Bum Steering?

[COATED]

So,

I have a 04 F250 6.0 towing a Raptor 332ts (had it just a few months and love it).

Anyhow,

Even w/my prior TT I've always seem to have a little bum steering but w/a bigger trailer now I really noticed it on a long trip I took this weekend. Looking for some suggestions on what could be causing it. Obviously less noticeable at lower speeds but at 55-65mph it really becomes more noticeable and having to keep my damn truck straight and in the center of the lane I'm driving in. Really drifts left and right and I'm fighting to keep my truck center.

Anyone experience something similar and if so what is the fix?

Thanks!

[zuley]

It's fine to guess at what your problem is but none of us are qualified to diagnose something such as what you are describing without getting the vehicle on a rack and having a visual. If it was a goat I'd be suggesting your centre link. However, I'm suggesting you have a problem with your steering linkage. Needs to be looked at by a qualified technition.

[SAD]

What is "bum steering"?

[byrdr1]

500.00 fixes it. I had the same thing, it's the steering arms and the heavy bar that crosses from one side to the other. That's how mine got fixed. Hope this steers you in right direction. (No pun itended)
Randy


Randy Sent this!!

[Roller4Tan]

Too much pin weight ??? Just guessing... Is truck level when towing?

[SAD]

So,

I have a 04 F250 6.0 towing a Raptor 332ts (had it just a few months and love it).

Anyhow,

Even w/my prior TT I've always seem to have a little bum steering but w/a bigger trailer now I really noticed it on a long trip I took this weekend. Looking for some suggestions on what could be causing it. Obviously less noticeable at lower speeds but at 55-65mph it really becomes more noticeable and having to keep my damn truck straight and in the center of the lane I'm driving in. Really drifts left and right and I'm fighting to keep my truck center.

Anyone experience something similar and if so what is the fix?

Thanks!

You've used the word "bum steer" twice... Which is close to, but not actually a correct term to describe a problem. You've also described wandering.

Please take a moment to describe the symptom you're experiencing in detail.

Is it drifting wandering - requiring steering corrections - but not generally related to specific event which upsets the attitude of the suspension? Failure to easily return to on-center after turning moments..?

Or is it drastic steering corrections directly related to a specific event of attitude change in the suspension? IE, driving over the crest of rolling terrain where the suspension wants to jounce, and subsequently rebound... Where jounce causes the vehicle to want to dart one direction, and jounce causes it to want to dart to the other direction...

This will help us help you.

[hankpage]

Without even looking at your rig ... I would guess that it may have something to do with over 3200 lbs pin weight empty. That will beat the duty out of your super duty very quickly.
Or if your garage is loaded too heavy your pin weight may be too light. (but not likely)

[richf28]

The f-250 truck is very particular when it comes to steering. It only takes a minimally worn part of any area of the steering assembly and you will have your bum steering feeling. Even an alignment being out. Some years even had steering box bushing problems causing it.

[COATED]

500.00 fixes it. I had the same thing, it's the steering arms and the heavy bar that crosses from one side to the other. That's how mine got fixed. Hope this steers you in right direction. (No pun itended)
Randy


Randy Sent this!!

After doing so more research....I'm 90% sure this is what is causing it....

FYI,

'Bum (or also known as 'bump') steering' is when driving a vehicle there is a certain amount of 'play' in the steering. You have to steer the vehicle w/a more degree of difficulty trying to keep it center. The vehicle once to drift either right or left...or (in my case) both ways instead of easily controlling the vehicle in the center of the road. Not necessarily a dangerous problem...just more of a pain in the @!# problem. Hope this makes since.

The truck is for sure level (also have air bags). Not an alignment issue.

[SAABDOCTOR]

EVERYONE HERE Has given you good advice but one gave you great advice. take it a good mechanic (not the cheapo stores) have the front end confirmed and as stated your pin weight maybe too much for your truck. Air bags level they do not allow you to carry more weight then the truck is rated for.:)

[COATED]

EVERYONE HERE Has given you good advice but one gave you great advice. take it a good mechanic (not the cheapo stores) have the front end confirmed and as stated your pin weight maybe too much for your truck. Air bags level they do not allow you to carry more weight then the truck is rated for.:)

FWIW: For sure having the work done by specialty shop....was just looking for some advice/diagnosis on this forum to see if anyone has or had the same problem w/their tow vehcile...:) Not having any towing/pulling issues. My truck tow's this 5ther like a dream. WAY better than my old pull behind that I've had for the last 10 years.

[Ken / Claudia]

Since you do not say has it bum steering when empty, than the trailer would have to be thought of as a cause. I have had bum steering when the truck was overloaded in the bed and the front axle was to light. Before spending money at a shop, if handy run the combo over a scale and scale truck by itself. My truck has 200-300 lighter front axle when towing current trailer but, steering as if empty as well as all other handleing of the truck.

[GaryWT]

Could be a ton of things but my guess is not enough weight on the front end or not enough tread on the tires.

[Ken / Claudia]

Gary has a good point, over inflated front tires will cause drift and bounce add this to a light front axle and it gets worse. 2 things to check without spending money.

[tileman]

Maybe take it to the http://catscale.com/
And see what your front end axle is.

Could not hurt well worth the money spent.

[COATED]

Since you do not say has it bum steering when empty, than the trailer would have to be thought of as a cause. I have had bum steering when the truck was overloaded in the bed and the front axle was to light. Before spending money at a shop, if handy run the combo over a scale and scale truck by itself. My truck has 200-300 lighter front axle when towing current trailer but, steering as if empty as well as all other handleing of the truck.

While empty/not towing it does have same steering issues; as I mentioned in my original question. Just not as amplified when towing.

Could be a ton of things but my guess is not enough weight on the front end or not enough tread on the tires.

Brand new tires. (Hankook MT's, 10plys Load E's).

Gary has a good point, over inflated front tires will cause drift and bounce add this to a light front axle and it gets worse. 2 things to check without spending money.

60 psi all the way around. Check my tires before every trip:)

I need to figure out how to put my TV/5hter info into my sig like the rest of you folks. For now here is what I'm running w/

2004.5 Ford F250 6.0.
6" Fabtech w/Bilstine 5100's
Hankook 315/75/16's MT's Load E
Airbags
Superglide 18/20k

2014 Raptor 332ts
Brand spankin new w/Blowmax tires!

[Ken / Claudia]

Sorry, I did not read anypart of your post saying it is a problem when empty.
I think it is time to see a shop about the front end steering equipment, no matter how much weight you have or have not on the front axle, it steers bum.

[SAABDOCTOR]

DID YOU HAVE THIS PROBLEM BEFORE THE HANKOOKS? IF NOT YOU MAY HAVE A BUM TIRE(S) THEY ARE A GOOD BRAND BUT EVERY NOW AND THEN SOME BAD ONES GET OUT OF THE FACTORY. GOOD LUCK:banghead:

[COATED]

DID YOU HAVE THIS PROBLEM BEFORE THE HANKOOKS? IF NOT YOU MAY HAVE A BUM TIRE(S) THEY ARE A GOOD BRAND BUT EVERY NOW AND THEN SOME BAD ONES GET OUT OF THE FACTORY. GOOD LUCK:banghead:

I did have this problem prior to the new tires.

Let you fellas know in the next couple weeks what the fix was.

[hankpage]

With over 3200 lbs pin weight your tires are under inflated at 60 psi on an F250. Brand new M/S tires may add a little squirm to your already "bum" front end. Take it to a good front-end shop and then hit the scales with it. I think you will be surprised at how much you are over weight. :eek:

[COATED]

With over 3200 lbs pin weight your tires are under inflated at 60 psi on an F250. Brand new M/S tires may add a little squirm to your already "bum" front end. Take it to a good front-end shop and then hit the scales with it. I think you will be surprised at how much you are over weight. :eek:

Max PSI on my tires is 65 cold. Never like towing/hauling at the max. I prefer having about 5psi less than what is recommended cold.

The whole 250 vs. 350 debate. Same engine. Same breaks. I take my time and give myself lots of space. Wasn't looking to get into that debate here. I don't have any towing issues. Just a steering problem.

I appreciate all the advice.

[SAD]

Since you did not specifically reply to me... I will indulge myself....

There is no such thing as "bum steering"....

It's Bump Steer....

This is a side effect of a difference in geometry between the following:

Steering box to steering knuckle (tie rod)
AND
Opposite frame and axle (drag link)

Due to incorrect geometry, the steering angle changes for a specified amount if steering input as the suspension cycles.

You would notice this when hitting bumps or as the road changes enough to cause a suspension cycle.

Wear would not enhance this side effect as it is not related to wear... Only and specifically the differences in geometry.

However If the tie rod and drag link have excessive wear, they could cause the wandering you describe as well...

But so could poor alignment without enough caster. This is very common.

[PT RV`er]

With over Brand new M/S tires may add a little squirm to your already "bum" front end.

I noticed my front end has a little squirm to it when I first had my M/S tires installed. It slowly getting better. I run with 55/65 psi on my truck. Then I inflate accordingly when I tow my rig.

[SAABDOCTOR]

HANK ME THINKS I AGREE WITH YOU ABOUT THE OVERLOAD UNDER INFLATED WE WILL ALL SEE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN HE REPOSTS! Sorry about the caps! Watched the game last night got up way too early to go to work :bfart::cool:

[Javi]

I wouldn't put 3200 on a 1 ton SWR :D

[COATED]

I wouldn't put 3200 on a 1 ton SWR :D

Me either.

[hankpage]

Me either.

I don't understand .... that is the published hitch weight for your trailer from the factory????? Add 60lbs of propane, whatever you carry in the bedroom and the weight of your hitch and you are well over 3500 lbs.. It may tow it fine but you are killing your truck by overloading it. Good luck and travel safely, Hank

[rhagfo]

So,

I have a 04 F250 6.0 towing a Raptor 332ts (had it just a few months and love it).

Anyhow,

Even w/my prior TT I've always seem to have a little bum steering but w/a bigger trailer now I really noticed it on a long trip I took this weekend. Looking for some suggestions on what could be causing it. Obviously less noticeable at lower speeds but at 55-65mph it really becomes more noticeable and having to keep my damn truck straight and in the center of the lane I'm driving in. Really drifts left and right and I'm fighting to keep my truck center.

Anyone experience something similar and if so what is the fix?

Thanks!

#1 Your E rated tires should carry a 80# psi cold for max payload.

#2 3,200# is the listed dry weight of your Raptor.

#3 The Raptor has a dry weight, of 13,600# and a GVWR of 16,500 that is a lot for an F250, any suspension mods.

Would your "Bum steering" bother you on a road like this, at the posted limit of 55mph or a little higher?? If not get it to a shop and get it figured out.

http://www.keystoneforums.com/attachments/photobucket/img_101597_0_c8fb62dfee7c30ed3d25ae1f29ee2f6c.jpg

[hankpage]

I agree Russ but Hankook MT's, 10plys Load E's in that size do have a max of 65 psi. according to their website.

[COATED]

500.00 fixes it. I had the same thing, it's the steering arms and the heavy bar that crosses from one side to the other. That's how mine got fixed. Hope this steers you in right direction. (No pun itended)
Randy


Randy Sent this!!

Finally spent the time to get'er fixed. Bad ball joints.....and has an issue like you did w/the steering arm where it connected on the passenger side of my truck...also replace the steering stabilizer shock. Drives/tows like it should now....can steer w/my pinky....Thx!

[Ken / Claudia]

On my f350 they were shot at about 90000 as I recall. I asked the shop why and he said well 2 years pulling a 5th wheel around and carrying a artic fox camper for another few. They do wear out, just alot faster when RVing.

[cabinfever]

I have always felt Ford steering boxes tend to do this. I have driven a few different Fords pulling a race car trailer and the same trailer with a couple different Chevys. The Chevy steering box feels "tighter" than Ford.