his window opening is the wrong size, there are probably more that have the same condition.
Certainly, "gobbing a bunch of silicone" around a leaking window that's the wrong size for the opening is not the answer. Building a "shim" to cause the window to "butt out about an inch" is (at least for me) also unacceptable. Additionally, installing one "frameless window" that doesn't match the other windows is also not an acceptable answer.
What "should" Keystone do? Repair the window to meet the owner's expectations. Anything less is not going to solve the problem.
So, the answer is really "up to the owner and Keystone" and depends on what is acceptable to both.
Kinrow windows can be custom built (at extra expense) to fit almost any size opening. Sometimes that is done by changing the extrusion sizes, sometimes by changing the glass sizes, sometimes it requires both.
If it were my trailer, I'd expect Keystone to find a window that fits the opening and matches the other windows on the trailer. If that can't be done, then I'd expect a changeout of all windows, so they all match, or a special order window in the correct size.
Back to the first paragraph, I wonder how many other owners are facing the same problem and either don't know it yet, aren't aware there are more than just their singular issue or whether Keystone has found an acceptable repair for others with the same problem.... All questions with answers that are going to be hidden or not made available......
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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11-15-2018, 08:19 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Near Saratoga Springs,
Posts: 1,131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worjef
As a temporary fix before I could get my camper in for repair I tried to silicone around the window to prevent water from coming in, but it didn't stop it. The cut out in the fiberglass is bigger than than the window. This is a brand new camper with a factory defect. I feel that silicone & tape is a "workaround" not a fix.
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Just slobbering silicone around the edges will make a horrible mess but by removng a half dozen screws and pulling the window out then applying a silicone bead instead of the less then satisfactory closed cell foam will work. Butyl tape will also work.
But with that said, it is your RV and you have to do what's best for you --- but for my needs, pulling it to a dealer and leaving it there over and over for weeks just does not work for me when I want to use it. And it's even worse if it's being financed and you can't use it.
Good luck with Keystone and them having a vendor make one special sized window
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11-22-2018, 08:45 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 196
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I ran into the same problem with a trailer of a different manufacturer. I ended up taking all the windows off and found another that had the same problem. Since the mfr would not repair the defect I put butyl on all the windows and resealed them in the middle of the hole. That fixed it. If you are still on warranty the dealer should check every window on your trailer. FYI: The person who cut the hole for the one window probably cut the holes for the other ones, too.
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11-22-2018, 11:30 AM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Tucson
Posts: 117
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Well---Well, here we go again. In 2015 we bought a brand new Keystone, Laredo 240 mk. On the very first trip out the problems began to surface. First we found that the rfer did not work correctly. It was way too warm, about 50 degrees. Next the bench in the slide collapsed while I sat on it. We returned to the dealer and they shored up the bench, and replaced the Dometic refer. days later it was obvious that the refer wasn't working right, but we had already lost 10 days on a prepaid CG and found a way around the refer problem and reported back to Keystone that there was still a problem. After our shortened trip we took the TT to the dealer. Here they ran several test on the refer and found that Keystone had forgotten to cut the hole in the roof for the hot air behind the refer to escape. Next trip out the bench collapsed again. Turns out it was stapled together, but all the staples had been used from the top side. Had they been used on the bottom side it is possible that it would have held up. I finally removed the bench completely and bought new furniture for the slide. Than we found out that the spare wheel did not fir the lug pattern on the axle, there were leaks in the bathroom and under the kitchen sink. All of this happened inside of the first 6 months of ownership.
When I tried to get Keystone to re-imburse us for the lost food due to the refer not working, and the added expense of returning 150 miles to the dealer plus lost time at the CG we had pre-paid we were told that "sorry we don't pay for that". So as far as Keystone is concerned, I had owner 3 trailers from them: "the first, the only and the last'. If we need a new trailer I will go back to Lance which wasn't perfect either, but at least the problems got fixed at their expense not mine.
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11-22-2018, 02:30 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 329
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I am in the camp of enlarging the opening and having them install a matching larger window. Anything less would be an unacceptable fix in my opinion.
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John & Ekeen
2009 Ford F-150 5.4
2015 Nissan Armada 5.6
2021 Keystone Residence 40FLFT
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11-23-2018, 07:26 AM
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#17
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Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Arizona
Posts: 18
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I had a shattered rear Picture window on My 2014 3402RL. Covered by insurance ($1000 deductible) Keystone replaced with a framed window entire assembly even though all the other windows are frameless. They said they don't make that size assembly in frameless. No-one called me to let me know it was being done. Just found out when I picked up the unit completed. Not surprised. Just a little disappoiinted. At least there is a window in it now.
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11-23-2018, 08:40 AM
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#18
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Shingle Springs
Posts: 338
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Windows appear to be a common problem for Keystone. My 2018 1/2 Ton had both the rear fixed glass windows leak. The dealer did a pressure test and found all the windows leaked. They have literally replaced every window on the trailer. Reason.....everything from a bad batch to improper installation. I'm going with the ladder.
I wouldn't settle for anything but a correct installation and warrantied repair. My trailer has been back for warranty so many times its on the verge of qualifying as a lemon. Luckily the dealer is going the extra mile to make it right.
Good luck and lets us know the outcome.
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11-23-2018, 01:32 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Brisbane Australia
Posts: 708
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I'll also back the "larger window" fix. These windows are made to design dimensions and can be made any size to order, and are. There might even be a window for a different trailer design that is already the right dimensions. You just have to convince someone at Keystone to do a little research.
Another possibility is that the window unit itself was made wrong by the window factory and installed in a correct sized hole. As John mentioned, the window cutouts are done either by a cnc router or with a router template, so it's a hard to see how the hole would be cut wrong.
As another possibility, the window unit that was put in the hole may have been for a different floor plan and picked up by mistake or placed in the wrong stack because its dimensions were similar to the right units.
In any case there are dozens of scenerios that could account for the misfit and I think it would be easy for Keystone to give you a more acceptable fix than having a window that protrudes excessively, or a mismatching unit. Those proposals are not nearly good enough, just lazy offerings.
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11-24-2018, 06:37 AM
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#20
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,467
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The OP has not been on for six days so suspect he was just venting and had no intention of seeking advice. Will very likely never hear what happened.
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
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