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Old 01-21-2018, 04:12 AM   #11
Mad Cow
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Agree. dual pane windows do more for sound dampening than they do for thermal protection. They are NOT thermal windows, as they are not sealed and filled with gas between them like residential thermal windows are. Actually using something Reflectix over the window in below freezing weather will do more than dual pane windows and be far cheaper.

On that idea, lining the wall of the trailer, on the inside of the cabinets (out of sight so it is not an eyesore), with Reflectix will decrease heating demands considerably. Reflectix is a great insulator that is 2 layers of reflective barrier with a middle portion similar to micro bubble wrap sandwiched between them. Whole thing is a little over 1/4" thick. It is a good idea to line the inside of cabinets, dinette seating, etc on the sides that connect to the trailer wall. Not only is Reflectix good for cold weather, but it is a great reflective barrier insulation for hot weather also. Will reduce your A/C cycling also.

Many 'cold weather packages" that RV OEM's use include products like Reflectix in them. Many OEM's use it to line the enclosed belly of trailers. Some even will use it as supplement to ceiling insulation in their cold weather package. It is a great product. Light, easy to mold and work with, and relatively inexpensive. All major home repair stores carry the stuff.
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Old 01-21-2018, 04:19 AM   #12
Tinner12002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbarlag View Post
Dual/Thermal pane windows are not worth the increased cost for RV's. All they are good for is condensation reduction. The increase in R-value is approximately 1/10th of 1%. Not worth the huge up-charge.
Plus from my understanding, they add considerable weight to the RV also.
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Old 01-21-2018, 04:25 AM   #13
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Yeah, they can, but really only an issue if one is right on the edge of max capacity of either trailer or TV. Depending on number of windows, size, etc, maybe 100 lb. And that will be distributed. It is the inflated additional cost for them that is the problem. They are just not the greatest bang for the buck. As mentioned, they do provide a good level of sound dampening, but each person would have to determine their situation and whether the cost is worth it.
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Old 01-21-2018, 06:48 AM   #14
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Reading the OP's initial post, his question centers around the Arctic Package that's in the Springdale trailer line. Springdale is an entry level Keystone line and has never offered dual pane windows as standard equipment or as an optional feature. They simply aren't available in that trailer. He asks, "Anyone know how to tell for sure if its the arctic package and what all that includes? Also anyone have any experience with the Springdale in freezing temps?"

I owned a 2011 Springdale 242FWSS fifth wheel. There was no coroplast under the trailer. The floor consisted of poplar/whitewood 2x3 joists laid on 16" centers with a DARCO underliner, 2" of spun fiberglass insulation, the center run between the joists carried the aluminum floor heat ductwork and there was one 2" round duct from the furnace that went into the floor area immediately behind the fresh water tank. The gray tank (only one) and the black tank were exposed under the trailer and there was no heat to protect either of them. I installed 1" rigid foam sheeting under the trailer frame and covered that with coroplast. This significantly improved the insulation and was very noticeable with a significant increase in floor warmth during cool weather camping.

Honestly, with R-7 insulation in the walls, floor and ceiling of the Springdale line coupled with the extremely large single pane windows (one of the line's features is large windows to allow the light into the trailer and to make it seem "outdoors") the Springdale is really not much more than a "hardwall tent" when it comes to extremely cold weather camping. It's intended to be a "moderate weather trailer" and when you get beyond that, it doesn't perform well. Can you keep it warm inside? Yes, by using "gastly amounts of propane" and electric heat, but that's not really an affordable option for most people who are looking for an inexpensive camper that fits their limited budget. In other words, people on a budget who want to experience camping and don't have a lot of "spendable cash" to buy a Montana style $50K trailer.

Springdale is an OK trailer in the fringes of the season, but isn't designed, built or equipped for any temperatures much below freezing or over 100 for extended periods. You'll be find on cool nights but you'll probably only spend one trip with temperatures below 20F. That is, unless you've got some significant "arctic blood" in your system.
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Old 01-21-2018, 08:26 AM   #15
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The DW and I must just have that "arctic blood". We did 32 nights in ours last winter and I am up to 15 nights already the year.
Will totally agree that if you are don't have access to shore power then it gets rough on the cold nights but on shore power we find it's okay. I run a 1500w electric heater to help out the furnace and on our new years trip we only used about a tank and a half in propane (30lb tank) in 11 nights. Now if I have to run my generator, and the fridge is running on propane when I don't have shore power we certainly burn up a lot of fossil fuels.
Maybe having the three big dogs makes the difference and they are just free heat generators. Only had a couple really cold nights where we put on an extra layer but most evening we are in a pair of sweats/PJ pants and a t shirt.
My biggest cold sinks were actually the pass thru storages in the dinette slide. Cut some of the same insulation John used on his underskin for the outerdoors the help keep the cold from coming thru the doors/hatches. I use those areas for my water storage and the liquor cabinet and they seem to soak up the a ton of cold.
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Old 01-21-2018, 09:44 AM   #16
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Arctic, polar, 4 season means they installed some sort of underbelly with minimal insulation & 1 maybe 2 small ducts from the furnace aimed under there. Once it get VEEERY cold you'll have a difficult time keeping warm especially without shore power to add some extra heat sources.
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