Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone Tech Forums > Tires, Tires, Tires!
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-07-2018, 08:18 AM   #91
CWtheMan
Senior Member
 
CWtheMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Taylors, SC
Posts: 1,218
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
Because one puts tires problems behind you with either of these two tires. Lower rolling resistance, and longer thread and tire life. Chris
I should not have to remind you of this.

https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/he...res.html#tab-4

Remember, the prefix in this designated tire size, ST235/80R16, is part of its size.
__________________

__________________
An Old Navy Aircraft Mechanic that writes about tires.
Our rig. NC mountain pull-off. US-19.
http://www.irv2.com/photopost/showfull.php?photo=35007
CWtheMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 09:08 AM   #92
Snoking
Senior Member
 
Snoking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWtheMan View Post
I should not have to remind you of this.

https://www.michelinman.com/US/en/he...res.html#tab-4

Remember, the prefix in this designated tire size, ST235/80R16, is part of its size.
All these years later and you are still lobbying for the ST tire manufacturers.
__________________

__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
Snoking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 09:20 AM   #93
notanlines
Senior Member
 
notanlines's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,700
Not that CW needs any backup from me. He is, after all, "the Man." But in following his tire posts for quite some time, it seems to me that he usually just writes what the facts are as he sees them and lets the reader make their own decision. YMMV
__________________
Jim in Memphis
Wife of 46 years is Brenda
2014 F-350 6.7 Powerstroke
2017 Mobile Suites
20K Reese slider
2001 Road king w/matching Harley sidecar
notanlines is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 09:47 AM   #94
Javi
Senior Member
 
Javi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 3,284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
Because one puts tires problems behind you with either of these two tires. Lower rolling resistance, and longer thread and tire life. Chris
See, that's the thing... I ain't got no tire problems.. underweight axles... maybe... But doing it my way and replacing my tires every two years, I got no tire problems
__________________
'15 Cougar 333MKS
Plenty of truck...
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 09:48 AM   #95
Snoking
Senior Member
 
Snoking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by notanlines View Post
Not that CW needs any backup from me. He is, after all, "the Man." But in following his tire posts for quite some time, it seems to me that he usually just writes what the facts are as he sees them and lets the reader make their own decision. YMMV
Fact is most ST tires did not get the title blowmax, maypop, china bomb and/or willpop because people did not know how to use them. They have been an inferior product for years. In the last couple years is has began to change to the better with Carlisle working hard to produce a decent ST tire, Maxxis that were made in Thailand(some swear by them) and now (drum roll) the new Goodyear Endurance.

It has been a long weight with a lot of rubber left along side the road and trailers damaged.
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
Snoking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 02:22 PM   #96
flybouy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 1,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
Fact is most ST tires did not get the title blowmax, maypop, china bomb and/or willpop because people did not know how to use them. They have been an inferior product for years. In the last couple years is has began to change to the better with Carlisle working hard to produce a decent ST tire, Maxxis that were made in Thailand(some swear by them) and now (drum roll) the new Goodyear Endurance.

It has been a long weight with a lot of rubber left along side the road and trailers damaged.
I think it's a result of consumer demand. The rv industry buys the junk, then over the life of the unit the consumer will typically by a better set several times. I think it may have been Maxxis that first offered a better alternative and once their market share increased Carlisle and others followed. Good old competitive Capitalism at work!
__________________
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT SCAB long bed 4X4 6.4 Turbo Deisel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 02:31 PM   #97
Snoking
Senior Member
 
Snoking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Lake Stevens
Posts: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
I think it's a result of consumer demand. The rv industry buys the junk, then over the life of the unit the consumer will typically by a better set several times. I think it may have been Maxxis that first offered a better alternative and once their market share increased Carlisle and others followed. Good old competitive Capitalism at work!
Maxxis is still a 3 maybe 4 year tire. They dry rot and fail from time to time. Maxxis share never grew that large because they had to be special ordered in most cases.

Availability if the GY Endurance is pretty much universal across the county. Discount tire had them in stock when I junked my brand new Goodrides and sold them on CL.
__________________
2019 Laredo 225MK for travel. Bighorn 3575el summer home in Washington, Park Model with Arizona Room for winters.
Snoking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 07:25 PM   #98
rhagfo
Senior Member
 
rhagfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1,430
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWtheMan View Post
“The RV Industry Association is the national trade association representing RV manufacturers and their component parts suppliers who together build more than 98 percent of all RVs produced in the U.S., and approximately 60 percent of RVs produced worldwide.”

RVIA has mandated changes in Original Equipment (OE) tire load capacity recommendations and design upgrades that are probably already showing-up on all new RV trailer models that display their RVIA membership placard.

IMO, any RV trailer manufacturer member that wants to remain a member is going to comply with RVIAs recommendations.

The basics are very simple. All RV trailer tires larger than 13” in OD must be radial designed tires.

RVIA recommends RV trailer manufacturer’s provide a 10% load capacity reserve, above the certified GAWRs for all OE tires. That means, a RV trailer with 3500# GAWR axles must have tires that that can provide 1925# of load capacity when inflated to the trailer manufacturer’s recommended cold inflation pressures found on the vehicle certification label.

I hope anyone that has a 2018 or later model RV trailer with a RVIA placard, will challenge the validity of their OE tires, if they do not meet the new RVIA standard.

There are a lot of bias ply tires still available from wholesalers. The RVIA bias ply tire recommendations do not include replacement tires. The recommendation is not legally binding in any way. Therefore, they can still be used as replacements for any tire fitments above 13” OD. They are much less expensive than radials. For those that only travel locally and only a couple times a year, they are the most economical solution.

Remember, RVIAs recommendations are in no way binding on the RV trailer industry. There is nothing to prevent the vehicle manufacturer from just leaving the RVIA seal of approval off the trailers they manufacturer. The vehicle manufacturer is still free to use the FMVSS without any government repercussions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
There was a much easier solution in Michelin XPS Ribs or Bridgestone Duravis R250s. I ran RIBs in that configuration for 6.5 years, then a set of R250s for 4.5 years until the trailer was sold. Never a problem, seldom need tire added and I never looked back! Chris
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Which have a rating of 12,168 lbs. combined... Once again... even if I were so inclined, what would that actually accomplish... The axles are still the weak link by almost 1800 pounds and in fact what you suggest would make the rims the strongest element.. Mounting tires which have a lesser load rating solves nothing...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
Because one puts tires problems behind you with either of these two tires. Lower rolling resistance, and longer thread and tire life. Chris
I agree with Chris, I believe you don'e need XPS or 250's, just a quality LT tire of the correct size.

My current 5er has Yokohama LT 235/85-16 E's 3,042# ea. the number that Javi pointed out. Now I have 5,200# axles for an axle capacity of 10,400# that is 1,768# over axle capacity or 17%.

I just finished a rough scaling of the 5er. I weighed the TV the day before and unfortunately I did toss some extra stuff into the TV after, Maybe 50 to 100#. This gave me a pin of about 2,600# and 10,125# on the axles. Giving me a 12,725# or 365# over the listed GVWR (may need to loose some T shirts). Even at the weight I have 2,043# of unused tire capacity or 16.8% not bad at all. This on an LT tire with a built in weight reserve, I expect to get at least six years of service from these tires without worry.
__________________
Russ & Paula
The Beagles Belle and Precious.
2005 Copper Canyon 293 FWSLS 32’ GVWR 12,360
2001 Dodge 2500 5.9 CTD, 5 sp, Pacbrake, DS Power Puck, Bilstien 5100's, Just 311K.
Visit and enjoy Oregon State Parks
https://s1191.photobucket.com/albums...Smaller5th.jpg
rhagfo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 08:05 PM   #99
sourdough
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 5,538
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhagfo View Post
I agree with Chris, I believe you don'e need XPS or 250's, just a quality LT tire of the correct size.

My current 5er has Yokohama LT 235/85-16 E's 3,042# ea. the number that Javi pointed out. Now I have 5,200# axles for an axle capacity of 10,400# that is 1,768# over axle capacity or 17%.

I just finished a rough scaling of the 5er. I weighed the TV the day before and unfortunately I did toss some extra stuff into the TV after, Maybe 50 to 100#. This gave me a pin of about 2,600# and 10,125# on the axles. Giving me a 12,725# or 365# over the listed GVWR (may need to loose some T shirts). Even at the weight I have 2,043# of unused tire capacity or 16.8% not bad at all. This on an LT tire with a built in weight reserve, I expect to get at least six years of service from these tires without worry.
Russ, you are, and have been, a prolific voice for 1) LT tires vs ST tires and 2) disregarding gvw etc. I think, personally, that you mislead those that have no idea what LT, ST, gvw, gvwr mean. You tow overweight based on your perceived beliefs on whatever it is that you think is "the truth" even if it is outside the beliefs of most folks. By your measures, everything you do has performed better than anyone else that has ever towed an RV. That's spectacular , but, that isn't the case for everyone; and I, nor many other RV owners, buy into your thoughts. Your belief (I think it is you) that because you buy a tire with a higher speed rating LT tire (106 mph?) and then drive slower gives you MORE weight rating is just.....questionable at best. Please show the specs.
__________________
Danny & Susan wife of 50 years
2014 Ram 2500 6.4 4x4 CC
2014 Cougar High Country 319RLS
sourdough is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2018, 09:34 PM   #100
rhagfo
Senior Member
 
rhagfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1,430
Quote:
Originally Posted by CWtheMan View Post
“The RV Industry Association is the national trade association representing RV manufacturers and their component parts suppliers who together build more than 98 percent of all RVs produced in the U.S., and approximately 60 percent of RVs produced worldwide.”

RVIA has mandated changes in Original Equipment (OE) tire load capacity recommendations and design upgrades that are probably already showing-up on all new RV trailer models that display their RVIA membership placard.

IMO, any RV trailer manufacturer member that wants to remain a member is going to comply with RVIAs recommendations.

The basics are very simple. All RV trailer tires larger than 13” in OD must be radial designed tires.

RVIA recommends RV trailer manufacturer’s provide a 10% load capacity reserve, above the certified GAWRs for all OE tires. That means, a RV trailer with 3500# GAWR axles must have tires that that can provide 1925# of load capacity when inflated to the trailer manufacturer’s recommended cold inflation pressures found on the vehicle certification label.

I hope anyone that has a 2018 or later model RV trailer with a RVIA placard, will challenge the validity of their OE tires, if they do not meet the new RVIA standard.

There are a lot of bias ply tires still available from wholesalers. The RVIA bias ply tire recommendations do not include replacement tires. The recommendation is not legally binding in any way. Therefore, they can still be used as replacements for any tire fitments above 13” OD. They are much less expensive than radials. For those that only travel locally and only a couple times a year, they are the most economical solution.

Remember, RVIAs recommendations are in no way binding on the RV trailer industry. There is nothing to prevent the vehicle manufacturer from just leaving the RVIA seal of approval off the trailers they manufacturer. The vehicle manufacturer is still free to use the FMVSS without any government repercussions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
There was a much easier solution in Michelin XPS Ribs or Bridgestone Duravis R250s. I ran RIBs in that configuration for 6.5 years, then a set of R250s for 4.5 years until the trailer was sold. Never a problem, seldom need tire added and I never looked back! Chris
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Which have a rating of 12,168 lbs. combined... Once again... even if I were so inclined, what would that actually accomplish... The axles are still the weak link by almost 1800 pounds and in fact what you suggest would make the rims the strongest element.. Mounting tires which have a lesser load rating solves nothing...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoking View Post
Because one puts tires problems behind you with either of these two tires. Lower rolling resistance, and longer thread and tire life. Chris
Quote:
Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
Russ, you are, and have been, a prolific voice for 1) LT tires vs ST tires and 2) disregarding gvw etc. I think, personally, that you mislead those that have no idea what LT, ST, gvw, gvwr mean. You tow overweight based on your perceived beliefs on whatever it is that you think is "the truth" even if it is outside the beliefs of most folks. By your measures, everything you do has performed better than anyone else that has ever towed an RV. That's spectacular , but, that isn't the case for everyone; and I, nor many other RV owners, buy into your thoughts. Your belief (I think it is you) that because you buy a tire with a higher speed rating LT tire (106 mph?) and then drive slower gives you MORE weight rating is just.....questionable at best. Please show the specs.
I have said that because the tire is rated for 3,042# at 106, that it has a higher reserve capacity at 60 to 70 mph. I will not exceed the tire weight rating.
I will say that a tire rated for 106 mph has better heat dissipation than a tire speed rated to 65 mph.

As to towing over the GVWR of my Ram, it tows, handles, brakes well. Yes, it has a PacBrake and optional from factory 265/75-16E tires at 3,415#. It is tough to get rid of a TV that tows so well. I don't encourage others to do it, if you look back I do encourage others to tow within ratings.
I will say that I seldom encourage moving from a 2500 to a 3500 SRW, basically the same truck. I usually encourage to go with a DRW.

I just convinced my DD to buy a 2004 Ram 3500 DRW to tow a four horse with small living quarters. This is the same trailer we towed home empty 250 mile with dads 2500, it still had a 2,600# pin empty.
We are currently looking at 2003 to 2007 Ram DRW to get away from our GVWR issue.
__________________

__________________
Russ & Paula
The Beagles Belle and Precious.
2005 Copper Canyon 293 FWSLS 32’ GVWR 12,360
2001 Dodge 2500 5.9 CTD, 5 sp, Pacbrake, DS Power Puck, Bilstien 5100's, Just 311K.
Visit and enjoy Oregon State Parks
https://s1191.photobucket.com/albums...Smaller5th.jpg
rhagfo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
tires

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.