First and LAST Keystone

[Ruffus]

Well, when it comes to Keystone RV and my dealers, Camping World in St Augustine FL, Cocoa Beach FL and Savannah GA all I can say is what Phil on Duck Dynasty would say, I'm Happy, Happy, Happy!

[gepaine]

Bob Landry,

Why is it important not to create an air trap? I think the purpose of a fresh water vent is to allow for expansion of the water in the tank, and that will happen with or without an air trap. Right?

[Bob Landry]

Originally Posted by gepaine

Bob Landry,

Why is it important not to create an air trap? I think the purpose of a fresh water vent is to allow for expansion of the water in the tank, and that will happen with or without an air trap. Right?

Because the pressure of the water displacing the air in the tank as it goes into the tank may not be strong enough to overcome the trap and the water will likely spew back at you from the fill inlet.

[gtinet]

Originally Posted by Bob Landry

That vent hose needs to be tied up or shortened so that it' a straight gravity drain. The way you are showing it to be is creating an air trap. I would start there.

Couple things... The problem isn't the location of the hose as much as the fact that they ran a screw into the side of it and put a hole in it which causes the leak. However, I agree that it needs to be shortened and/or tied up. Air trap or not it has the potential to hold water (once the hole is fixed) which could stagnate and promote bacteria growth.

Well, when it comes to Keystone RV and my dealers, Camping World in St Augustine FL, Cocoa Beach FL and Savannah GA all I can say is what Phil on Duck Dynasty would say, I'm Happy, Happy, Happy!

Phil Robertson, a man of few words and great common sense. Wish we had more like him.

[440justin]

It is important to remember rvs are built like a house, one at a time buy humans, they don't have all the automation the auto industry has to elimate issues like this. If anyone has ever had a house build you know there are always some issues at first, but a good contractor will take care of the issues. No different for our rvs, up to the dealer to make sure everything is right.

[gtinet]

Originally Posted by 440justin

It is important to remember rvs are built like a house, one at a time buy humans, they don't have all the automation the auto industry has to elimate issues like this. If anyone has ever had a house build you know there are always some issues at first, but a good contractor will take care of the issues. No different for our rvs, up to the dealer to make sure everything is right.

Good point.

Since RVs are built in a controlled environment away from the wind, sun, rain, snow, etc... you would think the quality control would be significantly better than what it is though.

[antiqfreq]

Humans build it -

Humans supervise it -

There will be Human error !

Jo

[concours]

I really don't think that Keystone is any better or worse than any other RV manufacturer, my Couger 331mks is not without its problems. Fotrunatly our dealer has a good reputation and is gradualy solving the concerns, the concerns that we have had have only shown up during camping trips and where not obvious by just looking around the trailer therefore not noticeable during the PDI. I feel that the root cause is nothing but lack of skill and care by the people building the trailer its just a paycheque to them and they do not have any thought for the people who work and save hard to purchase the RV the same goes for most munufacturers from homes to autos

[gepaine]

Originally Posted by antiqfreq

Humans build it -

Humans supervise it -

There will be Human error !

Jo

This is precisely why Keystone (and other RV manufacturer's) need a vigorous and effective quality control program!

[gmtech1]

Thats why i think the warranty should be for at least 2 years.What about the person that only uses it a couple of times a year with the family they really don't break it in for things to start breaking or not working properly.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by gepaine

This is precisely why Keystone (and other RV manufacturer's) need a vigorous and effective quality control program!

Quality control costs money. Until the cost of repairing trailers during warranty exceeds the cost of building them correctly the first time, almost all manufacturers will opt to go the "low cost route" They aren't "bad guys" but rather are a profit driven industry.

That being said, it's not just RV manufacturing that's driven this way, everything from axle bearings to washing machines are built the same way. It's understood that a certain number will fail and need to be replaced. Only when the cost of failures exceeds "profit expectations" does the manufacturer "need to change" Any business must factor in the cost of quality control. If it costs more than the competetion to build a better mousetrap, the business isn't competetive and fails at the marketplace. That's happened over and over again in our "free market socitey."

I see only one way the RV industry is going to change. That is, the consumer simply stops buying until the quality improves. Not enough of us feel that strongly about forcing change, so I don't see it happening anytime soon. Is that a "defeatist attitude" ? I think more that it's "understanding that we get what we pay for" and most of us are happy with our purchase. So, to that end, the manufacturers give us what we want, an RV that is affordable with the understanding that they will fix what we find wrong within a reasonable time. To give us a "perfect RV" every time would cost more than most of us are willing to pay, so they would sit on the lot until they were sold at a bankrupcy auction of a defunct manufacturer.

[davidjsimons]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Quality control costs money. Until the cost of repairing trailers during warranty exceeds the cost of building them correctly the first time, almost all manufacturers will opt to go the "low cost route" They aren't "bad guys" but rather are a profit driven industry.

That being said, it's not just RV manufacturing that's driven this way, everything from axle bearings to washing machines are built the same way. It's understood that a certain number will fail and need to be replaced. Only when the cost of failures exceeds "profit expectations" does the manufacturer "need to change" Any business must factor in the cost of quality control. If it costs more than the competetion to build a better mousetrap, the business isn't competetive and fails at the marketplace. That's happened over and over again in our "free market socitey."

I see only one way the RV industry is going to change. That is, the consumer simply stops buying until the quality improves. Not enough of us feel that strongly about forcing change, so I don't see it happening anytime soon. Is that a "defeatist attitude" ? I think more that it's "understanding that we get what we pay for" and most of us are happy with our purchase. So, to that end, the manufacturers give us what we want, an RV that is affordable with the understanding that they will fix what we find wrong within a reasonable time. To give us a "perfect RV" every time would cost more than most of us are willing to pay, so they would sit on the lot until they were sold at a bankrupcy auction of a defunct manufacturer.

And that pretty much sums it up.

When I bought my Cougar, I expected to have some kind of a punch list, hell we had one on an Egg Harbor, but to my surprise, those issues have been non existent with respect to my unit, except for a leaking quad ring in the tv antennae, blame Winegard. With that being said, is the fitting of the trim as good as my home? The answer to that question is no. But then again, my brother in law and myself built my home. I'm sure my brother in law could have done better finish work inside my TT, but what would I have paid for the trailer? Some things you just have to chalk up to mass production. What I can not tolerate though is a problem because somebody didn't give a hoot that I was ultimately paying on the other end. If you don't have the time to do the job right, you certainly will not have time to do it again.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by davidjsimons

And that pretty much sums it up. ... If you don't have the time to do the job right, you certainly will not have time to do it again.

Hmmm David, If I didn't know better, I'd have to "guess" that you're self employed.... <wink>

I also have little tolerance for someone who either intentionally or through carelessness just doesn't give a hoot about their work ethic. They tended to last only a very few days in my business. Those shinanaggans cost money and few (if any) business owners tolerate such workers.

I've no doubt that when those type workers come to light in management's goggles, even in the RV industry, they are gone ASAP.

[davidjsimons]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Hmmm David, If I didn't know better, I'd have to "guess" that you're self employed.... .

Indeed. I do enviromental remediation and agricultural work. Diesel and dust have been good to me so far.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk