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02-12-2019, 07:22 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Alpine in after our “QC”
Took the Alipne in for our list of things that we needed addressed after our first summer with it.
Keystone approved all of them, including fixing the vinyl gouge from the bolt falling out from the dinning light. ( we will see what that ends up looking like)
Anyway, I got a call right after drop off last month That my breakaway switch was fried, and I’ve been driving around since I bought it in May with locked up brakes. Mind you I put over 5K on it this summer., brakes worked just fine.
I told them they could pull a wheel and look, but I would be doing any brake work myself.
I got a call today informing me that Keystone didn’t approve my “brake away issue” I said ok no big. I get the “it’s unsafe, yada yada yada.
They want $1550 to take off the front of the 5th wheel to trace the wires to junction box. And then take off all wheels and repack the bearing as they are sure “ they got hot” and melted all the grease in the bearings. But they said the brakes were fine after looking at them and didn’t need replaced
Am I missing something? Am I dumb and telling them to take a hike I’ll check the bearings myself and fix and fried wiring? Anyone have experience with the breakaway brake system?
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02-12-2019, 08:15 PM
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#2
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Site Team
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,356
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I haven’t worked on an alpine, but I would think the break away wiring is readily accessible from the back of the pin box. Break away is two wires, both are connected at the junction box of the umbilical cord, usually located in the pin box.
Me thinks you should wander over to your trailer (unannounced) and ask them to show you where the wiring is run.
__________________
2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.
Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
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02-12-2019, 08:26 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckster57
I haven’t worked on an alpine, but I would think the break away wiring is readily accessible from the back of the pin box. Break away is two wires, both are connected at the junction box of the umbilical cord, usually located in the pin box.
Me thinks you should wander over to your trailer (unannounced) and ask them to show you where the wiring is run.
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That’s what I thought, it should be easy just to pull through the front of trailer down to front where all the connections are.
Now I’m a bit worried that for some strange reason my trailer won’t move when I go to pick it up because brakes are magically frozen from the switch. I need to look over how they are wired so that if I need to move it I can clip a wire or move it off the battery connector.
Thanks for pointing me in right direction!
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02-12-2019, 09:08 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Muskegon
Posts: 356
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It doesn't matter which wire is the hot going in. All the switch does is break the circuit. When the pin is pulled the circuit is complete and the juice flows through and applies the brakes
__________________
07 GMC CC LB dually LBZ, Idaho Rob EFI, DeeZee boards, 50 gal TransferFlow inbed tank
05 32' Montana Mountaineer 5th wheel 2 slides
1941 Ford cpe 454/700R4
1917 T roadster 270 Hemi/4 spd
34' car trailer w/63" semi sleeper on the front
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02-12-2019, 10:31 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hornet28
It doesn't matter which wire is the hot going in. All the switch does is break the circuit. When the pin is pulled the circuit is complete and the juice flows through and applies the brakes
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Kinda has me wondering, part of what I sent in was the pin box frame (what box bolts to) had a Bend in it. It had rust on it. When I picked it up new the teather from the breakaway was damaged and wire frayed. I had an extra tether wire I keep with me and just plugged it in.
So speculating that it might have been damaged in transit and was just “wired” open so the break a way wasn’t working. I guess I’ll see what’s up. Thanks everyone
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02-13-2019, 06:22 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mountain Home, Idaho
Posts: 3,015
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If it’s a new Alpine that issue should be covered 7nder warranty work from Keystone.. I own an Alpine.. more or less the same as a Montana..
Emergency brake wire harness is visible at back side of pin box.. there is a metal junction box there...wiring runs from there down inside the the front cargo bay compartment...
DC wire to battery from break away switch runs thru same area...
And if you had been towing with all four brakes engaged I’m just certain you would have smelled something.. you would have noticed the wheel hubs and tires wa6 hotter than normal.
And if they where engaged then I’d be replacing everything on both axles related to brakes, bearings, etc...
__________________
2007 GMC Classic club cab 4x4 Duramax LBZ
2014 Alpine 3010 RE. 34 foot fifth wheel
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02-13-2019, 06:49 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Central San Joaguin Valley, CA
Posts: 2,117
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Well - I think I would have a conversation with the service manager. Either the tech/service department doesn't know what they are talking about, or they are deliberately trying to scam you.
First of all, unless the brakes were way out of adjustment, you would have felt the brakes dragging. If not under power, certainly every time you let off the throttle to come to a stop.
I would be concerned about the other issues you are having them work on. To me, it is all about trust. Once you catch them in a lie, how can you be sure that everything else they say isn't BS.
__________________
Jack & Marty
2018 Laredo 298 SRL
2011 F-250 SB Crew Cab 4x4 6.7L
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02-13-2019, 06:54 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Agree on the trust issue, I feel like they are trying to scare me and don’t realize I’ve done my own brakes, packed bearing, rewiring etc.
No smells, no tire wear, no heat. In fact an awesome poster here I forget told me to carry one of these, and I check tire and brake drum temps every time I stop .
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02-13-2019, 07:10 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsmith948
Well - I think I would have a conversation with the service manager. Either the tech/service department doesn't know what they are talking about, or they are deliberately trying to scam you.
First of all, unless the brakes were way out of adjustment, you would have felt the brakes dragging. If not under power, certainly every time you let off the throttle to come to a stop.
I would be concerned about the other issues you are having them work on. To me, it is all about trust. Once you catch them in a lie, how can you be sure that everything else they say isn't BS.
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Agree, in fact I was moving it around town one afternoon and forgot to plug it in. Man I did notice that the brake were not working. I stopped in middle of the Turn lane and figured out I forgot. There was no mistaking the brakes work. In fact we would be dead if they didn’t
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02-13-2019, 08:22 AM
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#10
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,997
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This is strictly a hypothetical cause, but have you considered that as they were moving your trailer around the lot, something hung on the breakaway cable, pulled the pin and THEY (not you) melted the breakaway switch, wiring and magnets????? Seems to me it would be difficult/next to impossible for someone (you) familiar with the way a trailer tows, to not feel the brakes dragging as they pulled it into the service department for warranty repairs.
I'd think it's likely (not 100% sure) to be a problem they caused rather than one you caused. As said, if the brakes burned up, it should be a warranty issue or a dealer caused issue, but the problem then becomes: How the heck do you prove it ?????
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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02-13-2019, 05:59 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: El Paso
Posts: 157
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JRTJH- Boy, you sure paint a scary picture that I can see in several of the dealers (whom I won't name) that we've dealt with in our short four years of ownership with our 316RL and now my in-laws Alpine 3800FK (in some ways I feel like the DW and I are co-owners, but since it's family, it's all good!). I do think that's one reason to do an "inventory" when turning it over to a dealer- but would dealer's even be willing to entertain such an inspection? In my profession such an inventory is common place when giving equipment over to a new party to prevent your hypothetical scenario.
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02-13-2019, 06:29 PM
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#12
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,695
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Fishsizzle - I think John is on point. You're knowledgeable, check temps etc. and you haven't flattened one side of your tires (as would have happened by the dealership assertion). IMO they are pulling one on you. $1500 to check some wiring??? Really??
I would take the info they gave you, grab the GM/owner and show him, have him grab the service manager and tell them we were "going to take a walk" - then go thru their little explanation. It sounds way bogus to me.
I've had my awning torn off, scrapes on the side of the trailer, bent steps, bent roof ladder, and any number of "things" happen while at the dealership that they "didn't know about". They were fixed, at times after some tenuous face offs, but they got done. I'm afraid you may be facing something like that. Good luck!
__________________
Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
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02-13-2019, 09:43 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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[QUOTE=sourdough;326541]Fishsizzle - I think John is on point. You're knowledgeable, check temps etc. and you haven't flattened one side of your tires (as would have happened by the dealership assertion). IMO they are pulling one on you. $1500 to check some wiring??? Really??
I would take the info they gave you, grab the GM/owner and show him, have him grab the service manager and tell them we were "going to take a walk" - then go thru their little explanation. It sounds way bogus to me.
I've had my awning torn off, scrapes on the side of the trailer, bent steps, bent roof ladder, and any number of "things" happen while at the dealership that they "didn't know about". They were fixed, at times after some tenuous face offs, but they got done. I'm afraid you may be facing something like that. Good luck![/QUOTE
Thanks everyone, I’ll let you all know how it goes. Being told I’ll have to sign a release now to take my trailer when they are done with the warranty work.
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02-14-2019, 05:10 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mountain Home, Idaho
Posts: 3,015
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I’d have to take my own paper work “release” and tell the dealership you sign mine and I’ll sign yours...
Had that break away box failed and been activated there is just no way you would not have known the brakes were all on..
For one thing the batteries and brake magnet wiring would have been screaming hot.
The whole ordeal sounds like the dealership screwed up and is trying to go “fishing” and make a lot of money from you...
Wishing you good luck with a successful and non stressful outcome
__________________
2007 GMC Classic club cab 4x4 Duramax LBZ
2014 Alpine 3010 RE. 34 foot fifth wheel
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02-14-2019, 06:31 AM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckS
I’d have to take my own paper work “release” and tell the dealership you sign mine and I’ll sign yours...
Had that break away box failed and been activated there is just no way you would not have known the brakes were all on..
For one thing the batteries and brake magnet wiring would have been screaming hot.
The whole ordeal sounds like the dealership screwed up and is trying to go “fishing” and make a lot of money from you...
Wishing you good luck with a successful and non stressful outcome
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I believe you are correct. Before I pick it up I’ll go in and ask to see what’s exactly going on and ask for the paperwork to run by the lawyer. Have a few that are clients
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02-14-2019, 10:21 AM
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#16
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,997
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They want YOU to sign a document before they will "allow" you to take your trailer off their lot???? I'd present them with the payment book and tell them that until they release YOUR property to you, they can make the payments !!!!!
There's just too much "that doesn't add up" with what you're being told.... Something just ain't right with this !!!!!
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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02-14-2019, 09:36 PM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH
They want YOU to sign a document before they will "allow" you to take your trailer off their lot???? I'd present them with the payment book and tell them that until they release YOUR property to you, they can make the payments !!!!!
There's just too much "that doesn't add up" with what you're being told.... Something just ain't right with this !!!!!
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Yes, they are trying to play me, I’ve been sure of that from the get go.
I won’t sign anything, I think it’s a bluff, but will find out I guess. I took it in. It worked fine for 5000+ miles, so they need to prove whatever it is they claim is wrong, didn’t happen after I dropped it off cause it worked when I dropped it off.
I can’t make this crap up! Can’t belive that they would think am dumb enough to fall for their line.
I will go and pop the grease cap on a hub and show them the grease if I have to.
Thanks guys and will update as it unfolds
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02-15-2019, 07:35 AM
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#18
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,997
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Good Luck and keep us posted. I think the majority of members are on your side and rooting for your success.
__________________
John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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02-15-2019, 11:27 AM
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#19
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Venice
Posts: 5,346
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That's one heck of a testament for you F250 ... "towed 5k with brakes on and never even knew it!" I have had some joker pull my breakaway cable while we were eating at a truck stop and let me tell you, you will notice it.
I also don't understand that they admitted that your brake shoes where fine but think the bearings were overheated. The breakaway switch applies the brakes fully and if adjusted even close to correctly ( which should have been done in dealer prep) there would be no way you could pull it. Not dissing your Ford but JM2¢, Hank
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Hank & Lynn
2007 Cougar 290RKS, E-Z Flex, 16" XPS RIBs ( SOLD .. Gonna miss her ... looking for new 5r)
2004.5 Dodge 2500 QC, LB, 5.9HO, WestTach gauges, Ride-Rite
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02-15-2019, 04:53 PM
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#20
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hankpage
That's one heck of a testament for you F250 ... "towed 5k with brakes on and never even knew it!" I have had some joker pull my breakaway cable while we were eating at a truck stop and let me tell you, you will notice it.
I also don't understand that they admitted that your brake shoes where fine but think the bearings were overheated. The breakaway switch applies the brakes fully and if adjusted even close to correctly ( which should have been done in dealer prep) there would be no way you could pull it. Not dissing your Ford but JM2¢, Hank
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Understood on the Ford. Yes they must think the turnip truck bucked me off just a few days ago.
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