Cougar 26SAB not designed for dry camping?

[JoeSparenberg]

Since half a year we travel with our Cougar 26SAB and had bad experience on dry camping. Sometimes we survive only one night, sometimes two nights, then the batteries are dead.

A Keystone dealer checked the two batteries: OK. Checked the converter: OK.
He said we must at least survive 3 up to 4 nights without any power.

We bought LED lights to save power. We bought a solar panel to increase power.

But yesterday, a neighbor told us, our 5th wheel is not designed for dry camping at all. The batteries are only to support moving the levelling jacks and the slides. He runs a generator all day.

Is this the solution? Or is there any other way without noise for hours???????

[rhagfo]

Living on batteries alone is not easy, lights need to be turned off as much as possible.

Furnace will kill in short order, to dry camp more than one night you need a generator.

[SteveC7010]

Nonsense. Your neighbor doesn't understand dry camping and battery conservation.

Something is using up the batteries. Time for a complete inventory of everything in the trailer that runs on 12vdc. Find it all and make sure you are either not using it, or using it conservatively. Your conversion to LED's alone should give you lots of run time between charges.

Critical item to check: Your refrigerator needs a little bit of 12vdc to power its propane control circuits. BUT!!!!! Some RV fridges have an anti-condensation feature which is basically a heater strip on the outer face of the frame where the magnetic flex material on the doors meets the frame. Get out your owners manual on the fridge and find out if your unit has the anti-condensation feature. If it does, find the switch and turn it off! It uses huge amounts of 12vdc.

On my previous rig, the heater strip switch was on the door frame and could only be accessed by opening the freezer door:
http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_38214_0_8744c2f38a4076503cd7bccc36dda677.jpg

Stem to stern and wall to wall, locate every light, etc. These newer rigs have lights in storage compartments. If you did not replace one with an LED and it accidentally is left on 24/7, it'll run down your battery pretty much as you describe. Same for an exterior light.

The furnace will eat battery reserve fast, too. That fan runs constantly before, during, and after the burner. Use the furnace very conservatively.

The AM/FM/DVD player uses juice 24/7, even when turned off, to power the clock, panel back light, and it's memory. I get at the inline fuses behind it and pull them.

Our Cougar has a back light on the control panel. It's a nice feature, but if you use it as a nightlight, it will help to draw the batteries down. I am going to pop the panel and see what kind of light is back there. Hopefully, it is one that can be replaced with an LED.

Your dealer is right. With dual 12vdc marine/rv deep cycle batteries, you should easily get 3 days. But understand that it does take a long time to bring them back up to peak using the on board converter/charger. Using a tow vehicle to charge the batteries takes even longer. So if your batteries are not fully recharged, they'll run down quicker. It can be a vicious cycle.

We dry camp for two weeks at a time and have done so for many years on a single battery. The state parks we camp in only allow 5 hours a day of generator time. Our Honda eu2000i is virtually silent at a distance of 20 feet or more so we run it for 2-3 hours in the afternoon and it keeps us going nicely. We can skip a day of generator time with no problem.

I just finished adding a second battery to our '11 Cougar and we're headed out for two weeks in early June. I am looking forward to using the generator less.

[Festus2]

If you have a solar panel and have changed over your lights to LED's, then something must be draining your batteries. The fridge switch that Steve mentioned in his post is a good place to start. We often dry camp and can go for days without using a generator by ensuring that our batteries don't get run down. Our solar panel does that - as long as there is a decent amount of sunshine! Two, 6v batteries, if kept up by the solar panel should last you for a couple of weeks.
If you use your water pump and furnace sensibly, that also helps as both of these draw a fair amount of amps from your batteries.
You can get by without a generator for several days providing you have a solar panel and make prudent use of things that run off your batteries.
If you are only able to make it through one day of dry camping, something in your electrical system isn't right as is your neighbor who tells you that your 5th wheel is not designed for dry camping.

[JoeSparenberg]

Many thanks for your answer! This is very helpful!!!!

One more question: We also have the Honda eu2000i. Do you charge the battery by the RV converter (AC outlet) or directly by using the DC outlet?

[JoeSparenberg]

Another question/idea: Does it make sense only to slide and level on generator power and to disconnect the batteries during this procedure?

[f6bits]

I charge my setup with the RV Converter. My DC outlet only charges at full throttle and not in eco mode. At least according to my Yamaha manual. If your trailer is somewhat new, it’ll have a three-stage converter/charger that will properly charge up a battery. I doubt that your generator has a three-stage charger.

Don’t bother disconnecting the batteries to run the slide or leveling system. Just run on generator power. That’ll be enough power via the converter *and* you’ll be topping off your batteries.

Seeing how you have a generator, you must be doing some charging. In between generator use, how long do the batteries last during the day?

I agree with the others. The furnace kills the batteries in a big hurry. We couldn't even make it three hours on our one battery during a 25 degree night.

[Festus2]

If you are going to be moving your slides in or out, raising or lowering your front jacks or your stabilizers (if electric), I would suggest plugging your 5th wheel into your truck while the truck engine is running. By doing that you are not putting any additional requirements on the RV batteries which are being given a short boost by the truck's charging system. That way, you don't need to use your generator.

[JRTJH]

We routinely "drycamp" for 5 to 7 days without need for a generator to recharge batteries. Of course, it is during the summer with no need to run the furnace. We don't use the TV, seldom use the radio (we have a separate radio we use outside that is powered by D batteries), We have 2 12V batteries, LED lighting, and most of our time is spent outside the trailer, either fishing, berry picking, mushroom hunting or just relaxing by the campfire. For us, the trailer is a place to sleep or get out of the rain on bad days. Otherwise, it's "powered down," and we're usually "someplace else" even if it's just outside, under the awning.

You should be able to dry camp for at least 2 or 3 days without need for recharging if you have dual batteries and conserve by making sure you don't have parasitic drains on your batteries.

As stated above, leave your tow vehicle connected and running while you open your slides, extend your stabilizer jacks. After you're done with the electric drains during set up, disconnect your TV and enjoy "dry camping"

[golfpro]

I don't think it's the Tt I think it is you and the lack of knowledge to conserve the batteries. If you have that much draw you can't control, then get rid of the two 12v and get two 6v batteries.

[SteveC7010]

Many thanks for your answer! This is very helpful!!!!

One more question: We also have the Honda eu2000i. Do you charge the battery by the RV converter (AC outlet) or directly by using the DC outlet?

Just plug the shore line into the gennie and let the onboard converter do its job.

[SteveC7010]

Another question/idea: Does it make sense only to slide and level on generator power and to disconnect the batteries during this procedure?

Neither. Do that with the trailer still connected to the tow vehicle with the engine running.

The converter is not strong enough to run the slides and landing gear. The batteries must be connected for this.

[f6bits]

Interesting suggestion to leave the trailer plugged into the truck when running the slide/landing gear. To protect myself against doing something stupid, my unhitching routine has me disconnecting *everything* so I don’t drive off while still partially connected.

[SAD]

Interesting suggestion to leave the trailer plugged into the truck when running the slide/landing gear. To protect myself against doing something stupid, my unhitching routine has me disconnecting *everything* so I don’t drive off while still partially connected.

I do a hybrid of this when possible...

Meaning, I lower the landing gear (enough to disconnect the truck) while connected to the truck and truck running (some don't pass energy through the 12v part of the connection unless key us on/or running)..

Once truck disconnected, I pull forward to where i want to park and then connect the power cord to shore power..

Then I finish adjusting the landing gear... Lower rear (electric) stabilizers... and then extend the slides.

[SteveC7010]

Interesting suggestion to leave the trailer plugged into the truck when running the slide/landing gear. To protect myself against doing something stupid, my unhitching routine has me disconnecting *everything* so I don’t drive off while still partially connected.

Scott, this is probably not much of a issue with a TT with a power nose jack. The fiver's use a lot more current to raise/lower the landing gear. And they are generally heavier in the nose, especially Keystones.

If you have sliders however, you might want to think about leaving the 7 way connected and TV running while you level front to rear and then run the slides out. Same for knock down and hookup

[f6bits]

I suppose with a fiver, you *can’t* unhitch unless you lower the landing gear a bit, so you’ll be plugged in to the truck anyway.

[JoeSparenberg]

I am no electrician, I am only a camper. Neither my T nor me myself or the lack of knowledge is problem. If you can tell more about the secrets of 12 V or 6 V - let me know.

[f6bits]

A pair of Trojan 105 6-Volt batteries has more amp-hours than your typical deep-cycle 12V battery combo. Trojan is really good at making these batteries, mostly for golf carts, and they have a top-notch reputation.

[smiller]

Just as an aside I don't think leaving the truck connected and running will do very much for you when operating the slide. Given the relatively small gauge and the length of the wire from the front of your truck all the way back to your battery the voltage drop would be very high with a load like a slide motor so you're not going to get a lot of current. Better than nothing maybe... but not by much.

[suza]

If you have a solar panel and have changed over your lights to LED's, then something must be draining your batteries. The fridge switch that Steve mentioned in his post is a good place to start. We often dry camp and can go for days without using a generator by ensuring that our batteries don't get run down. Our solar panel does that - as long as there is a decent amount of sunshine! Two, 6v batteries, if kept up by the solar panel should last you for a couple of weeks.
If you use your water pump and furnace sensibly, that also helps as both of these draw a fair amount of amps from your batteries.
You can get by without a generator for several days providing you have a solar panel and make prudent use of things that run off your batteries.
If you are only able to make it through one day of dry camping, something in your electrical system isn't right as is your neighbor who tells you that your 5th wheel is not designed for dry camping.

Great info, Festus2. What wattage solar panel works for you? Might, or might not work for us, since we live in Oregon and many of our Parks are shaded. How many hours of direct sunlight are necessary?

[Festus2]

Suza

I've just explained all of this in another thread. You seem to have two posts going in different threads about the same topic (dry camping and finding the best battery setup)

Please -- a single post will do fine - it avoids having our members answering the same question in two different places.

Thanks

[CBrownGetsDown]

lets not forget the old antenna booster! Woot!

[CBrownGetsDown]

I camp in my Cougar X Lite 31 SQB with one Battery a week trout fishing trip in WV for 4 days. that's 1 shower per day and the fridge on propane... shut it all down until shower time!

[theasphaltrv'er]

That's not good to hear as DW & I are fixin to get a 26SAB and we spend 95% of the time dry camping 4-5 days at a time (May-Sept). Our 07 Cougar with one group 27 has no trouble making it the 4-5 days at a time (w/ help from the 130 watt portable solar panel). Guess I better tell DW to forget the 26SAB as it won't cut it.

[PT RV`er]

Check your smoke detector and CO2 sensor. When I had my rig at the dealer getting slide toppers installed, my battery went dead. It sat in their lot for a week before I could get back to pick it up. I found the battery being dead as I have an electric tongue jack. Come to find out, the draw from your CO2 sensor and smoke detector can run down your battery. Gary at RV Connections told me this. After a short hit with a battery booster I was good to go. BTW, I highly recommend keeping a battery booster on board for emergencies.

[Bluewater]

Many thanks for your answer! This is very helpful!!!!

One more question: We also have the Honda eu2000i. Do you charge the battery by the RV converter (AC outlet) or directly by using the DC outlet?

If you plug your generator directly into the shorepower plug via an adapter it will automatically charge your batteries. I suggest you read your owners manual front to back.