2955RL information for Newbies

[Rustymax]

Hi, my wife and I are want-a-bee 5th wheelers. We will be retiring next year and have started our investigation as to the model (size/ floor plan) that will best suit our needs. So far we have seen the Montana 2011, 2955RL and like it very much. I went to the Keystone web page to find out specs for this model but did not find it listed under the Montana pull down menu. We are curious what the “55” represents in the model number description, can any one clue us in? I will not purchase a truck until I settle on what I will tow. I have a tow question for forum member that have this particular model and are willing to share the good, the bad and the ugly. The dealer said a Ram 1500 with the tow package would do just fine, because a 5er distributes the weight over the rear wheels, therefore a truck of this size can tow more that if it where towing a TT. I’m leery of what any salesman tells me; please educate me either by either forum post or PM. Thanks for any advice. Can’t wait until we can buy our RV.

Rustymax

[Sebring]

Hi Rustymax and Mrs. Rustymax....
Nice salesman, NOT...1/2 T to pull a 29+ foot 5er...hmmmm. :o/
We have a 30TRL Challenger (by Keystone) and it's actually 35' in total length if you measure from nose to back bumper and haul it with a 3/4T GMC Diesel / Allison 4x4 with the factory tow package. We did exactly what you're doing...figured out the 5er we wanted, bought it and then got the right truck for the job.
Never regretted spending the money on the truck, it just purrs along and never misses a beat, never labours...we love it. I personally get very agitated (and vocal to myself and DH) when I end up behind units that have trucks that are not suited for the size of their trailers. We found that alot of the RV salesmen we spoke to, don't RV...so take it from there. Have fun looking and deciding!

[Flyguy]

Montana 2955RL is NOT a 1/2 ton towable unit. Here's the specs:

2955RL Specifications
Shipping Weight 10337
Carrying Capacity 3378
Hitch 1715
Length 33' 3
Width 8'
Height 12' 9
Fresh Water 66
Waste Water 50
Gray Water 93

Get as far away from this dealer as you can get, run don't walk! First he tells you that it's 1/2 ton towable and then he tells you that it's a 2011. Boy oh boy.

This is a 2010 model which was the last year for the 2955 as far as I could tell. Here's the link from Keystone: http://keystone-montana.com/index.php?page=floorplans&model=2955RL&year=2010

[Festus2]

First, Welcome to the forum, Rustymax! Secondly, I went to the Keystone forum and could not find that particular model that you have been looking at. There are two types of Montana's but the 2011 2955RL wasn't listed in either model - the High Country or the Mountaineer. It could be an earlier model ---2010????
If you do a search on this forum or browse through the Towing and Tow Vehicles section, you will find numerous posts about towing with 1/2, 3/4 or 1 T trucks.
Personally, I would recommend a 3/4 T (2500) tow vehicle for that particular unit but that is one opinion of many.

(If you need help with the search, send me a PM)

[Umpie007]

Ditto to what the crew has said, this is 3/4 ton territory. I towed my Cougar with a 1/2 ton and it was upper 7,000#'s loaded up. It towed it fine but it did labor a little on the really steep stuff. A 10,000# plus rig is definitely not in your towing ability. Based on the misinformation you have gotten about the model and the towing abilities I would have to agree with the guys...turn and run, or scan the threads on this forum and go back into the dealership armed with loads of great information, and make a purchase based on your personal feelings and knowledge. Sometimes these people just want to sell you something for the commision. Remember they don't sell trucks!!

[KanTC]

The 2955RL is listed as "Dealer stock only"... that specific model # will no longer be available, and therefore isn't shown for the 2011 models.

It's shown here for 2010: http://keystone-montana.com/index.php?page=specs

The (Montana) Mountaineer 285RLD and Cougar High Country 291RLS are both nearly identical floor-plans to the Montana 2955RL, although a bit shorter in length.

Welcome to the forum, and good luck in your search.

Terri, the Chevy co-pilot [& DH Kevin] :)

[hankpage]

Do your homework ...... If you are buying new the difference between a ¾ and a 1 ton single rear wheel is minimal. The ¾ ton will handle the trailer you are looking at now with no problems but some day you might want to up-grade. If you are not towing much consider different gearing also.
JM2¢, Hank

[Jim W]

Hi and welcome to the forum.
I agree with the other posters who replied to your question. I tend to be a little conservative when it comes to safety, after being a engineer for a large equipment manufacture for 40 years. I also tend to read and study everything I can before I make a decision. If you read in the tow vehicle threads on this forum there is a question, can a F150 (1/2 ton) truck pull a 5er. I have attached that thread for you to read. http://www.keystonerv.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1999, In there I reply with my thoughts and opinion on this. Take it for what it is worth. I am also attaching the Dodge Bodybuilders. Com web site. http://www.dodge.com/bodybuilder/year.pdf
In this web site after you drill down you will find the technical information Baseweight/GCW/Payload. This will provide the correct information on what size trailer each class of vehicle will pull safely.
If you have ny questions you can PM me or ask here.
Jim W.

[Rustymax]

Wow! What great advice. I kind of thought that when the salesperson said a ½ ton would work that he was wrong. Now we’ll start investigating a ¾ ton. Any pros or cons as to either gas or diesel. We notice that diesel is about 30-40 cents more per gallon and our RVing plans will not be that of a full timer, so the truck will have to also serve duty as a part time second vehicle, making the diesel expensive to operate; any wisdom to be shared here.

After reading the replies I finally found the 2955RL on the Keystone site, it is a 2011 but its only available as dealer inventory. What a shame for us, one we like (cobalt blue decor) it will not be around when we get ready to purchase. Speaking of purchase, I went to the RV Direct web page in hope of being able to find out what a fair price would be before we started negations, but it appears they do not offer this brand/model. Any other suggestions as to best way we can prepare or gain knowledge on fair pricing.

To date we have only pop-up camping experiences. When our children were smaller, two of our closest friend also had pop-up so one summer we all spent most of the summer season at a state park. It had hot showers, and porcelain, so it wasn’t too hard to get up early and make the trek to my job. The summer went by so fast, all of the children, even now grown, married and starting families of their own, say it was their best summer of their lives and recount many of the small details when they get back in touch.

DW and I are not materially wealthy, and have waited saved for the time that we could camp in “style”, we hope avoid many of the pitfalls of newbies 5th wheelers, making our first purchase the right purchase. We will follow this forum with great interest with hope of harvesting as much of the hard earned experience/wisdom of other more seasoned RVers. Until my next post, thanks for sharing.

Mr &Mrs Rustymax

[Flyguy]

Well while I have a gas TV I can honestly say that there are definite advantages of buying a diesel 3/4 ton TV. The main advantage of course is the low end torque, typically 650 ft-lbs or more at about 1600rpm. Compare this to my Tundra which has a max torque rating of 401 ft-lbs @ 3600rpm. Because of this I have to watch how much trailer I tow. Now there's nothing wrong with this as long as I stay within the capabilities of what I have. The down side of diesels is the cost of fuel and the fuels ability to get on you every time you touch a fuel hose or have to change fuel filters. I had a 1983 Suburban diesel and although I loved the TV it was expensive for me to maintain. Next comes the batteries; with a diesel you have to turn it over fast to start it, that means that your battery must be up to the task at all times and for cold weather you need preheat plugs to get the engine warm enough to start (one diesel I had could preheat down to 0 degrees F in 3.5 seconds). Finding a good diesel mechanic can be a challenge and you'll pay extra for his services. Still, the diesel has the advantage when it comes to towing big loads and in that respect there really is no other choice. JMHO

[hankpage]

Well while I have a gas TV I can honestly say that there are definite advantages of buying a diesel 3/4 ton TV. The main advantage of course is the low end torque, typically 650 ft-lbs or more at about 1600rpm. Compare this to my Tundra which has a max torque rating of 401 ft-lbs @ 3600rpm. Because of this I have to watch how much trailer I tow. Now there's nothing wrong with this as long as I stay within the capabilities of what I have. The down side of diesels is the cost of fuel and the fuels ability to get on you every time you touch a fuel hose or have to change fuel filters. I had a 1983 Suburban diesel and although I loved the TV it was expensive for me to maintain. Next comes the batteries; with a diesel you have to turn it over fast to start it, that means that your battery must be up to the task at all times and for cold weather you need preheat plugs to get the engine warm enough to start (one diesel I had could preheat down to 0 degrees F in 3.5 seconds). Finding a good diesel mechanic can be a challenge and you'll pay extra for his services. Still, the diesel has the advantage when it comes to towing big loads and in that respect there really is no other choice. JMHO

There's nothing like the smell of Diesel in the morning. The '83 Chevy .... wasn't that a 350 gas engine that GM converted to diesel. I never plug mine in.(Unless I want to keep ice off the windshield :D ) Fires right up no matter how cold. I will change my batteries next year at 7 years old. And most of all .... What's a mechanic???? Had my last truck 10 years ... never touched the engine ... this one 6 years (knock wood) nothing but fluid and filter changes.
Except for the initial cost it is cheaper to operate a good diesel engine in the long run. (Hmmmm could this be why most fleet trucks are diesel )Even with the inflated price of fuel the mpg while towing still gives diesel an advantage.
OK ... I had my rant and I didn't even mention 3600 RPM ???(I think that is over my red-line) I'm off my soap-box now, Hank ;)

The DW wanted to say as for the smell of fuel on your hands. "Jersey Girls Don't Pump Gas" .. or diesel.

[Flyguy]

Wow! What great advice. I kind of thought that when the salesperson said a ½ ton would work that he was wrong. Now we’ll start investigating a ¾ ton. Any pros or cons as to either gas or diesel. We notice that diesel is about 30-40 cents more per gallon and our RVing plans will not be that of a full timer, so the truck will have to also serve duty as a part time second vehicle, making the diesel expensive to operate; any wisdom to be shared here.

After reading the replies I finally found the 2955RL on the Keystone site, it is a 2011 but its only available as dealer inventory. What a shame for us, one we like (cobalt blue decor) it will not be around when we get ready to purchase. Speaking of purchase, I went to the RV Direct web page in hope of being able to find out what a fair price would be before we started negations, but it appears they do not offer this brand/model. Any other suggestions as to best way we can prepare or gain knowledge on fair pricing.


DW and I are not materially wealthy, and have waited saved for the time that we could camp in “style”, we hope avoid many of the pitfalls of newbies 5th wheelers, making our first purchase the right purchase. We will follow this forum with great interest with hope of harvesting as much of the hard earned experience/wisdom of other more seasoned RVers. Until my next post, thanks for sharing.

Mr &Mrs Rustymax

The best way that I have found to determine fair pricing is to search the web and see what the lowest price is that you can find from other dealers. When you find one contact the dealer and negotiate a price or ask if the dealer still has it on his lot for you to see. If you buy be sure to do a proper PDI with the tech before writing the check. You can find a PDI form here: http://eaa1358.com/Passport/Pre-Delivery%20Inspection%20Checklist.pdf Good luck with your search.

[Jim W]

Hi,
It is an on going debate as to what is better to drive and tow with. Most people prefer a gas engine in a vehicle. This is the way we were brought up, and the vehicles were marketed that way to us. Most people think of the semi-trucks and earth moving equipment and the smelly diesel engines when you discuss diesel vehicles.
That is a thing of the past now. With the latest round of emission rules diesel engines run cleaner and have lost the diesel exhaust smell. Look at any late model truck and tell me if it is a diesel engine truck or gas engine, by the exhaust omitted? You can't.
Now with all of that being said I have pulled 5ers with a gas engine truck and a diesel engine truck. I will never pull a 5er again with a gas engine truck.... My DW and I almost killed each other when I was pulling our 5er with a gas truck. The truck was a 2001 Chevy 3/4 ton short bed with a 6.0 L engine and a 24 gallon tank. At 6 to 7 miles a gallon we were filling up about every 190 miles or so. And most of the fuel stations would not except a gas truck with a 5er attach. Could not get into the islands that well, most stations are design not for this long of a vehicle combination.
I could go on but this will become a two page post.
If you have any questions PM me and I will answer them.
Jim W.

[Rustymax]

Thank you all for sharing; there is a lot of good advice to digest. This weekend we will be attending a large RV show in Charlotte, hoping providing the opportunity to dig deeper technically into the model we like and gain more pricing insight.

I am also investigating a 3/4ton V10 Ford as a possible TV. We are real concerned about fuel prices going through the roof, especially with the contagious uprisings in the oil producing countries.

Thanks again, our investigative journey now begins.

Rustymax

[Smitty]

I purchased a diesel to tow my Cougar 327RES. Bought a 3/4 Dodge Ram 2500 with the Cummings diesel. I use it as my work vehicle and have no complaits at all. It's been below 0 degrees for most of January and February here in Upper Michigan and I've had absolutly no problem with starts. In fact my truck has the factory remote starter on it and it sits outside every night (no garage) and the remote does allow for a preheat on the plugs and it has worked and started fine every morning even without the engine heater plugged in and has quickly started everytime with all the below zero temperatures. The truck does have an engine heater but so far I have not used it. I do use the grill cover which helps it heat up faster when I am going down the road. The truck pulls my trailer great and I really like the diesel. My previous trucks have always had gas engines and I'm glad to say my first diesel is a success so far. Oil changes run me around $65.00 which is about $40.00 more than the gas ones I had but I'd gladly pay the extra $40.00 for the greater towing performance.