Warrantee Issues

[garroum]

I bought a new Cougar Half ton a week ago. found a leak at the toilet valve and my water pump will not pressurize the system. Took it to the dealership we purchased. they checked it out and found the issues as I described. They have to submit to Keystone. The dealership stated it will be 2 to 8 weeks once they get approval. Is this standard? Why would it take 2 to 8 weeks to get parts. This is my first RV and it cant believe this is what it will take. any thoughts?

[PopBeavers]

My dealer is backed up several months. Unable to hire qualified technicians to do the work. They have a new director. Maybe he can figure out a solution.

[sourdough]

Thoughts on this;

Why wasn't the leaking valve found during the dealership PDI, or yours?

By leaking valve are we talking about the ball valve?

With a week old trailer the approval of this repair should be open and shut. Dealer submits to Keystone, Keystone should approve same day unless it is more than described, parts should be on hand and repaired next day....JMO.

In the situation you describe I have to believe that the dealer is the problem. Nothing about a toilet valve takes anything more than a couple of hours to fix. Approval, on a week old trailer is foregone. Parts should be on hand for something so common; if not, a 2 day deal to get them. Again, your dealer is the problem IMO.

I would be doing a face to face with the service manager and/or the GM or owner of the dealership on a daily basis.....but that's what I do and I'm retired:D

Note on the backup mentioned above. You have a week old trailer that should have been delivered without problems; especially the one you describe. There should be no wait-you move to the front of the line-it's a new trailer they failed to deliver in an operable condition.

[JRTJH]

I agree with sourdough. There is absolutely no reason that trailer should have ever been delivered to a customer without first checking the water system for proper function. If the dealership missed that, what else did they miss? I'd be concerned that they just sent the cleanup lady out to vacuum the floor, wipe down the counters and sent you on your way without checking the trailer properly before delivery.

As suggested, I'd be nose to nose (friendly at first, insistent and demanding if necessary) that my trailer be repaired and that it go into the service bay NEXT !!!

I'm afraid, without knowing the reputation of your selling dealership, that if you're having this kind of "brush-off" now, it's only going to get worse as time goes on, so establish your expectations with the service manager and the dealership general manager/owner now rather than later when you have "explosive frustrations" from being ignored......

[chuckster57]

These threads tend to get under my skin. First as stated, the issue should have been found before delivery. IMO the issue could as simple as a 30 cent cone washer or a 25 dollar flush valve. Either way 1/2 hr labor would fix it. They should have taken pics, fixed it and sent you on your way. It may take a day or two to get approval but customer care is more important IMO.

[24vctd]

Sourdough has it correct 2-8 weeks is a dealer problem they have checked it submitted it and now your a low priority.


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[dcg9381]

It's normal (in my experience) - any warranty repair, expect 30-45 days of the unit sitting there just to go through the inspection, approval, and process. Some of this is on Keystone. Some of it is on the dealer - as they could handle this as a "courtesy" deal - as others have indicated, a new unit should NEVER have been delivered this way. The could "sponsor" the repair, get you out the door, and then deal with Keystone for reimbursement.

Reality is that your dealer gets paid less for warranty repairs than other repairs and may not get paid at all if Keystone disagrees with the warranty assessment. The dealer is stuck in the "middle"... But in your case (1 week old camper) - IMHO, they should do better.

[RickSidebottom]

We had a similar problem with our 2018 28RKS. The pump issue did not show up in the PDI but when we towed the unit home (About 35 miles) a pre-trip inspection found that the black water tank valve would not fully close and the fresh water system developed some leaks at fittings and a crack in the pump head. It is possible that There is a bad batch of pumps that were used at the factory. I don't know for sure but I think that is a check valve the protects the pump from city water pressure from damaging the pump head.

[cpaulsen]

Had a leak from the vacuum breaker a week after I bought our 2018 Montana 330RL....called the dealer.....and they said to contact a mobile service they use. Guy came out......new vacuum breaker and all was good. He gave me the paperwork(bill) and I gave it to my dealer........all done!!

[Pull Toy]

I'm sure it didn't take them 8 weeks to get to the bank with your check.

My second step would be Good Sam and or your local TV station. They both have consumer affairs people, and access to mass media. I'm sure your dealer doesn't want a microphone in his face while he tries to justify CRA**Y customer service. Even if the dealer has to eat the bill themselves, parts and labor at their cost is minimal compared to bad publicity.

Good Luck,

[dcg9381]

I wouldn't do that. I'd go to the sales guy. The sales and service portions may be run like separate businesses, but I'd simply let the guy know (the guy that got the commission) that you find the experience unacceptable over a $25 part. Ask him to fix it with the service manager.

Keystone won't (typically) pay for "mobile" techs - my guess is the dealer did that as a courtesy to the customer..


Another suggestion is to tell the dealer to repair it "on your dime" and provide you with a refund after going through the Keystone warranty hoops...

[sourdough]

I wouldn't do that. I'd go to the sales guy. The sales and service portions may be run like separate businesses, but I'd simply let the guy know (the guy that got the commission) that you find the experience unacceptable over a $25 part. Ask him to fix it with the service manager.

Keystone won't (typically) pay for "mobile" techs - my guess is the dealer did that as a courtesy to the customer..


Another suggestion is to tell the dealer to repair it "on your dime" and provide you with a refund after going through the Keystone warranty hoops...


I disagree wholeheartedly. Don't go back to the "sales guy". They are a dime a dozen, change out every month etc. Their ability to "swing weight" within the organization, the service manager or general manager is usually zip. When I was having issues with my last RV and made myself a first name person to the GM......he didn't even know the name of the sales guy....that had been there 3 months.

The opinion I gave originally is the way to proceed IMO. Sales folks have no input or value to the service side unless they want them to. In your case it sounds as if they don't. The service manager oversees what you need done. The GM/owner oversees it all. THEY are who you need to stand face to face with and express your expectations.

I've done this many times in many different situations. You have to address it now, address it correctly to the right person and address it properly. In your case they are standing "bare a$$ed" naked in the wrong; they don't have a leg to stand on and have no recourse other than to say either "yes, we deliver inferior products" or "yes, we don't know what we are doing when we deliver a trailer to a customer" or "yes, we just wanted your money; our customers always take a back seat", either way it's stupid. Take them to task.

I will say again, on a new trailer like yours there won't be any "hoops" to go through so to speak. This issue is 100% on the dealership, again IMO.

[chuckster57]

I agree with Sourdough. Once a unit is “over the curb” he gets paid. None of our sales staff has any leeway with our service mgr. with the way RV sales are going, I bet the salesperson won’t even look back!

[travelin texans]

If talking to GM doesn't work, park your NEW rv smack dab in front of the service bays blocking the doors til its repaired while your in front of the sales doors warning everyone that walks in the kind service they can expect.

[chuckster57]

If talking to GM doesn't work, park your NEW rv smack dab in front of the service bays blocking the doors til its repaired while your in front of the sales doors warning everyone that walks in the kind service they can expect.



That won’t accomplish anything other than alienating the entire dealership IMO, and guarantee NO REPAIR.

[notanlines]

I actually like Texan's idea, but also realize that isn't the correct way to handle the situation. You've learned a hard lesson about what dealer to use, but I think that your best bet is to face the GM directly like was suggested before and cover this very business-like. If he doesn't tell you that the RV will be repaired immediately, don't make any threats or demands. Simply take to social media and to the BBB. Also go to their website and to any other RV sites they may be mentioned and tell what happened. Always give them the lowest rating possible, but don't fabricate any tales. And once this is fixed, remember who you DON'T go back to. Another thing, you should have started your original post with the name of this dealership AND the name of the general manager. Take control of your situation if you haven't already.

[dcg9381]

I agree with Sourdough. Once a unit is “over the curb” he gets paid. None of our sales staff has any leeway with our service mgr. with the way RV sales are going, I bet the salesperson won’t even look back!

I understand this, but at my dealer the sales organization and the service organization operate pretty independently... IE - asking to get my rig "first in line" actually meant less money for the service GM and needed a nudge from sales. Agree that the best option would be to ask for the favor from whomever is over both organizations, assuming that person is around.

This sort of thing sucks.. Gives dealers and Keystone a bad name. And seems to happen frequently.

[sourdough]

I understand this, but at my dealer the sales organization and the service organization operate pretty independently... IE - asking to get my rig "first in line" actually meant less money for the service GM and needed a nudge from sales. Agree that the best option would be to ask for the favor from whomever is over both organizations, assuming that person is around.

This sort of thing sucks.. Gives dealers and Keystone a bad name. And seems to happen frequently.

I guess it all goes back to the dealer in some way. I've been in dealerships where it seemed sales and service were in 2 separate, distinct silos that couldn't/wouldn't communicate and others where the service manager and sales manager were like little twins bouncing back and forth working with each other. Guess it depends on how the GM/owner wants the place to operate and with what priorities.

[tomd]

Same issue: New Keystone 5th wheel, discovered on first check-out trip Sewer Valves (black and grey) were left OPEN by dealer from "PDI". Since it was a new trailer, I was not aware position of lever was in OPEN state. Needless to say, it was a messy dump experience.
Now the valve also leaks WHEN CLOSED as well. So second dump was also a mess.
In January I asked for repair, schedule for 20 days later. STILL WAITING for authorization for troubleshooting.
1) why didn't PDI tech close the valve.
2) why didn't PDI tech find the leak in the first place.
3) why is it no response of repair after nearly 3 weeks in the shop.
Last night I wrote to keystone, will be visiting dealer (Camping World, Valencia) soon. And yes, the check for purchase is instantly cashed...
Sign me as NOT a HAPPY CAMPER!

[chuckster57]

Same issue: New Keystone 5th wheel, discovered on first check-out trip Sewer Valves (black and grey) were left OPEN by dealer from "PDI". Since it was a new trailer, I was not aware position of lever was in OPEN state. Needless to say, it was a messy dump experience.
Now the valve also leaks WHEN CLOSED as well. So second dump was also a mess.
In January I asked for repair, schedule for 20 days later. STILL WAITING for authorization for troubleshooting.
1) why didn't PDI tech close the valve.
2) why didn't PDI tech find the leak in the first place.
3) why is it no response of repair after nearly 3 weeks in the shop.
Last night I wrote to keystone, will be visiting dealer (Camping World, Valencia) soon. And yes, the check for purchase is instantly cashed...
Sign me as NOT a HAPPY CAMPER!
These are questions for your selling dealer. No one here can answer those questions since they weren’t there. What I can tell you is that not all dealers deal with the sale/delivery of a new RV the same way. When it comes to service, again not all dealers handle it the same.

Just because you dropped it off on a particular date, doesn’t mean it was looked at that day. Depending on staffing and scheduling it may sit for a period of time before anything is done. Is it right? Not in the eyes of the buyer, but there is only so many techs and bays. Our particular dealer has 3 bays and 5 techs. Call today and you’ll be scheduled for the END OF APRIL, and that’s to drop it off. It may sit for a week before being looked at.

Yeah you shouldn’t have had these issues from the start, but those are DEALER issues not Keystone issues IMO.

[sourdough]

Agree with Chuckster, Keystone has nothing to do with the issues you face - they are 100% dealer issues and you need to get in the middle of that. Wasting your time trying to write or call Keystone is just.......a waste of time.

[mark1228]

If it really is going to take 2-8 weeks to fix a toilet this time of year, there is more wrong than we all know. To be fair, I have had many items work at PDI and fail the first time out so it is possible it was not a PDI issue, but it also maybe got missed on PDI which it should not have.

Either way, there is no reason for it to take that long to fix. A good dealer would most likely have the toilet valve in stock and at my store we would have a replacement toilet in stock over 90% of the time. Even if we did not, we get parts 3 times a week. This sounds like an easy fix so there is no reason it should take this long unless there is more to the story than we know.

On edit: In my store getting the salesperson involved would be a great idea. My sales staff does not turn over very often and would bring it to my attention. However as has been mentioned, in the big stores there is a large amount of turnover and it may not help at all.

[tomd]

Well I paid the service department a surprise visit for progress report of fixing my toilet drain valve. They agreed black valve was bad; Keystone approved a valve replacement. So I called keystone to get fast shipping, they told me dealer has to place the order directly with manufacturer, and that all was approved but not expedited shipping. [My guess is order was still not placed by dealer yet either]. By the time I found my service manager, he had located the valve in the store; said it was a big project and it should be done in a week. Will see if done this week now. Time line:
2 weeks to get ok to inspect & to find bad valve; 6 days to get Keystone approval to replace it; 2 days to get a valve; 1 week to install it(maybe).

[travelin texans]

If their replacing the flush valve in the toilet, that was about an hour job the 1st time I did it, the 2nd time was faster, the 3rd time took about a hour to replace the POS toilet with a different brand.

[chuckster57]

If it’s the black tank valve, it is a bit of a chore. BTDT...Nobody wants that job. New guy always gets the next one first, rite of passage LOL

[JRTJH]

There are two members who have posted warranty problems in this thread. The OP and first poster, garroum, who identified a leaking toilet valve has not yet posted any resolution. He is followed by tomd who posted that he has the "same issue" but it appears his issue is not a leaking toilet flush valve but rather is a black tank dump valve problem.

If you post comments about a specific issue, please post which of these two members you're addressing. It's going to get very confusing if this thread goes to 5 or 6 pages of "recommendations for you to consider".... so be sure to state to whom you're making your suggestion......