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Old 10-21-2014, 11:02 AM   #1
Eric91Z
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New from Iowa

New here just finding these forums. After going to a recent RV show and talking to a friend that works at a local RV Dealership, my wife and I have started looking at RV's and the Keystone in particular. This will be our first travel trailer/camper setup.

Long term plans? We want to start with a decent travel trailer and tow vehicle that eventually trade the travel trailer for a Class A (when kids are all gone and out of college) and hopefully be able to tow the truck we used for the travel trailer.

Sounds great in theory, huh? We just want to do more traveling and do it without added costs of flying, car rentals, etc and offset that with camp site fees and gas. Currently six of us in the house, but down the road looking at four of us using this.

So, thinking Crew Cab truck as tow vehicle (need bed space for storage, bicycles, etc and then a travel trailer with Queen bed in one room and "Bunk House" type setup at other end with outside kitchen and grill area part of the travel trailer.

So far really liking the look of the Laredo 303TG, from online searching I have done so far. Yes, like the Outback and Sprinter models, too, but like the lighter weight ratings of the Laredo.

Given that and those that might read this post, do you think a '14+ Chevy Silverado 1500 with the 6.2L and Max Tow Package could pull a Laredo 303TG?

I ask because the truck will be my daily driver vehicle as well. So want to retain some ride comfort and amenities for daily driver use, but still have what we need to pull the travel trailer we would want. Or, should I be looking for at least newer 2500 HD with 6.0L? Yes, I know the Duramax will add longevity, more pulling power, and better gas mileage, but again, most use will be daily driver, including lovely, extremely cold Iowa winters.

Again, glad to be here and open to all helpful comments since this is our first foray in to this new endeavor!
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Old 10-21-2014, 11:47 AM   #2
hankpage
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Welcome, While you are looking for a vehicle to tow with, (and your future plans) look for a vehicle that can be towed. Many vehicles cannot be towed with all four wheels down without modifications to the transmission. It will take a rather large class A to tow a 2500 Dmax. (if it can be towed) Once you're into a MH you should consider a smaller toad. JM2˘, Hank
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Old 10-21-2014, 03:32 PM   #3
Eric91Z
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Originally Posted by hankpage View Post
Welcome, While you are looking for a vehicle to tow with, (and your future plans) look for a vehicle that can be towed. Many vehicles cannot be towed with all four wheels down without modifications to the transmission. It will take a rather large class A to tow a 2500 Dmax. (if it can be towed) Once you're into a MH you should consider a smaller toad. JM2˘, Hank
Thanks for the welcome and input! Given our plans of passing current vehicles on to our last two kids when they are ready to drive the plan would be for me to get the truck as my daily driver and is one that is enough truck to pull the TT we decide on.

Then when it is time for the wife to get her new vehicle we will look for something that can be a dinghy, but has to be 4WD/AWD for light off roading and taking the bikes to areas we will ride. But that is a ways down the road.

So for now, it is deciding what Keystone Travel Trailer we like and then have to decide how much vehicle we need and that I can drive as a daily driver...

Looking forward to learning a lot from this site.
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Old 10-21-2014, 03:34 PM   #4
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Everyone needs a plan. Take a look at the Premiers as well. A 1500 with 4-6 people plus gear plus the tongue weight of the trailer could be a bit much vs payload. Check out those numbers before you have something you are not happy with.
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Old 10-21-2014, 03:51 PM   #5
Eric91Z
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Some of the items we are thinking are must haves or would definitely like for us on the travel trailer:

- Heat and AC
- Decent insulation for hot Iowa summers or cool mountain nights
- Outside kitchen and grill
- two entry doors, including one that goes right in to bathroom/toilet
- Enough sleeping for at least 4, potentially up to 6, unless some of the kids would want to sleep outside in the Big Agnes tent...
- Decent sized interior table for family to eat at with ample seating
- Kitchen prep room
- Plenty of interior storage


Looked the Premier's just now and those look pretty nice and relatively light for the size. And nicely appointed. One of the decisions we will need to make is to we want a Bunk House style that has separate area for the kids, or larger master bedroom area and kids sleep in the "common" areas. I think that decision will end up depending on when we buy, how long we think we will keep it, and which kids are still in the house. Obviously, if the kids are out of the house, or close to being out, we will focus on a Travel Trailer suited more towards the two of us, but still with room for the kids if they want to join once out of the house...
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Old 10-21-2014, 04:45 PM   #6
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It's going to be hard to find your "must have" list in a trailer in the 20-25' range. Moving up to 27-30' there are some, but slim pickings, moving up to include your list on a variety of floorplans is going to put you in a 32-36' trailer. Travelling with 4-6 people, their gear, and camping supplies is going to pretty much put you overweight with any half ton currently produced. That means a 3/4 ton or bigger. The difference would be something you need to decide. But, I'm suggesting that you do the numbers very, VERY carefully if you're anticipating travel with 4 adult size people in a half ton truck and think you'll find that list of "Must Have" options in a trailer with a tongue weight of less than 6-700 lbs. That's all the cargo weight (trailer tongue weight) you'll have left after putting 600 lbs (4 people at 150 each) and their gear in a truck that has a payload of 1400 lbs.

Consider that if you're cutting it that "close to payload" you'll be very disappointed as your experience with the rig matures and you realize how badly you missed the mark on anticipating how much weight you'll really be carrying.

That list of "must haves" is going to put you beyond the realm of half ton towing.
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Old 10-21-2014, 05:06 PM   #7
Eric91Z
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Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
It's going to be hard to find your "must have" list in a trailer in the 20-25' range. Moving up to 27-30' there are some, but slim pickings, moving up to include your list on a variety of floorplans is going to put you in a 32-36' trailer. Travelling with 4-6 people, their gear, and camping supplies is going to pretty much put you overweight with any half ton currently produced. That means a 3/4 ton or bigger. The difference would be something you need to decide. But, I'm suggesting that you do the numbers very, VERY carefully if you're anticipating travel with 4 adult size people in a half ton truck and think you'll find that list of "Must Have" options in a trailer with a tongue weight of less than 6-700 lbs. That's all the cargo weight (trailer tongue weight) you'll have left after putting 600 lbs (4 people at 150 each) and their gear in a truck that has a payload of 1400 lbs.

Consider that if you're cutting it that "close to payload" you'll be very disappointed as your experience with the rig matures and you realize how badly you missed the mark on anticipating how much weight you'll really be carrying.

That list of "must haves" is going to put you beyond the realm of half ton towing.

See, this is why I came here and what we are slowly beginning to realize. The more we look and try to find the features we want has put us around 30' TT's. So, that would mean going towards the 3/4 ton at least which would be fine as long as we can balance the the cost of truck and travel trailer to work for us. I am a Chevy guy, so would look at 2015+ 2500 HD. Kind of disappointing though that the 6.0L gas in the 2500HD has less HP/TQ than the 5.3L in the 1/2 ton, let alone the 6.2L in the 1/2 ton. Yes, I know there is more than power that determines towing ability. But 2500HD could be livable on daily basis!
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Old 10-21-2014, 05:46 PM   #8
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As you crunch the numbers trying to find the right combination, remember this: The GCWR and the Max Trailer Weight only are capable together if the truck is empty. If you add the GVW of the truck and the Max Trailer weight, you'll see that it puts the truck in "over GCWR status". That's a part of the "truth in advertising" that all the manufacturers seem to ignore.

The only way you can tow a trailer at the "MAX TRAILER RATING" weight is if the truck is empty and the only person in the truck is the driver.

Do the math and you'll see that if you subtract the max trailer weight from the GCWR, you get the truck's empty curb weight. As you add passengers and cargo to the truck, your maximum trailer goes down significantly, usually you can subtract the truck payload from the max trailer weight to stay within the GCWR.

There's no doubt that a half ton truck has the "guts" to tow a 7000 lb trailer, it's keeping it steady in those "wonderful Iowa crosswinds" and stopping it in adverse conditions that put you in a crisis situation.
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Old 10-21-2014, 06:05 PM   #9
Eric91Z
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Thanks for that input, again, John! It is much appreciated. Definitely get that 3/4 and 1-ton vehicles have the upgraded hardware: brakes, weight, frame, shocks, springs, cooling, etc to make towing that much more enjoyable and definitely want to get the most TV we can get that still works fine as a daily driver - at least as far as TV's go.

Actually, there was a point in time in life all I wanted was a diesel dually 4x4 Crew Cab. I don't mind big vehicles at all, but the more I learn, it seems like a diesel "may" not be the best daily driver option for Iowa winters. What do you all think? After hitting lows of -40 degrees F last winter (before wind chill), just wonder how a diesel will do. And it would be parked outside pretty much 24/7 given size of vehicle like that. Pretty sure even a SRW 3/4 ton would not fit in either of our garages. But the diesel would be more enjoyable for towing with, too, for both power and gas mileage, relatively speaking. And buying one of these used, which we will be doing, keeps me looking at the DMax/Allison setup. I love the look of the Ford 3/4 and 1 tons, but the last couple diesel motor options leave much to be desired reliability wise... Not like the 7.3 used to be. The 6.0L Ford diesel really scares me! And reliability, with proper maintenance, is a must in my book.

Now, time to keep looking at the TT's to see what we really want...
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Old 10-21-2014, 08:35 PM   #10
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Choice in tow vehicles is as much a matter of brand loyalty as it is personal preference. That said, all the manufacturers build a good vehicle and they all three are really competitive when it comes to features, reliability and performance.

That being said, like you, living in upper Michigan, I'm reluctant to have a diesel as a daily driver. I'm retired, don't even drive much on a daily basis, so it's "sit and watch the fuel gel" kind of winters around here. I've got a gas F250 for our "mid size fifth wheel" (30') and it performs well. We had a smaller fifth wheel with an F150 previously and although it was "OK" there's really no comparison to towing with this truck vs the half ton.

Ford did have some significant issues with the 6.0 and the 6.4 L diesels, but seems to have hit a home run with the 6.7L that's in current production. They haven't had any significant issues surface in the 4 years of the "first era" and the same basic engine was just "performance improved" to be a stronger performer, so there's room to play with increased output in the basic engine.

Whatever you decide, any of the big three HD trucks will do you well. Happy Hunting
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Old 10-21-2014, 08:46 PM   #11
Eric91Z
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I had heard the 6.7 was much better than the 6.0 and 6.4! I prefer GM vehicles, but like Ford trucks, too. Just built a connection with the Chevy dealership which means a lot to me. But I will definitely keep my options open to end up with the most truck for the money we can afford. Not sure it makes huge difference, but truck would be driven daily, but every other week hardly enough to get up to temp in winter. Work from home on weeks I have my daughter and most I drive is to gym and back on those weeks...


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Old 10-21-2014, 10:10 PM   #12
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Speaking of diesels, any input on having one as a daily driver some place that actually gets all 4 seasons, specifically can get bitter cold winters, would appreciated. I am seeing more and more diesel car and SUV offerings from all manufacturers so they are looking more and more like viable options. So anything different in use concerns of diesel trucks vs. other diesel vehicles? Or diesel vs. gas for daily driver that will be tow vehicle, too?


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Old 10-21-2014, 11:56 PM   #13
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My last 2 trucks have been Chevy diesels. They both have been my daily drivers. I live in Michigan. I get the same weather as you. I have had zero issues with mine. I work 3rd shift. My truck sits in a wide open wind blown parking lot all night. I get out in the morning hit the remote start and it fires right up. Even last winter. It has the block heater but I have never used it. Trucks aren't like what our Grandfather's drove anymore. I have leather power heated seats, power Windows, AC. Cruise,power heated mirrors factory installed remote start, you name it. Just as comfortable as a caddilac. It will ride rough on some really bad roads. So with that in mind. Don't think your giving up comfort and some convenience because your buying a diesel truck. Oil changes are a bit pricey, but I do my own so I save a little there. I have a 4x4 you can put it in all wheel neutral, for towing. But as mentioned. It is going to take one big Class A to tow it.
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