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Old 09-23-2018, 06:49 PM   #1
kjohn
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Cougar 21 RBS floor giving out

Our second year for a new 21RBS. We noticed the floor getting springy this summer. The other day I noticed one spot cracking when I stepped on it. Several other spots seem awfully squishy. Anyone else had this problem? I'll be calling the dealer Monday.
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Old 09-24-2018, 06:21 AM   #2
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Hum,

So far my 2013 21RBS has not had this issue...... Interested in what you find.

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Old 09-24-2018, 06:43 AM   #3
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Our second year for a new 21RBS. We noticed the floor getting springy this summer. The other day I noticed one spot cracking when I stepped on it. Several other spots seem awfully squishy. Anyone else had this problem? I'll be calling the dealer Monday.
Where on the floor is it "springy and squishy". Any indication of water leaking?
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Old 09-26-2018, 12:36 PM   #4
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Interested in knowing what you find with your floor.

Our 2018 30RIPR has developed a real soft spot that seems to be growing after each trip out and back. Located between the center island and the entertainment area of the kitchen slide, it is about 1' by 1' wide. With my fingers I can feel what almost feels like a seam underneath the vinyl floor that is like broken off from the floor itself. Looking at videos, the wood underlayment is supposed to be one long piece without a seam but this one almost feels like a straight cut. Looking underneath, the flex is right at a floor support but can easily be pushed back up.

We will be taking it in after our camping season ends at the end of October.
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Old 09-26-2018, 12:56 PM   #5
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Where on the floor is it "springy and squishy". Any indication of water leaking?
It might be a mis-assumption, but I think a springy and squishy" floor means there IS A WATER LEAK. Fella had best take this camper to a place where they can find water leak and fix floor ASAP. OSB ain't real friendly with water.
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Old 09-26-2018, 08:56 PM   #6
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The floor is called dynaspan. It’s an 8x24’ sheet of marine grade OSB. Has a 25 year limited warranty. Limited being a key word.....if the soft spot is caused by water damage, it may not be covered. Water damage is not normally viewed as a flioor failure, it’s an owner failure for not properly maintaining the RV.
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Old 09-27-2018, 01:58 AM   #7
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Are you sure it's not the styrofoam sandwich board breaking down? Lots of reports of that happening on the forum. Just a thought.
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Old 09-27-2018, 11:34 AM   #8
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Are you sure it's not the styrofoam sandwich board breaking down? Lots of reports of that happening on the forum. Just a thought.
I think all cougars are dynaspan not laminated so no foam core to collapse. That’s more for a passport, bullet, or Outback. I’ll doible check that info
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Old 09-27-2018, 11:45 AM   #9
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I think all cougars are dynaspan not laminated so no foam core to collapse. That’s more for a passport, bullet, or Outback. I’ll doible check that info
Just verified, that is a laminated floor, so it’s veey possible the spongy feel the OP is referring to is the foam core. Knowing that, I would just verify there’s no water leaks and not be concerned if not.
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Old 09-27-2018, 01:59 PM   #10
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^^^^Where did you find the info on the floor construction for Outback's?
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Old 09-27-2018, 02:26 PM   #11
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^^^^Where did you find the info on the floor construction for Outback's?
You can download the 2017 Outback brochure at this link:
https://www.keystonerv.com/media/2258/outback-2017.pdf

Look on page 7 at items 13, 14 and 16. They illustrate the 1/4" luan floor decking (2 sheets of 1/8" luan) R-10 foam insulation and underlaid with another 1/8" luan panel. While I can't attest to whether the sheets are 4'x8' or 8'x24', the sheets are thin luan sandwiched over rigid foam construction board. References have been made repeatedly on this forum about not "stomping" on the floor, "walking heavily" on the floor and not allowing children to jump off the bunkhouse beds onto the floor.

Part of the "price we pay" for having ultra-light trailers is "lightweight construction. The Outback floor construction is simply not as durable as the older, heavier 5/8" Dyna-span flooring, which is a lighter version of the older 3/4" or even the older 7/8" flooring from years past in "heavy weight" trailers.
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Old 10-03-2018, 09:26 PM   #12
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I will be taking the trailer down to dealer when weather clears up a bit. Will post the findings when I learn them.
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Old 10-04-2018, 07:45 AM   #13
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Check exterior siding

Just a thought, I had the same issue on my Keystone 5th wheel. We seemed to be getting moisture underneath the furnace below the fridge. I initially thought that it was leaking in around the furnace vent. After removing the furnace and looking further, the entire floor beneath the cabinets, furnace, water heater, and fridge was completely rotted out. Keep in mind that this area is normally inaccessible since these items are permanently mounted. Ended up the exterior siding was incorrectly lapped and the bottom piece came over the top piece pulling all water directly inside the camper. The only thing stopping the water from the factory was the caulking on the exterior trim. Granted it took about 5 years for this problem to present itself but Keystone said tough sh*t warranty is up. Definitely a quality control issue. Good luck!
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Old 10-09-2018, 01:17 PM   #14
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I've searched for posts concerning the foam board flooring (laminated), breaking down and came up empty, do you have any links? Taking mine in this Friday for the heater service bulletin and will have them look at the floor issue. Taking it back in November so they can tear into it and see what's going on.

Scares the heck out of me as to what is wrong and how they will go about fixing it as it is in the middle of the room. I want it done right so that it last like the rest of the trailer should. I don't want this issue to come back.

My concern on mine is (it is still under 1 year and 3 year structural warranty) is that either they tear it apart (and get it back together wrong) or have to send it back to Keystone for repair (and who knows how long that may take). Not wanting a hack job on my 6 month old Premier.
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Old 10-09-2018, 01:26 PM   #15
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I've searched for posts concerning the foam board flooring (laminated), breaking down and came up empty, do you have any links? Taking mine in this Friday for the heater service bulletin and will have them look at the floor issue. Taking it back in November so they can tear into it and see what's going on.

Scares the heck out of me as to what is wrong and how they will go about fixing it as it is in the middle of the room. I want it done right so that it last like the rest of the trailer should. I don't want this issue to come back.

My concern on mine is (it is still under 1 year and 3 year structural warranty) is that either they tear it apart (and get it back together wrong) or have to send it back to Keystone for repair (and who knows how long that may take). Not wanting a hack job on my 6 month old Premier.
Sometimes you've got to have a little faith in the system... There are a couple of threads on the forum from earlier this year where members detailed how they repaired their "laminated foam floor". As for not trusting the dealer and then also not wanting it "tied up at the factory"... I don't think there's any alternative to those. Have you got any ideas on how to fix it without taking that "leap of faith" ????
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Old 10-09-2018, 01:37 PM   #16
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You're right, I've got to trust the system, and will see the Dealer's initial reaction on Friday when they say OMG or that's not a big deal and can be corrected easy enough.

Have taken the chloroplast down in that area to see what I could see and I can see it flex, and it may need additional support but also thinking that's a bandaid solution to something that can only get worse.

So time will tell
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:25 PM   #17
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We dropped our 21RBS at the dealer's this afternoon. Only thing to do is wait until they get it inside and check it. We like the trailer and are hoping it will be dealt with properly.
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Old 10-10-2018, 05:45 AM   #18
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We dropped our 21RBS at the dealer's this afternoon. Only thing to do is wait until they get it inside and check it. We like the trailer and are hoping it will be dealt with properly.
I'd suggest whatever the dealer does get it in writing, in detail.
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Old 10-10-2018, 07:36 AM   #19
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Hope you gave them a time frame to do something or you may not see it again til next summer, maybe.
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Old 10-29-2018, 01:29 PM   #20
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Floor Failure

So, we dropped our off at the dealer for Service Bulletin work for the furnace and since we had previously told them about the floor, they were going to do some preliminary look prior to contacting Keystone.

The size has grown from approximately the size of your hand to about 1 by 1 foot square where you can feel a definite break/seam/support underneath the vinyl.

We get a call from the service manage indicating he dropped the coroplast and was looking around for a broken support and didn't see anything. He then made a small opening in the Darco and said he was able to smell mold/mildew and the wood where he exposed, was able to take his finger and peal back some of the wood, indicating this is water damage. They have been in touch with Keystone, discussing with them the issue - they are now waiting on us to bring it back to them for further analysis. So far, all possibilities of how water could get to the middle of the trailer without compromising something else defies logic.

The floor is covered from the bottom and wrapped over the top with the Darco. Then the vinyl is put on the top and wrapped over the sides pretty much making the floor waterproof. However, if there is a failure in any piece of that construction and water does manage to get in, it has no way out (but it shouldn't get in right?).

I checked all roof seals, nothing. I checked slide seals - all looked good. They wondered if maybe we had driven through a lot of water, no, nothing but normal rain. They wondered if maybe tires spray could have penetrated the floor somehow but there was zero evidence of that.

Now what's the cause? Considering it is in the middle of the trailer, away from any water, the mystery deepens. The closest water is at the island sink and drains but there doesn't appear to be any leaks there nor is there any damage in that area.

As they widened their investigation, they determined that the worse area has to be the starting point of the problem and it is now wicking towards the other side of the trailer causing it to fail as well.

We had 1 more scheduled camping trip for this past weekend and we are taking it back to them this coming weekend so they can begin the tear down process to take pictures for Keystone. They have already notified Keystone of the issue and now going through the process to determine what the cause and/or fix to this problem is or will be.

As of today, the back half of the floor is very unstable with a sizeable dip of at least 1/2 to 1 inch as during their initial investigation, they discovered the whole back half was compromised. Not sure how long this process will take, at least now it's at the end of our camping season. Going to winterize it along with taking all personal items out of it, who knows how long this process will be.
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